I'm Being Pushed - And I'm Scared!

[Celestial Ceece]

Hello dimensions people - it has been a long time since you all have seen my fat butt around here, simply because I am suffering from health issues and personal issues etc. I'll get to my point though, so as not to bore whomever decides to read.

If you know me, then you know I'm a large woman and have been all my life. I'm currently 27 years old, 440 pounds, and 6'1", and disabled. Over the past five years I've developed rheumatoid arthritis in my joints, osteoarthritis in my left knee, and then I eventually herniated the L5 and SI discs in my back and have two pinched nerves related to that, causing sciatica in my leg. In addition, I have entrapted nerves in my ankles because of the rheumatoid arthritis. Recently, I've developed borderline blood pressure, and I've suffered from depression and anxiety for a long, long time.

My physical health has gotten so bad that I'm really limited in my mobility, and am pretty well housebound. I use a cane, can't really do things on my own (like shopping for instance), and require a lot of help in my life in general. I am incredibly frustrated because I am in pain all the time, and honestly, this pain makes me feel unhappy enough that I think about taking my own life often.

It seems as though every professional I see, whether they be a psychologist or a neurologist, suggests gastric bypass as the one and only option for me. I can't have surgery on my back because I'm too heavy, and I can't have surgery on my knee for the same reason, and also because I am too young. I know that my lifestyle is incredibly unhealthy, because I am unhealthy. I feel as though I don't have many choices left! I have tried to lose weight on my own unsuccessfully. I don't want to divulge the reasons for not being able to keep the weight off but limited mobility and chronic pain play a huge role (in my rolls hahaa).

Today, I saw a psychiatrist, and he suggested I talk to other folks who have had the surgery, and start researching it. I told him that I have done research, but I will start to connect with other people who have had the surgery so that I can get a better perspective on it.

My main concerns are that I have rheumatoid arthritis, which comprimises my immune system. I am on two medications for the disease that suppress my immune system. This means that when somebody comes around me with a cold, I get it. This means that I always get infections, and have a seriously difficult time fighting them off on my own. This also means that I am scared to death of getting some sort of nasty infection if I were to get my stomach bypassed. The nearest MRI that I fit in is 3.5 hours away. Couple that with the fact that I'm more than certain my Doctor thinks I am a hypochondriac...and I am sure that I will die from this. My GUT just tells me that I would be one of the people who would die from having this surgery. I also don't have the support of some of my closest family members and friends. Now of course my (formerly fat) siblings think it is a grand idea, because they realize I suffer and want to see me happy...

Has anybody else who has gone through the surgery had the same concerns? Has anybody else here had some of the same problems and issues that I have? Truly and honestly, I feel that if I don't do something about my health, including WEIGHT LOSS (gasp, :shocked: OMG OMG, a semi-sexy supersized girl wants to lose weight because it is negatively impacting her health), that I will end up in a wheelchair by the end of the year. I'm tired of NOT living my life when I'm so young. I can't live this way any longer. But I don't want to die trying to regain my life either.

Thoughts? Suggestions? HELP?

[moonvine]

Well, I can't really advise you as I have never been in your shoes - I'm 39 *gulp*, around 300 lbs, and have no health issues.

I will say that if I were to ever contemplate weight loss surgery I would definitely look into the lapband first as it seems a much better alternative to bypass *to me*.

I wish you the best of health.

[Dibaby35]

research....research...and more research is the best that I can tell you. There are many different surgeries and they all have differences in side effects and what not. Also researching put my mind more at ease when you can talk to other people going through the same thing. I wish you all the best. Personally I think you should do some kind of WLS. It's worth the risk to get your health back. I personally choose the lap-band because the risk was soo small...but I don't think I have lost quite as much as I would have with the bypass either. But..I'm still glad I went band. Anyways keep us updated with whatever you choose to do. Hope you feel better soon.

P.S. Don't ever let anyone push you into anything. The best doctors will not do this at all and will give you the best information and stay unbiased.

[ataraxia]

You are definitely in a tough spot. I think you should go for it. You know you're in for trouble as things are - but you at least have a chance if you take this risk.

(Nice to see you around again. It's odd since I just yesterday was looking at the memberlist and noticed you hadn't posted. I guess I must have summoned you :rolleyes: )

[missaf]

For what it's worth, you're posting at the right place to get both sides of the story. I can totally understand the dilemna you are in. I had some health issues related to where I lived in New England, not my weight, but it always came back to my weight. In my case, I moved, and the health problem disappeared. I know that won't solve anything for you though :(

My dad is going through something similar. He has horrible health problems due to Agent Orange exposure in Vietnam. His body is literally shutting down from exposure to this chemical, despite his best efforts fight it. He sat down with me one day and said he does not want to lose his limbs. He does not want to lose his dignity. He would rather die than suffer in pain with amputations and the degrading morale he would suffer. In his case, I support his weight loss surgery, because it's a do or die situation for him. In your case, if you choose to do so, I'd be behind you 100%, because you're facing some incredible odds to get your life back.

Because you're so prone to infection, it's a gamble, but it's a gamble for your life. Know that we are here and will support you no matter what you decide. You're still a beautiful fat woman that deserves the very best in life :)

[LillyBBBW]

I'm with Moonvine on this. If it were me I would go with the lapband. It's safer and it's adjustable. If it's too much or too little they can fix it or remove it altogether if it's not working out. Look into the lapband and a good medical facility.

I'm concerned about your depression issues though. I would strongly suggest you do something about that first before you do anything else. Are you on meds, can to tinker around a bit and find something that works for you? If you are having problems with depression and thoughts of suicide, surgery of ANY kind can make your symptoms strong enough to chew and spit in your own hand. You'll be indescribably miserable and if you don't feel you have adequate support from family/friends it could be a recipe for disaster. Talk to someone about finding something to get your depression under control first. That would be my advice.

Please don't be a stranger here. Peek in and let us know how you're doing from time to time. I'm going to be keeping you in my thoughts and prayers. :kiss2:

[Wayne_Zitkus]

Wait a minute.

They won't operate on your back because of your weight, but they WILL operate to do a gastric bypass?

Just seems odd.

I have back problems as a result of several motor vehicle accidents that have left me with four herniated discs (both lumbar and my neck). I've had a good degree of success with pain management - prescription painkillers and an occasional epidural injection. If you aren't seeing a pain management specialist, I would strongly suggest it.

[Miss Vickie]

If you know me, then you know I'm a large woman and have been all my life. I'm currently 27 years old, 440 pounds, and 6'1", and disabled. Over the past five years I've developed rheumatoid arthritis in my joints, osteoarthritis in my left knee, and then I eventually herniated the L5 and SI discs in my back and have two pinched nerves related to that, causing sciatica in my leg. In addition, I have entrapted nerves in my ankles because of the rheumatoid arthritis. Recently, I've developed borderline blood pressure, and I've suffered from depression and anxiety for a long, long time.

My physical health has gotten so bad that I'm really limited in my mobility, and am pretty well housebound. I use a cane, can't really do things on my own (like shopping for instance), and require a lot of help in my life in general. I am incredibly frustrated because I am in pain all the time, and honestly, this pain makes me feel unhappy enough that I think about taking my own life often.



I'm so sorry. My heart goes out to you. That kind of pain is just awful. It's debilitating and life sucking and... well, you know how it is 'cause you're living it. Damn. It's bad enough, the problems we have being fat, but when you add an autoimmune disease on top of it... yeah, been there, done that, hated it.

It seems as though every professional I see, whether they be a psychologist or a neurologist, suggests gastric bypass as the one and only option for me. I can't have surgery on my back because I'm too heavy, and I can't have surgery on my knee for the same reason, and also because I am too young. I know that my lifestyle is incredibly unhealthy, because I am unhealthy. I feel as though I don't have many choices left! I have tried to lose weight on my own unsuccessfully.

(sigh) Again, I feel ya. I needed to lose weight, but couldn't because I really couldn't exercise, between the weight and the condition of my joints. You get to a point where you really DON'T have a lot of options. I know that Tina does some breathing stuff and other gentle exercises; you might consider talking to her. She's done remarkably well in regaining a LOT of mobility and while she doesn't have RA, she has other issues which make exercise difficult if not nearly impossible.

As for recommending gastric bypass, yeah that happens a lot. As medical professionals we want to help and we feel as helpless as YOU do. I mean, we can't fix your back, or your other problems, but many feel that the surgery can fix many of those problems and so that's why they suggest it. Not to be mean, but to try to help in ANY way they can, no matter how desperate or potentially dangerous.

Today, I saw a psychiatrist, and he suggested I talk to other folks who have had the surgery, and start researching it. I told him that I have done research, but I will start to connect with other people who have had the surgery so that I can get a better perspective on it.

I thinking reaching out is a good option. I know that when I was relying on information passed on here, the "everbody knows that most people gain back their weight" or "you will certainly die" comments, I was given false information. However, much of the information on bariatric websites is also, if not false, very misleading. What I did was talk to as many people as I could, online and off, who have had the surgery. I read the memorial pages of people who died from it. I read memorial pages of people who died of obesity while waiting for insurance approval to get surgery. I read glowing success stories. I read horror stories. I read everything I could get my hands on. Knowing statistics is good, but they don't resonate in the same way that people's stories do. At least not for me. I talked to my nursie friends who assisted/cared for patients who had surgery, discussed the complications they saw (and by which doc in town!)

It helped me keep in perspective the horror stories and glowing success stories. I figure it's like a bell curve -- most people fall somewhere in between. There will always be people who die or are debilitated. There will always be people who drop 200 pounds effortlessly without losing a single hair or getting a single wrinkle (we hate them). And then there are the majority of us who have some complications from the surgery, and for the most part think it was a good idea (for us). Most people seem to fall into that category, where the annoyances of dumping or loose skin are well worth regaining mobility and getting off of a half dozen medications (or more). I think you'll find lots of people like that. Of course, our stories aren't as sexy as those who can wear bikinis or who end up dying, so they don't get as much airtime. But they are very real.

My main concerns are that I have rheumatoid arthritis, which comprimises my immune system. I am on two medications for the disease that suppress my immune system. This means that when somebody comes around me with a cold, I get it. This means that I always get infections, and have a seriously difficult time fighting them off on my own. This also means that I am scared to death of getting some sort of nasty infection if I were to get my stomach bypassed.

Yeah, this worries me for you as well. You should definitely talk to your rheumatologist and get his or her opinion about the surgery's potential ramifications on your RA, how to manage your condition pre-op and immediately post-op. It may be that they can switch you to another med or taper you off (I'm assuming you're on steroids?) I wasn't on anything but an inhaler and LOTS of Motrin (of course, I'd been taking Vioxx like it was candy but oh well) but I was really worried that the nutritional deficiences that I'd face would cause me to have an exacerbation of my autoimmune disease (stage I Pulmonary Sarcoidosis with joint involvement). I'm happy to say that the opposite is true, that many of the symptoms I had were actually from my weight, not from the disease itself. Clinically I still have it (according to blood tests and my latest chest x ray) but my symptoms are at least 95% better, so I have to conclude that part of the breathing trouble and joint pain was from my weight.

My GUT just tells me that I would be one of the people who would die from having this surgery. I also don't have the support of some of my closest family members and friends. Now of course my (formerly fat) siblings think it is a grand idea, because they realize I suffer and want to see me happy...

If your gut tells you that -- not just the natural fear of surgery that we ALL have -- then I say listen to it. Honor it. Talking to a therapist about your feelings about your weight, the surgery, your fears, etc would be a good idea. Certainly you're at high risk for the surgery because of your mobility problems and the medications you're on. It's a risky surgery anyway, and you're higher risk than some because of your difficulties in getting around (pulmonary emboli would be a concern, but it is a risk that can be handled well with blood thinners, epidurals for pain to cut catecholamines, the placement of vena cava filters which "trap" any errant clots before they reach vital organs, and sequential compression devices). Infections can hpapen in hospitals, but they can be treated the vast majority of time with antibiotics (and in fact most of us get at least a dose of a broad spectrum antibiotic in the OR anyway). Everybody should definitely choose their surgeon carefully but if you DO opt for this, your best hope for a good outcome is the best doctor you can find with the most experience and who's willing to work with your other doctors regarding your other medical problems.

Truly and honestly, I feel that if I don't do something about my health, including WEIGHT LOSS (gasp, :shocked: OMG OMG, a semi-sexy supersized girl wants to lose weight because it is negatively impacting her health), that I will end up in a wheelchair by the end of the year. I'm tired of NOT living my life when I'm so young. I can't live this way any longer. But I don't want to die trying to regain my life either.

I felt just as you did, except that I'm an old lady and didn't want to spend my 40's feeling like I was 90, a place I was rapidly approaching. ;) I'd spent aout $25k on a nursing career that I was going to end up pissing away if I didn't address my mobility problems post haste. It's a tough call, darlin', one only YOU can make. I'd recommend talking to as many people as you can, and then giving yourself some quite space and time to really look at what you feel is right. I was sure that I was going to die, although I think it wasn't my gut so much as my fear (and being a nurse I know better than most what can go horribly wrong - even in low risk patients doing low risk procedures). But the way I looked at it is that if April 17, 2005 was my day to die, then it wouldn't matter whether I was on an OR table or in line at the bank or at home. It would be my time to go, but at least I would have tried to improve my life even though the idea of leaving small children -- having been orphaned myself at 12 -- was scary and awful. But that's what falls in with MY belief system. I figured, if I'd truly exhausted all of my resources (I had, including prescribed diet drugs), then what choice did I have but to either a) do something drastic that could kill me outright or even within months or years, or b) watch myself die a little bit each day. It was terrifying, but it was the right decision for ME. The right decision for YOU may be very different.

Please let me know how I can support you. I'm happy to share whatever information you like (personal or professional), I'm happy to listen, I'll even cry with you and curse the fates at how unfair this whole bloody mess is. In short, whatever support you need that I can give from far flung Alaska, you got it.

In the meantime, here are my stats, in the interest of full disclosure.

Preop: Highest weight 314 (or is it 317? can't remember), 5'2"(and a smidge). Stage I pulmonary Sarcoidosis. Hypertension, hyperlipidemia, hyperinsulinemia. Taking Vioxx, and antidepressants, and meds for the above conditions. Had stress incontinence. Plantar fasciitis. Reactive airway disease. Anemia. Family history of cancer, diabetes and heart disease. Yeast infections in skin folds. Tortuous varicosities on both legs. Crazy gynecological bleeding. Ovarian cysts (but not PCOS). Calcium imbalance from the autoimmune disease.

The only system working well for me was my GI system -- no gastric reflux, no constipation, I basically have a cast iron stomach. Oh and no sleep apnea, either. I ate a healthy diet of about 1400 calories a day but could not exercise due to my conditions, and my weight had gone from creeping up to sprinting up, from an hourglass to an apple shape (which is the highest risk for early death).

Surgery: April 17, 2005. Open RnY, proximal (meaning less intestine bypassed). Epidural placed preoperatively for pain control afterward (which cuts down the hormone catecholamines that contribute to blood clots and then pulmonary emboli which can be deadly). During induction (when they put you to sleep), my sats dropped to the 40's (a percentage of blood oxygenated at your extremities which SHOULD be over 90%), probably because of the weight of my tummy fat on my lungs. They put me in reverse trendelenberg (head up, feet down) and I resolved. The surgery continued. Postop no complications, was able to tolerate ice chips, then water, then clears, and I was discharged in 3 days. Was on soft diet by the end of the week (I had cravings for tunafish), and regular foods within a month.

Postop:

Today: 199.5 pounds (finally broke the 200 mark, but tomorrow I may have crept back up again). Blood lipids, normal. Blood pressure, normal. Calcium imbalance -- still there. Anemia -- still there. Crazy gynecological bleeding -- still there but hopefully gone with the ablation I had last week. Breathing problems -- virtually gone. Joint problems? Virtually gone. Ovarian cysts? Come and go. Insulin levels? Normal. No antidepressants. Very rarely a motrin (which I'm not supposed to take anyway). Stress incontinence? Gone. Varicose veins? Still there, and more noticable since there's less fat cushioning them. I'm working out now, up to about 40 minutes of cardio and weight training several times a week. I do have some loose skin, but it's something I can live with for now. I'm ambivalent about plastic surgery.

Complications? A small hernia right below my sternum. Not painful, just feels weird, like an alien baby poking its head out. Of course, I already had had at least two hernias that we know of when I was 300 pounds, but this one is along the incisional line so it's probably from the surgery; it's a risk from having the surgery "open" rather than laparoscopically. Um. I can't eat Top Ramen -- it makes me vomit, and I have no idea why or even worse, why I still crave it. I can eat chocolate, cookies, ice cream, beer and wine (in small amounts and I get looped quickly), sushi, and everything else I love including steak, chicken, hamburger and pasta, but in small amounts.

I'm not constipated, I don't have diarrhea, I don't vomit (or haven't for many months, once I learned to eat more often and not eat too quickly). If you saw me in a restaurant you'd think I just couldn't eat the huge portions we serve in American restaurants, since I generally eat about 1/4 to 1/3 of what's given and I take the rest home. I did have a big hair loss but it's grown back in now. People who meet me now think I'm just a "chunky" woman in her early 30's. They are surprised that I have a son in college and that I used to weigh over 300 pounds. I take a lot of vitamins. I try to drink a lot of water. I probably drink way too much coffee. I still eat a mostly whole foods diet, but I'm not gaining on it now. I shoot for 30 grams of protein a day and most days I can exceed that easily. My cast iron stomach has remained true to form, and I've been very very lucky.

Emotionally, it's weird, but I don't feel comfortable going into more detail than that on the boards. Feel free to PM me if you want more in depth info. Weight wise, I'm hardly losing anything now, and that's okay. I like this weight (size 16/18, XL); it's a good "fighting weight". People still remark that I look like I'm losing but I think it's because my skin's tightening up.

Anyhow, that's me, a veritable open book. Not a cheerleader, just a happy customer. And again, let me know how I can help. In the meantime, my apologies for the length of this post and congratulations if you made it this far. ;)

[Celestial Ceece]

[QUOTE=missaf]For what it's worth, you're posting at the right place to get both sides of the story. I can totally understand the dilemna you are in. I had some health issues related to where I lived in New England, not my weight, but it always came back to my weight. In my case, I moved, and the health problem disappeared. I know that won't solve anything for you though :(

My dad is going through something similar. He has horrible health problems due to Agent Orange exposure in Vietnam. His body is literally shutting down from exposure to this chemical, despite his best efforts fight it. [/QUOTE=missaf]

Wow...First off, thanks for your two cents! I find your response to be very interesting because I live in New England - in the WAY WAY North. I am literally so close to Canada that I can see Canada from my window. The lake I live on is shared with Canada! Anyway, it is cold and damp up here and the weather tends to make my symptoms flare. I wish I had the option to move at this point, but I am so poor due to being on disability, that I don't. That sucks!

Also, my father served in the Vietnam war and has had cancer for 18 years due to exposure to Agent Orange. In addition to the Cancer (Chronic Lymphocytic Leukemia), he has heart problems, diabetes, and other diseases which I would prefer not to mention in this forum. I have always wondered if his exposure affected his genes somehow...and if this was passed down to his offspring since I wasn't born until 1978, a few years after he returned from the conflict.

Anyway, I appreciate your response and your unbiased opinion! I am having a heck of a time reading through all of these responses this morning. It is really nice to know that there are so many people who understand/can relate to the stuff I'm going through!

[Celestial Ceece]

I'm with Moonvine on this. If it were me I would go with the lapband. It's safer and it's adjustable. If it's too much or too little they can fix it or remove it altogether if it's not working out. Look into the lapband and a good medical facility.

I'm concerned about your depression issues though. I would strongly suggest you do something about that first before you do anything else. Are you on meds, can to tinker around a bit and find something that works for you? If you are having problems with depression and thoughts of suicide, surgery of ANY kind can make your symptoms strong enough to chew and spit in your own hand. You'll be indescribably miserable and if you don't feel you have adequate support from family/friends it could be a recipe for disaster. Talk to someone about finding something to get your depression under control first. That would be my advice.

Please don't be a stranger here. Peek in and let us know how you're doing from time to time. I'm going to be keeping you in my thoughts and prayers. :kiss2:

Thanks for your advice!

My depression issues have been up and down over the past few months. I have been seeing a psychiatrist and will be seeing a psychologist for counseling fairly soon. The psychiatrist is working with me on a monthly basis to get my medication stabilized, and he is actually the reason I decided to reach out and ask people about WLS. I saw him yesterday and he recommended I reach out and talk to people who've had the surgery.

It made me feel like crap though, honestly. I don't know why, it just did. But it motivated me to come on and ask questions, and to start doing some research, so it wasn't all negative!

I have one concern though, and I think you are the appropriate person for me to ask. You're a singer, as I remember, and I am also. I've had people say that perhaps my voice would change having WLS, or that throwing up would cause changes to my vocal chords somehow. Do you think this is a stupid concern, or that it is perhaps true somehow? More than anything, I want to be able to perform again without my feet tingling, and without me falling all over the place due to imbalance! But I don't want to lose my voice doing it, ya know?

Anyway, thanks again, I appreciate all your help and answers. I'm going to see if I can't find some information on my vocal concerns!

[Celestial Ceece]

Wait a minute.

They won't operate on your back because of your weight, but they WILL operate to do a gastric bypass?

Just seems odd.

I have back problems as a result of several motor vehicle accidents that have left me with four herniated discs (both lumbar and my neck). I've had a good degree of success with pain management - prescription painkillers and an occasional epidural injection. If you aren't seeing a pain management specialist, I would strongly suggest it.

I've been on pills...tons of them...for years! But they are only "bandages" as my Doctor says, and I tend to agree. I do think it is strange that they won't operate on my back, but they will do gastric bypass. But then again, people who specialize in back surgery don't specialize in stomach surgery, and therein lies the difference I suppose.

I've been to a pain clinic, and they've done steroid injections, but they haven't helped. I've done aquatheraphy also, which has helped a bit, BUT...I live in an area where I either have to drive an hour one way to get to the pool, or, have to wait months to get into pool therapy. So, at this point, I've just given up. I'm lazy, I guess. I've never had any long-term results, and I've always felt discouraged with the little bit of progress that I've made because it isn't enough for me! I want to be fully functional!

[Celestial Ceece]

I'm so sorry. My heart goes out to you. That kind of pain is just awful. It's debilitating and life sucking and... well, you know how it is 'cause you're living it. Damn. It's bad enough, the problems we have being fat, but when you add an autoimmune disease on top of it... yeah, been there, done that, hated it.



(sigh) Again, I feel ya. I needed to lose weight, but couldn't because I really couldn't exercise, between the weight and the condition of my joints. You get to a point where you really DON'T have a lot of options. I know that Tina does some breathing stuff and other gentle exercises; you might consider talking to her. She's done remarkably well in regaining a LOT of mobility and while she doesn't have RA, she has other issues which make exercise difficult if not nearly impossible.

As for recommending gastric bypass, yeah that happens a lot. As medical professionals we want to help and we feel as helpless as YOU do. I mean, we can't fix your back, or your other problems, but many feel that the surgery can fix many of those problems and so that's why they suggest it. Not to be mean, but to try to help in ANY way they can, no matter how desperate or potentially dangerous.



I thinking reaching out is a good option. I know that when I was relying on information passed on here, the "everbody knows that most people gain back their weight" or "you will certainly die" comments, I was given false information. However, much of the information on bariatric websites is also, if not false, very misleading. What I did was talk to as many people as I could, online and off, who have had the surgery. I read the memorial pages of people who died from it. I read memorial pages of people who died of obesity while waiting for insurance approval to get surgery. I read glowing success stories. I read horror stories. I read everything I could get my hands on. Knowing statistics is good, but they don't resonate in the same way that people's stories do. At least not for me. I talked to my nursie friends who assisted/cared for patients who had surgery, discussed the complications they saw (and by which doc in town!)

It helped me keep in perspective the horror stories and glowing success stories. I figure it's like a bell curve -- most people fall somewhere in between. There will always be people who die or are debilitated. There will always be people who drop 200 pounds effortlessly without losing a single hair or getting a single wrinkle (we hate them). And then there are the majority of us who have some complications from the surgery, and for the most part think it was a good idea (for us). Most people seem to fall into that category, where the annoyances of dumping or loose skin are well worth regaining mobility and getting off of a half dozen medications (or more). I think you'll find lots of people like that. Of course, our stories aren't as sexy as those who can wear bikinis or who end up dying, so they don't get as much airtime. But they are very real.



Yeah, this worries me for you as well. You should definitely talk to your rheumatologist and get his or her opinion about the surgery's potential ramifications on your RA, how to manage your condition pre-op and immediately post-op. It may be that they can switch you to another med or taper you off (I'm assuming you're on steroids?) I wasn't on anything but an inhaler and LOTS of Motrin (of course, I'd been taking Vioxx like it was candy but oh well) but I was really worried that the nutritional deficiences that I'd face would cause me to have an exacerbation of my autoimmune disease (stage I Pulmonary Sarcoidosis with joint involvement). I'm happy to say that the opposite is true, that many of the symptoms I had were actually from my weight, not from the disease itself. Clinically I still have it (according to blood tests and my latest chest x ray) but my symptoms are at least 95% better, so I have to conclude that part of the breathing trouble and joint pain was from my weight.



If your gut tells you that -- not just the natural fear of surgery that we ALL have -- then I say listen to it. Honor it. Talking to a therapist about your feelings about your weight, the surgery, your fears, etc would be a good idea. Certainly you're at high risk for the surgery because of your mobility problems and the medications you're on. It's a risky surgery anyway, and you're higher risk than some because of your difficulties in getting around (pulmonary emboli would be a concern, but it is a risk that can be handled well with blood thinners, epidurals for pain to cut catecholamines, the placement of vena cava filters which "trap" any errant clots before they reach vital organs, and sequential compression devices). Infections can hpapen in hospitals, but they can be treated the vast majority of time with antibiotics (and in fact most of us get at least a dose of a broad spectrum antibiotic in the OR anyway). Everybody should definitely choose their surgeon carefully but if you DO opt for this, your best hope for a good outcome is the best doctor you can find with the most experience and who's willing to work with your other doctors regarding your other medical problems.



I felt just as you did, except that I'm an old lady and didn't want to spend my 40's feeling like I was 90, a place I was rapidly approaching. ;) I'd spent aout $25k on a nursing career that I was going to end up pissing away if I didn't address my mobility problems post haste. It's a tough call, darlin', one only YOU can make. I'd recommend talking to as many people as you can, and then giving yourself some quite space and time to really look at what you feel is right. I was sure that I was going to die, although I think it wasn't my gut so much as my fear (and being a nurse I know better than most what can go horribly wrong - even in low risk patients doing low risk procedures). But the way I looked at it is that if April 17, 2005 was my day to die, then it wouldn't matter whether I was on an OR table or in line at the bank or at home. It would be my time to go, but at least I would have tried to improve my life even though the idea of leaving small children -- having been orphaned myself at 12 -- was scary and awful. But that's what falls in with MY belief system. I figured, if I'd truly exhausted all of my resources (I had, including prescribed diet drugs), then what choice did I have but to either a) do something drastic that could kill me outright or even within months or years, or b) watch myself die a little bit each day. It was terrifying, but it was the right decision for ME. The right decision for YOU may be very different.

Please let me know how I can support you. I'm happy to share whatever information you like (personal or professional), I'm happy to listen, I'll even cry with you and curse the fates at how unfair this whole bloody mess is. In short, whatever support you need that I can give from far flung Alaska, you got it.

In the meantime, here are my stats, in the interest of full disclosure.

Preop: Highest weight 314 (or is it 317? can't remember), 5'2"(and a smidge). Stage I pulmonary Sarcoidosis. Hypertension, hyperlipidemia, hyperinsulinemia. Taking Vioxx, and antidepressants, and meds for the above conditions. Had stress incontinence. Plantar fasciitis. Reactive airway disease. Anemia. Family history of cancer, diabetes and heart disease. Yeast infections in skin folds. Tortuous varicosities on both legs. Crazy gynecological bleeding. Ovarian cysts (but not PCOS). Calcium imbalance from the autoimmune disease.

The only system working well for me was my GI system -- no gastric reflux, no constipation, I basically have a cast iron stomach. Oh and no sleep apnea, either. I ate a healthy diet of about 1400 calories a day but could not exercise due to my conditions, and my weight had gone from creeping up to sprinting up, from an hourglass to an apple shape (which is the highest risk for early death).

Surgery: April 17, 2005. Open RnY, proximal (meaning less intestine bypassed). Epidural placed preoperatively for pain control afterward (which cuts down the hormone catecholamines that contribute to blood clots and then pulmonary emboli which can be deadly). During induction (when they put you to sleep), my sats dropped to the 40's (a percentage of blood oxygenated at your extremities which SHOULD be over 90%), probably because of the weight of my tummy fat on my lungs. They put me in reverse trendelenberg (head up, feet down) and I resolved. The surgery continued. Postop no complications, was able to tolerate ice chips, then water, then clears, and I was discharged in 3 days. Was on soft diet by the end of the week (I had cravings for tunafish), and regular foods within a month.

Postop:

Today: 199.5 pounds (finally broke the 200 mark, but tomorrow I may have crept back up again). Blood lipids, normal. Blood pressure, normal. Calcium imbalance -- still there. Anemia -- still there. Crazy gynecological bleeding -- still there but hopefully gone with the ablation I had last week. Breathing problems -- virtually gone. Joint problems? Virtually gone. Ovarian cysts? Come and go. Insulin levels? Normal. No antidepressants. Very rarely a motrin (which I'm not supposed to take anyway). Stress incontinence? Gone. Varicose veins? Still there, and more noticable since there's less fat cushioning them. I'm working out now, up to about 40 minutes of cardio and weight training several times a week. I do have some loose skin, but it's something I can live with for now. I'm ambivalent about plastic surgery.

Complications? A small hernia right below my sternum. Not painful, just feels weird, like an alien baby poking its head out. Of course, I already had had at least two hernias that we know of when I was 300 pounds, but this one is along the incisional line so it's probably from the surgery; it's a risk from having the surgery "open" rather than laparoscopically. Um. I can't eat Top Ramen -- it makes me vomit, and I have no idea why or even worse, why I still crave it. I can eat chocolate, cookies, ice cream, beer and wine (in small amounts and I get looped quickly), sushi, and everything else I love including steak, chicken, hamburger and pasta, but in small amounts.

I'm not constipated, I don't have diarrhea, I don't vomit (or haven't for many months, once I learned to eat more often and not eat too quickly). If you saw me in a restaurant you'd think I just couldn't eat the huge portions we serve in American restaurants, since I generally eat about 1/4 to 1/3 of what's given and I take the rest home. I did have a big hair loss but it's grown back in now. People who meet me now think I'm just a "chunky" woman in her early 30's. They are surprised that I have a son in college and that I used to weigh over 300 pounds. I take a lot of vitamins. I try to drink a lot of water. I probably drink way too much coffee. I still eat a mostly whole foods diet, but I'm not gaining on it now. I shoot for 30 grams of protein a day and most days I can exceed that easily. My cast iron stomach has remained true to form, and I've been very very lucky.

Emotionally, it's weird, but I don't feel comfortable going into more detail than that on the boards. Feel free to PM me if you want more in depth info. Weight wise, I'm hardly losing anything now, and that's okay. I like this weight (size 16/18, XL); it's a good "fighting weight". People still remark that I look like I'm losing but I think it's because my skin's tightening up.

Anyhow, that's me, a veritable open book. Not a cheerleader, just a happy customer. And again, let me know how I can help. In the meantime, my apologies for the length of this post and congratulations if you made it this far. ;)

I have to admit, I've been lurking for a while...and some people around here know me as a proud, confident fat woman. But I hide behind that persona online because in real life I am miserable! I decided that chatting with FA's was probably not the best thing for my physical health, since lots of them were feeders who encouraged me to overeat, when that is so obviously NOT what I needed. But I digress.

As I've been lurking over the past few months, I've noticed that you've posted quite a bit to this board, and I was really hoping that you would respond to my post as you seem to have a lot of information on this surgery! I don't know what else I want to say except that I'm going to PM you and I hope we can connect and talk some more. I'd really love to ask you more questions and tell you more about my situation as well!

Thanks again!

[LillyBBBW]

I have one concern though, and I think you are the appropriate person for me to ask. You're a singer, as I remember, and I am also. I've had people say that perhaps my voice would change having WLS, or that throwing up would cause changes to my vocal chords somehow. Do you think this is a stupid concern, or that it is perhaps true somehow? More than anything, I want to be able to perform again without my feet tingling, and without me falling all over the place due to imbalance! But I don't want to lose my voice doing it, ya know?

Anyway, thanks again, I appreciate all your help and answers. I'm going to see if I can't find some information on my vocal concerns!

Debra Voigt had weight loss surgery a few years ago. Her voice is just as strong as always with the same brilliance. Because her body is different, the sound produced has a different quality to it. Not better, not worse, just a slightly different shading. A bit more light and shimmery than before.

Along withthe dramatic weight loss Debra now has a new reputation for being constantly sick. She called in sick for a lot of concerts she's done and it's the talk of the town now. I don't know if it is related at all to weight loss surgery complications and not something else. Being bulimic at one time myself I can say that vomiting does affect your ability to sing. It was one of the prime motivations for me to stop doing it, but recovering from vomiting is no more severe than recovering from a sore throat or a bad cold.

Also keep in mind, when a surgery is performed the anesthesiologist *always* has to place a tube down your throat to deliver air to your lungs. People claim they didn't have one, they did. with the insertion and removal of this air tube there is always the possibility that the tube could clip and injure a vocal chord. This is the terror of every singer who must undergo surgery and often they will request to be awake with a local anesthetic to avoid having a tube inserted. For some surgeries this is not practical as was the case for one of mine. I literally burst into tears while talking to the anesthesiologist when I was told that there were no other options for me given my circumstances.

To her credit, when the anesthesiologist realized I was a high strung singer she promised to use a smaller tube for my throat to lessen the chance for injury and then I made her *swear* that she would personally insert and remove the tube herself and not leave it up to a student or some lackey who needs to be given something to do. If you do undergo surgery, talk with your doctor and/or ask to meet personally with the anesthesiologist in advance to address your concerns and let them know that you are a singer and you would like them to take special care not to injure your throat.

Other than that I don't think that weight loss is going to affect your ability to sing. The sound will be different merely because the instrument from which it comes is accoustically different, but the difference is so minor and subtle that it's not worth remaining in pain and ill health for.

[PrettyFatGirl4U]

Chew and spit in your own hand? Now that's a new one one me....you have such a way with words, Lilly :)

[missaf]

Hear hear for the smaller tracheal tube! I'm also a singer (though not professionally!), and directed choirs professionally, giving voice lessons, etc... Then I learned the hardway I'm allergic to mold-- Mold and New England kinda go hand in hand. Long story short I had to have a doctor go in to my sinuses and scrape them clean, clean out infected tissue in my nose, and I had to be intubated during the procedure. It was pretty gross.

I literally woke myself up when I got home because the harmonics of my breathing through my nose changed. I thought there was a stranger in my bed! Now, I have a different sound to myself when I sing, and because of the initial asthma problems, I'm having trouble getting my air back.

[saucywench]

Hello dimensions people - it has been a long time since you all have seen my fat butt around here, simply because I am suffering from health issues and personal issues etc. I'll get to my point though, so as not to bore whomever decides to read.
Oh, man.

(((((((((((( Ceece )))))))))))

I read this post when you first submitted it, but I've had to return and reread and sit here and think before I could even begin to respond with any cohesive thought. You present a number of issues that could be viewed as almost overwhelming, even if each are taken on a singular basis. I think I will have to respond to your post in multiple parts.
If you know me, then you know I'm a large woman and have been all my life. I'm currently 27 years old, 440 pounds, and 6'1", and disabled. Over the past five years I've developed rheumatoid arthritis in my joints, osteoarthritis in my left knee, and then I eventually herniated the L5 and SI discs in my back and have two pinched nerves related to that, causing sciatica in my leg. In addition, I have entrapted nerves in my ankles because of the rheumatoid arthritis. Recently, I've developed borderline blood pressure, and I've suffered from depression and anxiety for a long, long time.
First off, I can completely relate to the back issue, as that is the exact location where I had herniation 17 years ago. I feel certain what caused the herniation, though, and it wasn't related to my weight. I was traveling late at night and my car got both a flat tire and dead battery at approximately the same time. I got behind the car and tried to push it further off to the side of the road so as not to get hit. That created the initial herniation and each time I bent, coughed, or sneezed during the next few weeks added to the pressure until the disk completely blew one day while at work, as I was bent over my desk. The disk literally exploded, and bits of it (I learned after surgery) became stuck to my sciatic nerve, creating the most intense pain I have ever known. A coworker somehow got me into their car and drove me to my chiropractor, who immediately told me to go to the emergency room. A x-ray was done, which showed nothing. The ER then scheduled me to visit my PCP (who I respected immensely) later that day but he was out of town, so I had to see a colleague of his. He scheduled me for an MRI but an opening wasn't available for 3 weeks! That night I was in such intense pain I couldn't sleep. I called my sister at 2:00am to bring me any drugs she might have. I was unable to walk and when she arrived I had to crawl down a long flight of stairs to open the door to let her in. I took whatever she brought but was only able to sleep no more than two hours at a time when the medicine wore off and I was awake in pain again. I did this repeatedly over the next few hours, literally overdosing, just to get some minor relief and rest. I'm not clear on the events that followed except that, once my mother learned of and witnessed personally the agony I was in, she became enraged as I had never seen her. She called the hospital administration and, I'm not sure what she said, but, I think some heads rolled, and I was sheduled for an MRI the next day. The MRI showed the extent of the injury and I was immediately admitted for surgery the following morning.

I related this very long anecdote because, as I said, I can completely relate to the pain you are experiencing, and, taking into account your other medical conditions, my mind is reeling with everything that you're having to endure. Also, to express that it is crucial to have both the emotional and real support of family, and I am dismayed that you don't seem to be getting that. You simply must have someone who will advocate for you at such a critical time as this. As for your depression and anxiety, well, hell, it's no wonder you're depressed and anxious. Chronic medical problems can exacerbate those conditions. If you have suffered from these symptoms for a number of years prior to these more recent (or perhaps more recently acute) physical conditions, it is to be expected that they will worsen, and now both psychological and physical symptoms have seemingly become irrevocably intertwined.
My physical health has gotten so bad that I'm really limited in my mobility, and am pretty well housebound. I use a cane, can't really do things on my own (like shopping for instance), and require a lot of help in my life in general. I am incredibly frustrated because I am in pain all the time, and honestly, this pain makes me feel unhappy enough that I think about taking my own life often.
I deeply empathize with you with the frustration you feel regarding the mobility issues, although I have never had that experience (on an extended basis) myself. I can, however, relate to the feeling of frustration and isolation and depression that compels one to ponder taking their own life.
It seems as though every professional I see, whether they be a psychologist or a neurologist, suggests gastric bypass as the one and only option for me....I feel as though I don't have many choices left!
This is where I don't quite know how to respond. If it were me, I would take special care when consulting with medical professionals that they are counseling you in such a way that they are addressing your issues--ugh, well, this is where it gets complicated. I was going to say, they should not de facto recommend gastric bypass as the only solution unless that is the only solution for you. In other words, they shouldn't exhibit any fat bias they may have when considering how best to treat you. If they have summarily told you that is your only option, I would question this. But, perhaps, in your specific case, it may be the only option. I simply do not know, nor am I a health professional, so can't speak with any degree of authority in this regard. I think the title of your post speaks to part of this, though; if you are feeling like you are being pushed toward that option, I think you have done the right thing to come here to question, perhaps, their motivation in doing so. I just don't know whether we here can provide a definitive answer for you.

Today, I saw a psychiatrist, and he suggested I talk to other folks who have had the surgery, and start researching it. I told him that I have done research, but I will start to connect with other people who have had the surgery so that I can get a better perspective on it.
Well, first, I think it will be benefical for you to continue ongoing psychiatric/psychological counseling. Yours is certainly a complex issue, and any insight you can glean from these sessions is bound to help your situation overall. I have had such counseling off and on for all of my adult life. I feel, though, that, just as with the healthcare professionals who are addressing your physical issues, you must also take care that those who are addressing your psychological ones are not exhibiting any undue fat bias. It's hard to tell only with what you've stated, but if he has simply suggested that you do this research, perhaps he is indeed treating you with the dignity and respect that should be afforded you. I hope this is certainly the case.

[further responses continued in another post]

[saucywench]

My main concerns are that I have rheumatoid arthritis, which comprimises my immune system. I am on two medications for the disease that suppress my immune system. This means that when somebody comes around me with a cold, I get it. This means that I always get infections, and have a seriously difficult time fighting them off on my own. This also means that I am scared to death of getting some sort of nasty infection if I were to get my stomach bypassed. The nearest MRI that I fit in is 3.5 hours away. Couple that with the fact that I'm more than certain my Doctor thinks I am a hypochondriac...and I am sure that I will die from this. My GUT just tells me that I would be one of the people who would die from having this surgery. I also don't have the support of some of my closest family members and friends. Now of course my (formerly fat) siblings think it is a grand idea, because they realize I suffer and want to see me happy...
From what you have described, your fears are very valid; anyone--healthcare professional or not--who would dismiss those fears out of hand and label you a hypochondriac, is very misguided. Also, it's very difficult for us to dismiss what we think our gut instincts are telling us, but at times we have to stop and think as rationally as possible. I'm not suggesting that you're not doing so; it's just that sometimes our real and valid and rational fears, when anxiety is added to the mix, can become indistinguishable from our more irrational fears. Again, this is a situation where I can't offer much input, except to say that I believe you're on the right track in researching your options as thoroughly as possible.

Has anybody else who has gone through the surgery had the same concerns?
Yes, to the surgery; no, to the extent that my circumstance were not so similar (some of which I addressed in the "SA history" post/sticky.)
Has anybody else here had some of the same problems and issues that I have?
Yes, some, but not nearly to the extent as you, although I would be more than glad to talk with you about any aspect of these issues, Ceece. However, I am hopeful that (and as has already been proven) that there are many others here on the forums who can more adequately address any issues you may have that I am unable (because of differering experiences) to relate to.
Truly and honestly, I feel that if I don't do something about my health, including WEIGHT LOSS (gasp, :shocked: OMG OMG, a semi-sexy supersized girl wants to lose weight because it is negatively impacting her health), that I will end up in a wheelchair by the end of the year.
I decided that chatting with FA's was probably not the best thing for my physical health, since lots of them were feeders who encouraged me to overeat, when that is so obviously NOT what I needed. But I digress.
Ceece, I copied this last paragraph from another post you made and pasted it here to respond. I certainly don't want to open up a huge can of worms with this, nor cause your thread to be hijacked for completely wrong reasons, but I did want to address this particular issue. I really don't want to get into the whole feeder topic, but I wanted to say that I think it was a very wise decision on your part to stop chatting with the feeder types. Situations such as yours clearly illustrate when such an association can be completely detrimental to one's well being. When someone who seems to have developed an interest in you eventually reveals that their own personal agenda overrides any concern for your health (or, dare I say it, your mortality,) that is a red flag that any correspondence with them should cease immediately.
I'm tired of NOT living my life when I'm so young. I can't live this way any longer. But I don't want to die trying to regain my life either.
You know, for many of us, it simply comes down to this--an instance of being forced to make drastic, life-altering (and/or life-saving) decisions; the motives for and methods of achieving this are unique for each of us, though, and anyone who arrives at such a point in their lives should be treated with the utmost respect with how they choose to chart the course that will impact the remainder of their lives. There don't seem to be any easy or cut-and-dried answers for you, Ceece. Just know that I will support you in whatever decision/s you choose to make.

Cindy

[CurvyEm]

I think is the weight is effecting you so negatively that you're contemplating suicide then you should seriously consider the option. If you've exausted all other options for losing weight then this is what WLS is here for (you know, I'm sure this is what it was really invented for not just any obese person.)

Yes there are risks. But as you've already said you've considered suicide. How highly would you rate a wheelchair bound life, and pain because they can't operate? If you do become wheel chair bound then you will probably end up pileing on more weight.

I know in your situation I'd probably go for the surgery. But it's all your own chioce and one you have to think long and hard about. I hope it all works out.

[Celestial Ceece]

All of the advice about the singing stuff and trach tubes was VERY insightful and helpful. Thanks Lilly and Missaf!

Cindy - your responses really touched a nerve with me tonight (or should I say, this morning haha). Sometimes I wonder if I am being led to the WLS option out of anti-fat bias or out of true concern for my health. This is why some of the folks who are close to me are not wanting me to go through with it. My mom AND my boyfriend are sure that I will die from complications because they think the professionals who suggest this option are doing so from a place of ignorance. Honestly, if a person suggests that I have my "stomach stapled" yet doesn't know what the word "bariatric" means, do they really have a clue? It makes me wonder.

Obviously, mentally, I am not in a good place, and so perhaps this is something they pick up on. And of course, I start to get defensive whenever my weight is brought up, because it is something I am VERY sensitive about. I've spent a long time trying to defend my body...and trying to defend my right to be fat (and healthy, even though I'm not healthy). Which brings me to the psychiatrist I saw the other day. When I started talking to him about size acceptance and fat acceptance, he wanted to know more. But then he asked me this question,

"but what about the fact that obesity is unhealthy?"

And I knew right then and there that I might as well just give up. I was perhaps, stupid for bringing up fat acceptance. I did tell him about NAAFA, so maybe he'll do a little research and become a little more knowledgeable. I can only hope. In the meantime, here I am...thanking my lucky stars that there are at least people in the world who can relate to the B.S. and the crap I've been through. Not that it is any fun!

Cindy, how is your back now, by the way?

Thanks again for all the responses!

[moonvine]

Obviously, mentally, I am not in a good place, and so perhaps this is something they pick up on. And of course, I start to get defensive whenever my weight is brought up, because it is something I am VERY sensitive about. I've spent a long time trying to defend my body...and trying to defend my right to be fat (and healthy, even though I'm not healthy). Which brings me to the psychiatrist I saw the other day. When I started talking to him about size acceptance and fat acceptance, he wanted to know more. But then he asked me this question,

"but what about the fact that obesity is unhealthy?"

And I knew right then and there that I might as well just give up. I was perhaps, stupid for bringing up fat acceptance. I did tell him about NAAFA, so maybe he'll do a little research and become a little more knowledgeable. I can only hope. In the meantime, here I am...thanking my lucky stars that there are at least people in the world who can relate to the B.S. and the crap I've been through. Not that it is any fun!

Cindy, how is your back now, by the way?

Thanks again for all the responses!


This is a huge red flag for me. I'd definitely be looking for a therapist who at least understands and accepts fat acceptance (if this is something that is important to you).

Here's an online brochure from NAAFA on this subject, a little dated, but the only one I know of:

http://www.naafa.org/documents/brochures/therapyguide.html

[FitChick]

Ceece, I was only 300+ at my highest, and strangely, did not develop health concerns until AFTER I dropped a lot of weight. But one thing I want to say..I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to lose weight for health and mobility reasons. I have a foot problem which developed from exercising too much, and I honestly CANNOT imagine the pain if I still was 300 lbs. So I can relate to wanting to lose wt to reduce physical pain, you know? I'm 135 lbs right now yet walk every morning with a cane just to make it to the bathroom so I don't pee myself (I have plantar fasciitis from too much exercise.) Its POSSIBLE that wt loss ALONE may not help your health problems. Thats a sad reality to keep in mind.

Also, there's nothing that says you have to lose wt to get down to stick thin! Many women and men lose SOME weight so they can be a smaller version of plus size! I know lots of people who started eating right and exercising, NOT to be thin but to just make it easier to get around. They're still big, just not as big as they used to be.

As for WLS, I know ppl who have done it, I know some for whom it did not present problems, and I know others for whom it created problems. I think you should research it throughly, listen to BOTH sides, then make up your mind. But don't let others (esp. doctors who stand to gain $$$ from it) push you into anything you might not want.

[HereticFA]

Hi Ceece, I'm sorry to hear of your health problems. Some of your health issues will be reduced by weight loss, despite what many FA's (and some in the Fat Acceptance community) would like to believe. On the other hand the health issues probably won't be eliminated, only reduced. I was with a couple of friends this weekend who both had WLS four and six years ago. The one who I consider one of the few fairly successful post-ops that I know was complaining of arthritic pain from her knees so obviously WLS doesn't eliminate the problems. (Even after losing weight, she couldn't find someone to perform a knee replacement. She also suffered from being "too young" at age 52.)

Your back problems can be attributed as much to your height as to your weight. Back problems seem to be an issue for "talls" who aren't rail thin. Mine started when I was an adolescent at a BMI of 42 to 45. At 6'5", I still have back trouble even though I lost weight over the years to a BMI around 26 to 28. When I was at a BMI of 32 to 35, I would have recurring bouts of serious back pain trapping me in bed for days at a time about every three years. As for back surgery, I've yet to find anyone who had it that gives it a resounding recommendation. Most agree that while they don't have really bad pain anymore, they don't have any pain free days either. My strategy is to postpone it as long as possible in the hope new methods will be developed that will be better than the current methods. I'm lucky in that since losing weight, I don't have serious back pain very often or for very long and even then it's only dull & diffused aching in the lower back.

Don't overlook gastric banding while checking out WLS. Recent studies show while the RNY gastric bypass helps people lose weight faster in the beginning, the overall success rates of both procedures after five to seven years is very similar. Since the malnutrition issues with RNY increase over time (especially anemia, B-12 and calcium deficiencies), the lap band is being recommended more often.

While you are waiting and checking out different WLS procedures, look at how RNY post ops are supposed to eat. Try to modify your eating pattern to that general method: lean protein first, avoid starches and sugars, limit your meal quantity to about a cup to a cup and a half, and avoid all sodas. Just don't eat to get full, only eat to relieve hunger. Plus drink lots of water since you urinate out the fat you lose. If you only lose fifty pounds, that's more than 10% of your current weight. You will probably feel better with that 10% loss. At a minimum, you will be better prepared for your new life.

As for exercise, loss of mobility is a significant problem. But lack of exercise causes loss of muscle mass which makes it harder to lose fat. Consider Rosalie Bradford, a lady who gained about eight hundred pounds after her WLS to reach an estimated 1200 pounds. When she finally decided to lose weight by diet and exercise, she was also unable to exercise in a conventional way. Her initial method of exercise was to move her arms while she was sitting in bed. She took an assessment of what she could physically do and used that ability to burn as many calories as she could, by simply moving her arms. Don't pass up any opportunity to move. Sitting is the path to a decline in a persons health.

You depression is obviously a major issue and strongly coupled to your other health issues. Keep pushing your psychiatrist/psychologist to start treating your depression directly without waiting for WLS. It will improve your outcome following whatever WLS you chose. Exercise is also known to help relieve depression somewhat. Have you tried light therapy? Extended dark periods are known to increase depression in some people. Adding lots of very bright light in your living space will probably help fight the depression.

You have lots of options and have just started on your journey.

[Celestial Ceece]

This is a huge red flag for me. I'd definitely be looking for a therapist who at least understands and accepts fat acceptance (if this is something that is important to you).

Here's an online brochure from NAAFA on this subject, a little dated, but the only one I know of:

http://www.naafa.org/documents/brochures/therapyguide.html

I printed that out and will be bringing it to BOTH of my therapists. I hope that they will find it helpful, because, though I'm not always able to vocalize my concerns in the right way, at least I know I have NAAFA and other size activists on my side! And, I also have the right to refuse treatment. I used to be a caregiver, and one of the things I learned in that job was that the "consumer" had the right to refuse treatment - be it medication, therapy, etc. So, if I say, "no" then they have to honor my individual choice. End of story. I almost forgot that. Thanks for the reminder!

[Celestial Ceece]

Ceece, I was only 300+ at my highest, and strangely, did not develop health concerns until AFTER I dropped a lot of weight. But one thing I want to say..I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to lose weight for health and mobility reasons. I have a foot problem which developed from exercising too much, and I honestly CANNOT imagine the pain if I still was 300 lbs. So I can relate to wanting to lose wt to reduce physical pain, you know? I'm 135 lbs right now yet walk every morning with a cane just to make it to the bathroom so I don't pee myself (I have plantar fasciitis from too much exercise.) Its POSSIBLE that wt loss ALONE may not help your health problems. Thats a sad reality to keep in mind.

Also, there's nothing that says you have to lose wt to get down to stick thin! Many women and men lose SOME weight so they can be a smaller version of plus size! I know lots of people who started eating right and exercising, NOT to be thin but to just make it easier to get around. They're still big, just not as big as they used to be.

As for WLS, I know ppl who have done it, I know some for whom it did not present problems, and I know others for whom it created problems. I think you should research it throughly, listen to BOTH sides, then make up your mind. But don't let others (esp. doctors who stand to gain $$$ from it) push you into anything you might not want.

The funny thing is, I didn't develop serious pain from my rheumatoid arthritis until I started to lose weight. I was 400+ pounds at age 20, and around age 21 I started to lose a lot of weight. I got down to 300 pounds by age 22, through light exercise and a fairly healthy diet. But things turned around for me physically, and it was during that time period that my joints started hurting and becoming stiff, and I wasn't able to recover from the exercise I was doing on a daily basis. Instead of taking a day or two off, it would take weeks for me to start to feel better. Later on, I understood this to be flares, an that my RA was in the early stages.

I sought the help of my Doctor, who did blood tests and told me it was RA, but urged me to continue to lose weight through diet and exercise, which I really wanted to do. But as time went by, the pain kept increasing, until eventually, I couldn't get out of bed anymore. So of course, from there, I went on prednisone, which contributed to me gaining weight really, really fast. The funny thing was, when I initially went on prednisone, I would work out for four hours at a time (though I would also eat a pound or two of food at a time as well).

So yeah...

[Celestial Ceece]

Hi Ceece, I'm sorry to hear of your health problems. Some of your health issues will be reduced by weight loss, despite what many FA's (and some in the Fat Acceptance community) would like to believe. On the other hand the health issues probably won't be eliminated, only reduced. I was with a couple of friends this weekend who both had WLS four and six years ago. The one who I consider one of the few fairly successful post-ops that I know was complaining of arthritic pain from her knees so obviously WLS doesn't eliminate the problems. (Even after losing weight, she couldn't find someone to perform a knee replacement. She also suffered from being "too young" at age 52.)

Your back problems can be attributed as much to your height as to your weight. Back problems seem to be an issue for "talls" who aren't rail thin. Mine started when I was an adolescent at a BMI of 42 to 45. At 6'5", I still have back trouble even though I lost weight over the years to a BMI around 26 to 28. When I was at a BMI of 32 to 35, I would have recurring bouts of serious back pain trapping me in bed for days at a time about every three years. As for back surgery, I've yet to find anyone who had it that gives it a resounding recommendation. Most agree that while they don't have really bad pain anymore, they don't have any pain free days either. My strategy is to postpone it as long as possible in the hope new methods will be developed that will be better than the current methods. I'm lucky in that since losing weight, I don't have serious back pain very often or for very long and even then it's only dull & diffused aching in the lower back.

Don't overlook gastric banding while checking out WLS. Recent studies show while the RNY gastric bypass helps people lose weight faster in the beginning, the overall success rates of both procedures after five to seven years is very similar. Since the malnutrition issues with RNY increase over time (especially anemia, B-12 and calcium deficiencies), the lap band is being recommended more often.

While you are waiting and checking out different WLS procedures, look at how RNY post ops are supposed to eat. Try to modify your eating pattern to that general method: lean protein first, avoid starches and sugars, limit your meal quantity to about a cup to a cup and a half, and avoid all sodas. Just don't eat to get full, only eat to relieve hunger. Plus drink lots of water since you urinate out the fat you lose. If you only lose fifty pounds, that's more than 10% of your current weight. You will probably feel better with that 10% loss. At a minimum, you will be better prepared for your new life.

As for exercise, loss of mobility is a significant problem. But lack of exercise causes loss of muscle mass which makes it harder to lose fat. Consider Rosalie Bradford, a lady who gained about eight hundred pounds after her WLS to reach an estimated 1200 pounds. When she finally decided to lose weight by diet and exercise, she was also unable to exercise in a conventional way. Her initial method of exercise was to move her arms while she was sitting in bed. She took an assessment of what she could physically do and used that ability to burn as many calories as she could, by simply moving her arms. Don't pass up any opportunity to move. Sitting is the path to a decline in a persons health.

You depression is obviously a major issue and strongly coupled to your other health issues. Keep pushing your psychiatrist/psychologist to start treating your depression directly without waiting for WLS. It will improve your outcome following whatever WLS you chose. Exercise is also known to help relieve depression somewhat. Have you tried light therapy? Extended dark periods are known to increase depression in some people. Adding lots of very bright light in your living space will probably help fight the depression.

You have lots of options and have just started on your journey.

You have a really level head! I wasn't really aware that my height could affect things - though I've heard people mention that before. That is really interesting though, and it does make sense.

I've never tried light therapy, though, since I live in Northern Vermont, I am used to long periods of darkness...and I'm usually a cranky girl! I dont' go outside much, and I tend to stay up really late and sleep during the day. Do you think I need vitamin D? :P

Damn, I wish I had a better memory, so I could just respond to everything you wrote! Oh yes, I've already started to reduce my caloric intake, and I'm doing my best to be careful about what I'm eating. Moving/exercise is difficult, but I should just get off my bum and do what I can! I love to dance and stretch, and I know I can do that to an extent. Of course, I love sitting in front of the computer, and reading, and writing, so here I sit...writing about what I should/could be doing.

Okay, off I go...to move!

Thanks for your suggestions. I think I'm going to print this thread out and show it to my therapist. How's that for research?

[Sandie_Zitkus]

Ceece I have a suggestion for you - about exercise - it helped me regain strength in my legs and got me exercising when anything else was impossible.

www.chairdancing.com

It really does work! And it's fun. check it out.

Sandie Z

[Celestial Ceece]

Ceece I have a suggestion for you - about exercise - it helped me regain strength in my legs and got me exercising when anything else was impossible.

www.chairdancing.com

It really does work! And it's fun. check it out.

Sandie Z

I'm checking on it right now! Thanks a bunch!

[Zandoz]

In my case, at 49 years, apx 5'8", and somewhere around 450-500lbs, I know where you are coming from. Ostio arthritis and/or degenerative joint disease in knees, hips, back, and most recently elbow...combined with pinched nerves in the spine from the arthritis deposits...basically leave me home bound, in constant pain, and not really able to do much of anything but be a burden on my family. In addition to that, out of control diabetes, sleep apnea, high blood pressure, high cholesterol, thyroid problems, positional vertigo, short term memory and concentration problems (probably from oxygen deprivation relating to sleep apnea and weight aggravated breathing problems), and now kidney problems (probably from the long term pain meds) add to the fun.

With a metabolism that is already that of a stone as a result of past dieting, and no mobility to be able to do any meaningful exercise, the easily said but seldom successful regime of diet and exercise is not a realistic option. A supposedly healthy, doctor recommended, diet/exercise program is what triggered the decline in health in the first place. Yeah, I lost 100+ pounds, but I went from a very healthy 400 to a sickly 300...and as is usually the case with such things, gained 150 back after.

Now the doctors say that WLS is the only hope for any improvement...and I agree...but it does not make the decision any easier.


On the question of why they will not do knee/back surgery on heavier patients.....

Degenerative Joint Disease and arthritis problems run in my family...heavy or not. In our family, joint replacements are a common necessity...frequently as early as the early 30s. My sister had to have shoulder replacement at 32. My mom has had both knee replacement and arthritis related back surgeries in the last 2 years alone. Between mom and a couple other relatives asking questions of their surgeons on my behalf, the consensus is that the weight makes us unable to do the absolutely necessary post op physical therapy. And in the case of knee replacement puts too much stress on the point where the artificial joint joins to the bone. Makes sense I guess.

[RedHead]

I will also say this about degeneretive bone disease. I suffered an accident where I shattered my left foot in 10 different places. After numerous surgeries I developed arthritis in the metatarsual joints of my foot.

I then reinjured my left knee...it just got worse and worse...well just recently after being on pain killers for 15 years because of the arthritis and pain I had a partial knee replacement with cadaver parts (post WLS) this is the same knee they said at 35 I'd have to live with for at least another 20 years for a knee replacement or another medical miracle.

I walked with a cane or walker for 15 years and now I don't even limp anymore!

I will also say this...I had to get a second opinion; the doctor I normally saw who I believe saved my foot from amputation wouldn't operate. But when I finally sought a second opinion I was suprised to find out that I did have options other than pills!

[Jes]

Did you get Alistair Cooke's cadaver parts?


waaah waaaaah (trombone noise for inappropriate gallows-humor joke). Sorry.

[RedHead]

Did you get Alistair Cooke's cadaver parts?


waaah waaaaah (trombone noise for inappropriate gallows-humor joke). Sorry.


No...but funny enough, one of my legs has rhythm now!

(buhh bump) drum sound

[Jes]

No...but funny enough, one of my legs has rhythm now!

(buhh bump) drum sound

redhead. i [heart] you. i will visit you in alaska and we will wear flannel together and ride yellow snow.

[RedHead]

redhead. i [heart] you. i will visit you in alaska and we will wear flannel together and ride yellow snow.

I love it....and of course the ratio of men to women up here is like 3 to 1. But we do have a saying about that...

"The odds are good you'll find a man, but the goods are usually odd when you do"

(while single I wore this t-shirt often!)

[Jes]

I love it....and of course the ratio of men to women up here is like 3 to 1. But we do have a saying about that...

"The odds are good you'll find a man, but the goods are usually odd when you do"

(while single I wore this t-shirt often!)
look, i'm not picky now, if I ever was. It's just time for a little roll in the (frozen) hay, so I say: bring the kookies on!

[qwerty]

My physical health has gotten so bad that I'm really limited in my mobility, and am pretty well housebound. I use a cane, can't really do things on my own (like shopping for instance), and require a lot of help in my life in general. I am incredibly frustrated because I am in pain all the time, and honestly, this pain makes me feel unhappy enough that I think about taking my own life often.

Hi Ceece,
Instead of using a cane, maybe you could get a mobility scooter? Just a suggestion that might get you out and about a bit easier...
Sorry I've never been in your situation, I'm 280-300 and never had even so much as an ache! The only thing that I could relate to is my daughter, who has back problems every now and again, and uses a buggy occasionally.

Regards