Woman assaulted on train in UK for being fat

[HereticFA]

She was beaten pretty seriously.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1221405/Overweight-people-campaign-make-Britain-fat-friendly.html?ITO=1490

It's interesting that she was assaulted by another woman.

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

How long have I been whining and moaning that fat people are treated a lot differently/worse here than they are in the US? And London is tolerant compared to where I live.

[Tau]

You know what always gets me about these articles - the comments. I want to find some of the people who commented and feed them elephant poop by the shovel. When will people get it that you can't hate somebody into changing or being the way you want them to be *sigh*

[Cors]

I think that London is generally more tolerant of diversity compared to other parts of UK, but there will always be a vocal and possibly violent minority.

It is not just fat people who get targeted, though all the sensationalist news reports about fat people leeching off the NHS and claiming disability benefits and welfare because they are too lazy to work doesn't help matters. Recently I got assaulted by a (female) stranger on the streets of London because she thought I was too thin. It was nowhere near as bad as what the poor lady in the news endured, but I did get some nasty bruises on my ribs and was pretty shaken by the experience.

[shadowmaker87]

sorry to say this ppl ; but no matter where u go ; hate is EVERYWHERE! damn shame where a person has to get beat up all because of her weight?!

[thatgirl08]

God, that's horrible. I've never heard of anything like this. I mean, yeah, I've had people say mean things to me in public but I've never felt physically threatened. That's so sad. We're so overdue for a change.

[Fascinita]

It's interesting that she was assaulted by another woman.

Why is it interesting?

[Tooz]

Can I just say that had this been me the assaulter might now be in a wheelchair?

Ridiculous, why anyone would do that to someone makes no sense to me.

[Surlysomething]

I think that London is generally more tolerant of diversity compared to other parts of UK, but there will always be a vocal and possibly violent minority.

It is not just fat people who get targeted, though all the sensationalist news reports about fat people leeching off the NHS and claiming disability benefits and welfare because they are too lazy to work doesn't help matters. Recently I got assaulted by a (female) stranger on the streets of London because she thought I was too thin. It was nowhere near as bad as what the poor lady in the news endured, but I did get some nasty bruises on my ribs and was pretty shaken by the experience.

That is insane. I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, girlie.

[Surlysomething]

Can I just say that had this been me the assaulter might now be in a wheelchair?

Ridiculous, why anyone would do that to someone makes no sense to me.


I thought the exact same thing. That woman would have been fucked UP.

[Tau]

I thought the exact same thing. That woman would have been fucked UP.

Sooooo Fucked up! And Cors, Im very sorry that happened to you *hugz*

[gangstadawg]

I think that London is generally more tolerant of diversity compared to other parts of UK, but there will always be a vocal and possibly violent minority.

It is not just fat people who get targeted, though all the sensationalist news reports about fat people leeching off the NHS and claiming disability benefits and welfare because they are too lazy to work doesn't help matters. Recently I got assaulted by a (female) stranger on the streets of London because she thought I was too thin. It was nowhere near as bad as what the poor lady in the news endured, but I did get some nasty bruises on my ribs and was pretty shaken by the experience.

well here in the U.S. (well mainly the hood areas) we go by dont start no shit there wont be no shit. in other words they touch you whoop there ass.

[joswitch]

You know what always gets me about these articles - the comments. I want to find some of the people who commented and feed them elephant poop by the shovel. When will people get it that you can't hate somebody into changing or being the way you want them to be *sigh*

Yeah, sadly, here in the UK there's a 3,000year old tradition of getting drunk on a night and beating the the shit out of random people... There's an awful lot of scumbags here... :(

On a slight upside:
Same story here - some of the comments scrolling through at the moment are quite reasonable and supportive! Who'd've thought it?

Quick cut and paste from the This Is London site:
I so support Marsha Coupe. What is so offensive about
an overweight human being ? We are heading towards a
pandemic of hatred in this area. Now we have idiots like
the Boss of Ryanair wanting to charge extra for larger
passengers - it is the start of a slippery slope of discrimination akin to apparteid. Lets make it a crime.
You go girl !!!

- Catherine Mulcahy, Colchester , Essex

i am proud to be a big woman!!!!

- Kay, london

I am shocked at peoples ignorance!! Several people have stated they cannot believe that someone was attacked simply for their size, well there was a time when people would have said that about the victims of other hate crime, namely gender, sexuality, race, religion!
No-one has the right to judge anyone else. Yes, there are health ramifications to being overweight, but then the same can be said for smokers, drinkers etc. But as long as the person is happy with themselves then noone else should be passing judgement - especially not in a derogatory manner. If we start charging/taxing larger people for heatlh care, airplane seats...where will it end?
We are all human beings and equal and should be treated as such.

- Alina, London

There's a hell of a deep blue sea between not verbally abusing someone for whatever reason--let alone beating them up--and making expensive 'accommodations' for a wrong choice of lifestyle. Ms. Coupe is being rather disingenuous in using the sympathy we feel for her as victim of an attack as a springboard for pushing a frankly topsy-turvy view of 'acceptance'.

And I'm with those who say this attack at root probably had little to do with 'fattism'--had the drunk woman seen someone with ginger hair or glasses instead, they would also have been abused. I once had a drugged-up teenage chav start on me for the crime of wearing cycling gear.

Finally, note that Ms. Coupe is originally from California and wants to make our laws like California's. While I'd never say "If you don't like it here...", you do have to wonder why she no longer chooses to live in her fat person's paradise.

- Liz, London, UK

Yes larger sized people could loose weight and "simply stop stuffing their pie-holes" as so eloquently put by Ted..
The issue isn't the health ramifications of being over weight, it is the complete unacceptability of abusing people for their appearance and discriminating against them on these grounds.
Whatever your take on weight issues it would be prudent to say we all agree it is unacceptable to abuse another individual, to mock or humiliate them for whatever reason, in a public place or forum is cruel and unjust.
The bigger picture at play here regards 'discrimination" and puts in place the very real question, If by law we cannot discriminate on grounds of gender, race, religion, sex, sexuality and age, is it now time to extend those parameters to body size, class, hair colour, dress etc
When Sophie Lancaster was beaten to death for being a goth, there weren't cry's of "well why didn't she just stop dressing like that"...it was her lifestyle and she should not have been allowed to suffer abuse and assault for this. The law should have protected her against this kind of bigotry and discrimination, and this follows on for persons of larger build.
We all have a right to choose the lifestyle we lead, we also have a right to be protected from assault and offence if these choices are infringed upon and attacked by others in a damning and negative fashion.
This is not about health it's about personal preservation, dignity and civility

- Wayne, London

Whether or not being overweight is healthy is not the issue; this woman was attacked because a self-righteous little thug took exception to her appearance and attacked her.
I am disapointed in my fellow British people for daring to suggest that this is in some way her fault. The person who attacked her is a violent criminal but most of the people commenting here are blaming the victim.

- S. Smith, London

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23758001-protect-us-from-abuse-says-woman-beaten-for-being-fat.do

[thatgirl08]

I think that London is generally more tolerant of diversity compared to other parts of UK, but there will always be a vocal and possibly violent minority.

It is not just fat people who get targeted, though all the sensationalist news reports about fat people leeching off the NHS and claiming disability benefits and welfare because they are too lazy to work doesn't help matters. Recently I got assaulted by a (female) stranger on the streets of London because she thought I was too thin. It was nowhere near as bad as what the poor lady in the news endured, but I did get some nasty bruises on my ribs and was pretty shaken by the experience.

I'm really sorry to hear that happened to you. I hope you're okay.

[Zoom]

Should discrimination against overweight people be made a hate crime?
* Yes 51%
* No 49%
Thank you for votingLooks like I cast the deciding vote. :) And I don't even live in the UK.

[Brach311]

How long have I been whining and moaning that fat people are treated a lot differently/worse here than they are in the US? And London is tolerant compared to where I live.

Yeah my mom is British and her whole side of the family thinks overweight people are synonymous with lazy people. My mom is extremely nice to every girlfriend I have ever had. However she has asked me several time "Why do you date these fat women, you could do so much better?" "Or why do you like fat girls?"

Even though she is super nice to these girls, and my current girlfriend loves my mom to death, I know my mom will always prefer that I was with a more athletic person. I haven't told my girlfriend that her weight bothers my mom in order to preserve the great friendship they share.

Interestingly my dad is American (my parents are divorced) and the issue of weight hasn't come up once with his side of the family.

[Weirdo890]

Good Lord, just when you think that people couldn't surprise you anymore, something like this throws me for a loop. I've been verbally hassled for being fat before (mostly in junior high school), but I've never been hit or beaten for it. Unacceptable is too nice a word for this. :mad: I want there to be laws passed so that discrimination like this is outlawed. There can never be equality until there is equity.

[jewels_mystery]

I can not believe that happened. I wonder why no one tried to help her.

[tonynyc]

I can not believe that happened. I wonder why no one tried to help her.

A good percentage of the time people do not get involved. It goes back to the Kitty Genovese Case-1964 (http://riverdaughter.wordpress.com/2009/08/02/a-fascinating-intersection-of-true-crime-psychology-and-media-misinformation/) where Criminologist, Sociologist and Pyschologist would begin to study the phenomena of Bystander Intervention.

[littlefairywren]

Yeah, sadly, here in the UK there's a 3,000year old tradition of getting drunk on a night and beating the the shit out of random people... There's an awful lot of scumbags here... :(

We don't have such a long history, but we have some of that culture here I am afraid. Not always proud to be an Aussie:(

[GutsGirl]

Yeah my mom is British and her whole side of the family thinks overweight people are synonymous with lazy people. My mom is extremely nice to every girlfriend I have ever had. However she has asked me several time "Why do you date these fat women, you could do so much better?" "Or why do you like fat girls?"

Even though she is super nice to these girls, and my current girlfriend loves my mom to death, I know my mom will always prefer that I was with a more athletic person. I haven't told my girlfriend that her weight bothers my mom in order to preserve the great friendship they share.

I honestly wouldn't say that your mom is 'nice' to your girlfriends, then. Personally, I utterly despise it when people are nice to my face, but then talk disparagingly about me behind my back. The only 'friend' they would be to me would be a false friend.

Who you are sexually attracted to, who you date, and how much your dates weigh are none of your mom's business, and she needs to drop these conversations about your preferences and keep her nosey, bigoted opinions to herself.

Also, I suspect that eventually your girlfriend will find out that her weight bothers your mom. That facade of friendliness has to slip sometime.

[GutsGirl]

Why is it interesting?

I would suspect it is because people generally don't think of women -- especially two strangers who have never had any prior altercation before -- as usually being so physically violent to other women or to people in general, especially in public. Honestly, it is a bit surprising to me, too. I would think that most fatphobic women would confine their hatred of a large person to words, but I guess not, in this case. :(

[moore2me]

What happened to the woman in London was horrible and criminal. The offending assailant should serve time and pay damages. Bystanders who just watched and could have helped should suffer moral indignities (such as the when the Pilgrims would put folks in stocks).

My advice to other fat women when traveling alone in strange places is to -
1. Act confident but friendly. Hold your head up proudly and act like an alpha female. Look into others eyes. Show them you are a vibrant woman and not someone to be messed with. (Half of an exchange between people is done without talking.) But, be friendly. Smile, nod your head (if appropriate) or speak (if appropriate) and say "hello" or "good morning" or "what beautiful hair you have" or "what a sweet baby". (Women have more liberty to make this kind of exchange than men do.)

If things start to get dicey, have a pre-arranged plan for what your strategy would be. For myself, I have a huge, well developed, set of vocal cords that could probably paralyze most folks - I've mentioned this verbal karate before. Some of the best things to scream are short and/or alarming. NO! STOP! (or taking advantage of what folks fear most) SNAKE! SNAKE! SNAKE!. You can also scream FIRE! but be aware that there may be laws against this in crowded theaters or crowded places.

You might also decide ahead of time to charge your tormentor as Tooz or Surlysomething mentioned. You may want to beef up on self defense if this is your choice and you need more practice. Others carry tools for assistance in self defense but many of these are not legal in some areas (such as pepper spray). However, a savvy defender can use a cane or a set of car keys to defend their selves if they know how.

But remember, your best defense is to use your brain to not go down the dark road to begin with.

[jewels_mystery]

A good percentage of the time people do not get involved. It goes back to the Kitty Genovese Case-1964 (http://riverdaughter.wordpress.com/2009/08/02/a-fascinating-intersection-of-true-crime-psychology-and-media-misinformation/) where Criminologist, Sociologist and Pyschologist would begin to study the phenomena of Bystander Intervention.

We studied that case several times when I was working on my undergrad (social work).

[Lamia]

What happened to the woman in London was horrible and criminal. The offending assailant should serve time and pay damages. Bystanders who just watched and could have helped should suffer moral indignities (such as the when the Pilgrims would put folks in stocks).

My advice to other fat women when traveling alone in strange places is to -
1. Act confident but friendly. Hold your head up proudly and act like an alpha female. Look into others eyes. Show them you are a vibrant woman and not someone to be messed with. (Half of an exchange between people is done without talking.) But, be friendly. Smile, nod your head (if appropriate) or speak (if appropriate) and say "hello" or "good morning" or "what beautiful hair you have" or "what a sweet baby". (Women have more liberty to make this kind of exchange than men do.)

If things start to get dicey, have a pre-arranged plan for what your strategy would be. For myself, I have a huge, well developed, set of vocal cords that could probably paralyze most folks - I've mentioned this verbal karate before. Some of the best things to scream are short and/or alarming. NO! STOP! (or taking advantage of what folks fear most) SNAKE! SNAKE! SNAKE!. You can also scream FIRE! but be aware that there may be laws against this in crowded theaters or crowded places.

You might also decide ahead of time to charge your tormentor as Tooz or Surlysomething mentioned. You may want to beef up on self defense if this is your choice and you need more practice. Others carry tools for assistance in self defense but many of these are not legal in some areas (such as pepper spray). However, a savvy defender can use a cane or a set of car keys to defend their selves if they know how.

But remember, your best defense is to use your brain to not go down the dark road to begin with.

My defense is "Swayze the knee" then rip their throat out....Roadhouse has lots of good tips.

:)

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

What happened to the woman in London was horrible and criminal. The offending assailant should serve time and pay damages. Bystanders who just watched and could have helped should suffer moral indignities (such as the when the Pilgrims would put folks in stocks).



Violent people in the UK tend to carry knives. People want no part of it. There is a very serious anti social culture here....like I've never seen in any part of the states. People are fucking crazy.

[Weirdo890]

What happened to the woman in London was horrible and criminal. The offending assailant should serve time and pay damages. Bystanders who just watched and could have helped should suffer moral indignities (such as the when the Pilgrims would put folks in stocks).


I like the stocks idea. I think the assailant should get a public paddling with a cricket bat that has a few holes drilled into it (to decrease wind-resistance).

[Cors]

What happened to the woman in London was horrible and criminal. The offending assailant should serve time and pay damages. Bystanders who just watched and could have helped should suffer moral indignities (such as the when the Pilgrims would put folks in stocks).


One may have a moral obligation to assist someone who is being attacked, but there is certainly no legal duty to do so unless you have a special relationship with that person (eg. parent, caretaker, medic or police officer on duty) and owe them a duty of care.

BBSSBBW is right about the knife culture in London and it really is pretty damn scary. Most people will not risk their lives to assist a stranger, especially if s/he is being attacked by a group. Regular news reports about Good Samaritans being beaten, sometimes to death probably makes people even more fearful.

[thatgirl08]

Just want to add that using a set of keys against a person, especially if they're armed, is not a good idea. Not only is it largely ineffective but it's likely to anger the offender even more and a lot of times it ends up hurting your own hand more (by being pushed back into it) then it does the person you're trying to protect yourself from. In newer self defense classes they focus on running and yelling for help over trying to beat the shit out of someone.

[bexy]

George and I were assaulted in the street in Belfast a few weeks ago because of our hair. It was a Saturday afternoon, middle of the city centre, and we had Ivy with us in our pram. AND NOT ONE PERSON HELPED US. People just stay away. It's ridiculous but it's out of fear I suppose. I'm angry that no one helped but I don't hate them for it. Disgusted though, as I know I would. I have, on 2 occasions, gotten involved in an incident to try to help.

[mergirl]

If people are looking to beat somone up they will find any reason. Fat, thin, hair colour, supporting the wrong football team. Its not like there has been a wave of physical attacks against fat people. It was the 'mail on sunday'- sensationalisim at its best. The Uk does have a bad knife culture though the gun deaths in the US far surpass the knife killings here, so its really not safer in say Newyork as say in London..The tabloids here are rediculous.. Like the headline about the 'fat peoples kids being taken away from them' ...If you actually read further down a spokes person from the social work department said weight would never be the only factor for taking someones kids away. I'm sure this is a desperate attempt from the parents to get their kids back, when half the story will have been left out. I know that fat people can be treated like second class citizens but i think in both these cases the media has chosen to focus on aspects that are not totally indicitive of that.

[dcoyote]

Wow, I'm now too scared to go to London. No one tells you this kind of thing. It's actually making the part of Richmond, VA my sister lives in sound nice. It isn't either. It's technically not the getto, but it is near it.


Thank goodness I live it the country. I'm a lover not a fighter. I'd go down fast. Except for my sister, I've never been in a fist fight over anything. You might get a bit of flack for being something here, but not assaulted. Well, maybe if you go around some of the old raciest drunks, but they're avoidable. It's just best to avoid them in general.

[Gingembre]

What happened to that woman is awful, but unfortuantely I'm not surprised. Certain parts of the UK are very antifat and very antisocial...it's just not the done thing to talk to people you don't know in a queue or whatever, let alone to stand up for someone else - knife crime is an issue here and the media hype surrounding people who intervene in fights being stabbed puts people off helping others even more. So a lot of people tend to keep their heads down and keep themselves to themselves. Sad, but true.

I agree with Mergirl & Bexy that people will start on you for any reason, tho, if they're in that frame of mind. I don't live in a rough place, and have never felt afraid or physically threatened here. However, on many occasions I have had verbal abuse shouted at me in the street. It used to be directed at my size, but now that I have lost some weight, it's because i'm a natural redhead instead (the other day i had "copper minge" yelled at me from a car full of lads as i walked home from work). Delightful.

[joswitch]

What happened to that woman is awful, but unfortuantely I'm not surprised. Certain parts of the UK are very antifat and very antisocial...it's just not the done thing to talk to people you don't know in a queue or whatever, let alone to stand up for someone else - knife crime is an issue here and the media hype surrounding people who intervene in fights being stabbed puts people off helping others even more. So a lot of people tend to keep their heads down and keep themselves to themselves. Sad, but true.

Yeah. Some of us do intervene sometimes though*. I score interupting two different wifebeaters, on two different occasions, beating their missus in the street... and sicc'ing the coppers onto them so far this year. For what that's worth, which is precious little... but, hey...

(*useful kit, for those that do: www.bladerunner.tv note: they size at LEAST one size smaller than label description! e.g. if you take an L, order at least XL)


I agree with Mergirl & Bexy that people will start on you for any reason, tho, if they're in that frame of mind. I don't live in a rough place, and have never felt afraid or physically threatened here. However, on many occasions I have had verbal abuse shouted at me in the street. It used to be directed at my size, but now that I have lost some weight, it's because i'm a natural redhead instead (the other day i had "copper minge" yelled at me from a car full of lads as i walked home from work). Delightful.

People are vermin. And yet, if I started Xing them, I'd be put in jail. Truly, there is NO justice. :p

[Gingembre]

Yeah. Some of us do intervene sometimes though*.

Immature aside in-joke = yes, but you have the fighty stick. Seriously, though, some people are better equipped to intervene that others. Like, you know how to fight...I have never hit/kicked/whatever anyone, not sure how that would work out. In all honesty, I'd like to say I'd intervene if I saw a fight, but I'm not at all sure that i would. Depends on the situation.

[joswitch]

Violent people in the UK tend to carry knives. People want no part of it. There is a very serious anti social culture here....like I've never seen in any part of the states. People are fucking crazy.

True dat. I saw a full scale (like 40odd people) riot kick off in the centre of town a couple months back. Was batshit bonkers. Ever watch "The Football Factory"? was like that, but for real. :(

[joswitch]

Immature aside in-joke = yes, but you have the fighty stick. Seriously, though, some people are better equipped to intervene that others. Like, you know how to fight...I have never hit/kicked/whatever anyone, not sure how that would work out. In all honesty, I'd like to say I'd intervene if I saw a fight, but I'm not at all sure that i would. Depends on the situation.

:p@fighty stick:p

Yeah, I'm not advocating anyone else step outside their comfort zone. Just sayin' I have is all... Thankless task etc.... Why you up so late anyway?
I need ZZZZzzzzz.... time for me to ride home!

[dcoyote]

Certain parts of the UK are very antifat and very antisocial...it's just not the done thing to talk to people you don't know in a queue or whatever

Woah wait up, you don't talk to people you don't know while waiting in lines over there? Good lord! You can't escape people that want to just chat and chat with anyone while waiting around over here.

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

The Uk does have a bad knife culture though the gun deaths in the US far surpass the knife killings here, so its really not safer in say Newyork as say in London...

I disagree with this. The statistics may show more gun crime, but typically in America you have to be fucking with the wrong people or hanging in the wrong place. (And you should know who and what these are if you are from the area) Here in the UK there is no safe place. I've never seen such madness.

After living here I cannot see why the british are considered so reserved. People are always shouting, or glaring, letting you know exactly how you feel. That is not reserved.

And if I had to chose, I'd rather be shot than stabbed to death.

[Gingembre]

Woah wait up, you don't talk to people you don't know while waiting in lines over there? Good lord! You can't escape people that want to just chat and chat with anyone while waiting around over here.

Depends...in the North of the UK, people tend to be hella friendly and will chit chat away. But in the South, most people will look at you like you're a crazy if you start talking them (like, "you don't know me, go away") in a line or something. Maybe that's the reservedness???

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

Maybe that's the reservedness???

LOL that's such a poor excuse for rudeness and snobbishness. Seriously. Every time I heard the word reserved to describe the english, I laugh.

[MatthewB]

What an awful crime; English politeness, indeed... :mad:

[mergirl]

I disagree with this. The statistics may show more gun crime, but typically in America you have to be fucking with the wrong people or hanging in the wrong place. (And you should know who and what these are if you are from the area) Here in the UK there is no safe place. I've never seen such madness.

After living here I cannot see why the british are considered so reserved. People are always shouting, or glaring, letting you know exactly how you feel. That is not reserved.

And if I had to chose, I'd rather be shot than stabbed to death.
In Scotland you have to be in the wrong place and messing with the wrong people too. From what ive seen the same goes for the rest of the UK. I lived in Glasgow for about 6 years, which is the 'Murder capital of Europe' (we are so proud), i knew the places to avoid and the places that i could walk about at 2am alone and know that i would be safe. I cold see how if people didn't actually come from Glasgow that they might be frightened and also how they could wander into the 'bad' areas.
Also in Scotland we chat to everyone we see pretty much. I was out walking my dog there and about four people said 'goodmorning' to me...when its a sunny day even more people talk to you. I'm not sure you have had enough experience of enough of the UK to say that we are unfriendly. Scottish people are rated as being among the friendliest in the world.. as well as the most murdersome.. Its a mixed bag really and makes for an exciting life! :)

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

In Scotland you have to be in the wrong place and messing with the wrong people too. From what ive seen the same goes for the rest of the UK. I lived in Glasgow for about 6 years, which is the 'Murder capital of Europe' (we are so proud), i knew the places to avoid and the places that i could walk about at 2am alone and know that i would be safe. I cold see how if people didn't actually come from Glasgow that they might be frightened and also how they could wander into the 'bad' areas.
Also in Scotland we chat to everyone we see pretty much. I was out walking my dog there and about four people said 'goodmorning' to me...when its a sunny day even more people talk to you. I'm not sure you have had enough experience of enough of the UK to say that we are unfriendly. Scottish people are rated as being among the friendliest in the world.. as well as the most murdersome.. Its a mixed bag really and makes for an exciting life! :)

I've hear way too many stories from firsthand witnesses about knife crimes that happen on public transport. Scares me to bits. And what about the bloke beaten to death walking home from the shop?? Or the goth girl, killed for dressing goth?

I drove through Long Beach, CA where there are bars on the windows of all the shops and dodgy people hanging everywhere. It was a bit scary, but that it how I feel all the time in the UK....you never know what it is about you that could piss the wrong person off and you end up dead.

[mergirl]

I've hear way too many stories from firsthand witnesses about knife crimes that happen on public transport. Scares me to bits. And what about the bloke beaten to death walking home from the shop?? Or the goth girl, killed for dressing goth?

I drove through Long Beach, CA where there are bars on the windows of all the shops and dodgy people hanging everywhere. It was a bit scary, but that it how I feel all the time in the UK....you never know what it is about you that could piss the wrong person off and you end up dead.
Ive never ever felt that if i pissed the wrong person off i could end up dead. I mean tecnically this 'could' happen but it would be very unlikely. (touch wood). Its a shame that you feel like that in the UK. Maby you live in a dodgy area because honestly its really not all like that. Stop reading the tabloids!!! They report incidents like that simply because they are rare and also i think because they are trying to freak people out to sell more papers. People love a bit of gory sensationalism. In saying that my friend is a Doctor and worked in A and E in a Glasgow hospital for a while and she treated someone who had a samuri sword stuck in his back!! He was a dodgy character though.. but still!! madness!!!!

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

Ive never ever felt that if i pissed the wrong person off i could end up dead. I mean tecnically this 'could' happen but it would be very unlikely. (touch wood). Its a shame that you feel like that in the UK. Maby you live in a dodgy area because honestly its really not all like that. Stop reading the tabloids!!! They report incidents like that simply because they are rare and also i think because they are trying to freak people out to sell more papers. People love a bit of gory sensationalism. In saying that my friend is a Doctor and worked in A and E in a Glasgow hospital for a while and she treated someone who had a samuri sword stuck in his back!! He was a dodgy character though.. but still!! madness!!!!

I live in the south in a pretty chavtastic area. It isn't just me though. Mike doesn't feel as safe here as he does in the US. He probably just makes my fear worse, but everywhere I look are "youths" with their hoods up walkin around in gangs.

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

How can you feel safe with happy slapping (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_slapping) going on? It is terrifying in this country. In America usually you have to do something retarded to get your ass kicked.

[mergirl]

I live in the south in a pretty chavtastic area. It isn't just me though. Mike doesn't feel as safe here as he does in the US. He probably just makes my fear worse, but everywhere I look are "youths" with their hoods up walkin around in gangs.
Most of the time the youths in hoods are just kids. I can understand why you are frightened though, i think if you are used to the ways and rituals and behaviours of one place and then swap it all for another place you don't know where you stand. Even the small differences can seem huge and make you feel isolated and fearful. Its sad that Mike feels the same. I moved to a different part of Scotland about a year ago and i felt a bit on edge for a while, the people here have different ways, accents and i wasn't sure how to take their tone at first. My gf has lived here since she was wee, so knows the people and the places that are ok, so i think that made my transition a bit more smooth.
Again, though seriously Dondra 'happy slapping' really isn't that common. I have never heard of anyone it has happened to. Ive never even heard of anyone who has heard of anyone it has happened to. It gets reported in the papers because, again, it is rare. I really dont think this country is any worse than America in the violence stakes (In many cases i think it is much less violent here) I do think our media sensationalises societal problems in 'moral panic' kind of a way wheras America seems to focus on gangs and guncrime, which seem so out of reach for so many that a lot of people assume they are safe and away from the bad stuff. Maby you need to move to a wee village in the scottish highlands, or hire some body guards!! :D

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

See that's the thing....I know someone it happened to. It wasn't enough to put him in hospital or anything, but for fucks sake.....people are animals. I guess the thing I struggle with is that in America, while there are terrible random crimes, it is usually criminal against criminal whereas here it is crazy ass person vs normal person minding their own business. I'm just too much of a wussie for this place, lol.

There's no place like home. There's no place like home. There's no place like home.

Fuck. It didn't work.

[mergirl]

See that's the thing....I know someone it happened to. It wasn't enough to put him in hospital or anything, but for fucks sake.....people are animals. I guess the thing I struggle with is that in America, while there are terrible random crimes, it is usually criminal against criminal whereas here it is crazy ass person vs normal person minding their own business. I'm just too much of a wussie for this place, lol.

There's no place like home. There's no place like home. There's no place like home.

Fuck. It didn't work.
aww tough luck dorothy! :D Maby it is, just where you live.. maby you should think about relocating. If there are jobs going in the nice places. See i'm sure there is a lot of crazy people attacking normal people in America too. Think you are just homesick and making America into a Eutopia in your head. It really does depend on where you live..the same as America.

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

aww tough luck dorothy! :D Maby it is, just where you live.. maby you should think about relocating. If there are jobs going in the nice places. See i'm sure there is a lot of crazy people attacking normal people in America too. Think you are just homesick and making America into a Eutopia in your head. It really does depend on where you live..the same as America.

That's a fair comment, lol. America is like the promised land in my head. I think it is because I have independence and an identity there other than the really fat woman. And I'm a bit street wise in America....I have my wits about me. Here, I can't read people as well and feel very vulnerable and scared.

I've been here almost 3 fucking years. I need to get over it already, lol. I've found the answer. GET ANGRY, hold your head up high and be ready to face a lot of grumpy ass people.

I hear Scotland is very nice. I want to go there some day and experience for myself. I've been to North Wales and the people were lovely and quaint:) Loved it!

I need more UK friends once I am able to get out and do things....so I can see just how much of my paranoia is from my chicken shit husband.

[mergirl]

That's a fair comment, lol. America is like the promised land in my head. I think it is because I have independence and an identity there other than the really fat woman. And I'm a bit street wise in America....I have my wits about me. Here, I can't read people as well and feel very vulnerable and scared.

I've been here almost 3 fucking years. I need to get over it already, lol. I've found the answer. GET ANGRY, hold your head up high and be ready to face a lot of grumpy ass people.

I hear Scotland is very nice. I want to go there some day and experience for myself. I've been to North Wales and the people were lovely and quaint:) Loved it!

I need more UK friends once I am able to get out and do things....so I can see just how much of my paranoia is from my chicken shit husband.
Yes, you must bring your clucking husband and yourself up to Scotland for a wee visit sometime!. We would love to have you stay. :) Its incredible how much 'fat' becomes part of our identity, which isn't helped by the fact there are not many ssbbws in the UK. I think when you get more close friends here who know the inside you the less the 'fat woman' identity will consume the rest of you... hmm if you get what i'm saying? I have a way of rambling around the point, i'm sure others would be able to be more succinct. x

[Ben from England]

Whilst what happened to that woman was obviously terrible and I'd agree that it is indicitive of the less fat friendly culture over here (largely because there are less fat people knocking about I think), I think you're going a bit overboard with the whole climate of fear we exist in, Donnie!

The whole 'it is terrifying in this country', backed up by anecdotal evidence seen through shit tinted glasses seems dangerously close to the ignorant discussions I hear all the time about how things used to be back in nostalgia land. I understand that you may have had some bad experiences that could negatively colour your perception of youth culture and all that shit, but from where I'm sat (in a council flat in the ghetto's of Portsmouth lol), so much of that fear and momentum is smoke from a tiny fire fueled by a combination of retarded media looking for sound bite issues to hang their ratings/sales on, ignorance and total unwillingness to engage. Occasionally, yes, shit happens because of some tool kicking off, but going out their 'prepared to face a lot of grumpy ass people' is a self fulfilling prophecy. Building up walls and forming solid preconceptions will not make a happy bunny.

Also, I don't really consider myself patriotic. I'm not particularly proud to be British, but every time you paint the ENTIRE nation as rude or snobbish it ever so slightly niggles me! I don't know if it's the slight stirring of hurt national pride or just a knee jerk recoil towards sweeping statements.

That said, if I were fat I'd rather live in the States as well.

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

Whilst what happened to that woman was obviously terrible and I'd agree that it is indicitive of the less fat friendly culture over here (largely because there are less fat people knocking about I think), I think you're going a bit overboard with the whole climate of fear we exist in, Donnie!

The whole 'it is terrifying in this country', backed up by anecdotal evidence seen through shit tinted glasses seems dangerously close to the ignorant discussions I hear all the time about how things used to be back in nostalgia land. I understand that you may have had some bad experiences that could negatively colour your perception of youth culture and all that shit, but from where I'm sat (in a council flat in the ghetto's of Portsmouth lol), so much of that fear and momentum is smoke from a tiny fire fueled by a combination of retarded media looking for sound bite issues to hang their ratings/sales on, ignorance and total unwillingness to engage. Occasionally, yes, shit happens because of some tool kicking off, but going out their 'prepared to face a lot of grumpy ass people' is a self fulfilling prophecy. Building up walls and forming solid preconceptions will not make a happy bunny.

Also, I don't really consider myself patriotic. I'm not particularly proud to be British, but every time you paint the ENTIRE nation as rude or snobbish it ever so slightly niggles me! I don't know if it's the slight stirring of hurt national pride or just a knee jerk recoil towards sweeping statements.

That said, if I were fat I'd rather live in the States as well.

They arent preconceptions. I've been here 3 years. No body smiles, no body says hello....that to me is grumpy ass people. Call it ignorance, but it is my experience.

[CurvyEm]

I dunno. Where I live the people are sooooooo friendly. I had the neighbours Mum come round the other day to give me £20 and a card for my wedding. I never see any chavs in my area and I've never heard of any crime at all. Maybe it is because I live in a great area and because I avoid the chavvy areas. I always end up having chats with taxi drivers, shop staff, people in bars and clubs, everywhere I go really. I've even been lent shampoo at the swimming baths by a lady who noticed I didn't have any haha

I have lived in bad areas too and whilst there was crime the people were usually friendly and welcoming.

I've lived in the northwest, manchester, and the midlands.

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

I dunno. Where I live the people are sooooooo friendly. I had the neighbours Mum come round the other day to give me £20 and a card for my wedding. I never see any chavs in my area and I've never heard of any crime at all. Maybe it is because I live in a great area and because I avoid the chavvy areas. I always end up having chats with taxi drivers, shop staff, people in bars and clubs, everywhere I go really. I've even been lent shampoo at the swimming baths by a lady who noticed I didn't have any haha

I have lived in bad areas too and whilst there was crime the people were usually friendly and welcoming.

I've lived in the northwest, manchester, and the midlands.


hmmm then maybe it all really is because I am freakishly fat. And like I said, even my husband if fearful...and I take a lot of my opinions from him as he is the only human that I have a lot of contact with.

[CurvyEm]

hmmm then maybe it all really is because I am freakishly fat. And like I said, even my husband if fearful...and I take a lot of my opinions from him as he is the only human that I have a lot of contact with.

You're not a freak. :) I don't know why Mike is scared? Maybe he hasn't really mixed with the people hes scared of or maybe the area you live in is a really bad one? I don't know your area so I couldn't say.

[Ruby Ripples]

Am I the only one here that thinks this woman's ordeal was nothing to do with being fat, but just that the nutcase that attacked her, was looking for a victim and thought she was the easiest target?

I have to post here to try to help even up the UK attack, to say that I am 45 yrs old, I have lived in very good, to very bad areas, been to nightclubs and bars for years, socialised and worked all over my city, Glasgow, and have NEVER been attacked. I have also never been shouted at in public or called a fat name, even though im now fatter than most people here. The last time I was physically able to do some grocery shopping, I lugged the bags out of the boot of the taxi and dumped them on the pavement, prior to the horrible job of lugging them up to my top floor flat. Five "chavs" suddenly surrounded me, glaring faces.. skinhead hairdo's, two brandishing irn bru bottles menacingly.... then one said "want us tae carry yer bags up the stairs fur ye, missus?"

I don't think I have EVER stood at a bus stop here and not ended up in a full conversation with whoever else was there. Same in any shop queue.

Yes we have bad knife crime rates in our city, but virtually all of them are gang related. Its still rare for someone to be knifed apart from that. If you're not in a gang, you are very unlikely to ever be in trouble.

ps. The only person I know ever to have been mugged, is my son. He was mugged three years ago, by five male asylum seekers, none of them European never mind British.

pps. I live in what would be considered a rough street, if not a rough area, and yesterday i was sitting on the step outside my building, waiting on a lift to arrive. About five people walked past as I was waiting, and every one of them said hi, or nodded.

Maybe it helps that I have a happy face, so people feel positive towards me? :)

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

Am I the only one here that thinks this woman's ordeal was nothing to do with being fat, but just that the nutcase that attacked her, was looking for a victim and thought she was the easiest target?

I have to post here to try to help even up the UK attack, to say that I am 45 yrs old, I have lived in very good, to very bad areas, been to nightclubs and bars for years, socialised and worked all over my city, Glasgow, and have NEVER been attacked. I have also never been shouted at in public or called a fat name, even though im now fatter than most people here. The last time I was physically able to do some grocery shopping, I lugged the bags out of the boot of the taxi and dumped them on the pavement, prior to the horrible job of lugging them up to my top floor flat. Five "chavs" suddenly surrounded me, glaring faces.. skinhead hairdo's, two brandishing irn bru bottles menacingly.... then one said "want us tae carry yer bags up the stairs fur ye, missus?"

I don't think I have EVER stood at a bus stop here and not ended up in a full conversation with whoever else was there. Same in any shop queue.

Yes we have bad knife crime rates in our city, but virtually all of them are gang related. Its still rare for someone to be knifed apart from that. If you're not in a gang, you are very unlikely to ever be in trouble.

ps. The only person I know ever to have been mugged, is my son. He was mugged three years ago, by five male asylum seekers, none of them European never mind British.

pps. I live in what would be considered a rough street, if not a rough area, and yesterday i was sitting on the step outside my building, waiting on a lift to arrive. About five people walked past as I was waiting, and every one of them said hi, or nodded.

Maybe it helps that I have a happy face, so people feel positive towards me? :)

Lisa has already put forward that I need to get my ass outta this place and come see your beautiful country. I really thing Mike moved me to the worst place for fat friendliness and crime....and his chicken shit attitude doesn't help any.

But some day I hope to make it up your way...so that I can say the UK is great....Berkshire is shit, lol.

[joswitch]

Whilst what happened to that woman was obviously terrible and I'd agree that it is indicitive of the less fat friendly culture over here (largely because there are less fat people knocking about I think), I think you're going a bit overboard with the whole climate of fear we exist in, Donnie!

The whole 'it is terrifying in this country', backed up by anecdotal evidence seen through shit tinted glasses seems dangerously close to the ignorant discussions I hear all the time about how things used to be back in nostalgia land. I understand that you may have had some bad experiences that could negatively colour your perception of youth culture and all that shit, but from where I'm sat (in a council flat in the ghetto's of Portsmouth lol), so much of that fear and momentum is smoke from a tiny fire fueled by a combination of retarded media looking for sound bite issues to hang their ratings/sales on, ignorance and total unwillingness to engage. Occasionally, yes, shit happens because of some tool kicking off, but going out their 'prepared to face a lot of grumpy ass people' is a self fulfilling prophecy. Building up walls and forming solid preconceptions will not make a happy bunny.

Also, I don't really consider myself patriotic. I'm not particularly proud to be British, but every time you paint the ENTIRE nation as rude or snobbish it ever so slightly niggles me! I don't know if it's the slight stirring of hurt national pride or just a knee jerk recoil towards sweeping statements.

That said, if I were fat I'd rather live in the States as well.

I went on holiday to Portsmouth, well Portland Bill... your chav quota is lowlowlow and the ones I saw were meek and mild... y'should take a trip to the 'ding (Reading that is) it's properly chavtacular!:p

[joswitch]

Lisa has already put forward that I need to get my ass outta this place and come see your beautiful country. I really thing Mike moved me to the worst place for fat friendliness and crime....and his chicken shit attitude doesn't help any.

But some day I hope to make it up your way...so that I can say the UK is great....Berkshire is shit, lol.

OMG! you're in Berkshire too! Yeah, it's way anti-fat and v.v. chavvy, so no wonder you're not enjoying it that much!

[BeautifulPoeticDisaster]

OMG! you're in Berkshire too! Yeah, it's way anti-fat and v.v. chavvy, so no wonder you're not enjoying it that much!

Im in fucking Thatcham, lol. Not too far from you. At least someone understands my hell!!!!!

[mergirl]

Lisa has already put forward that I need to get my ass outta this place and come see your beautiful country. I really thing Mike moved me to the worst place for fat friendliness and crime....and his chicken shit attitude doesn't help any.

But some day I hope to make it up your way...so that I can say the UK is great....Berkshire is shit, lol.
Aye..you need to come hang out with missy Ripples and i and we can take you around the rough parts of Glasgow where people will tip their hats off to you and give you a glimmer teeth smile!! :D lmao.
The clue is in the place 'Berk'-shire!
Hmm.. though we do have a place called 'cockermouth' -Ive never been and i dont want to!! lmao.

[joswitch]

Im in fucking Thatcham, lol. Not too far from you. At least someone understands my hell!!!!!

Oh jesus, Thatcham is fucking horrible! You'd be way better off in the 'ding even! or move to Pangbourne! It's bloody lovely up there and even the chavs are alright... In the summer I take the boat up there and stay as often as I can given work etc... There's a regualr train service 7days and late nights in/out of the 'ding, they've a bank, a butcher's, a grocers, a hardware store, a library, a little supermarket, a curry house, a working men's club, a bunch of great foodie pubs, a curry house and an awesome fish and chip shop!:D

[Gingembre]

Oh jesus, Thatcham is fucking horrible! You'd be way better off in the 'ding even! or move to Pangbourne! It's bloody lovely up there and even the chavs are alright... In the summer I take the boat up there and stay as often as I can given work etc... There's a regualr train service 7days and late nights in/out of the 'ding, they've a bank, a butcher's, a grocers, a hardware store, a library, a little supermarket, a curry house, a working men's club, a bunch of great foodie pubs, a curry house and an awesome fish and chip shop!:D

I'm afraid that I must agree...Thatcham is even worse than Newbs :( I feel your pain, Donnie *hug*

[Gingembre]

I dunno. Where I live the people are sooooooo friendly. I had the neighbours Mum come round the other day to give me £20 and a card for my wedding. I never see any chavs in my area and I've never heard of any crime at all. Maybe it is because I live in a great area and because I avoid the chavvy areas. I always end up having chats with taxi drivers, shop staff, people in bars and clubs, everywhere I go really. I've even been lent shampoo at the swimming baths by a lady who noticed I didn't have any haha

I have lived in bad areas too and whilst there was crime the people were usually friendly and welcoming.

I've lived in the northwest, manchester, and the midlands.

Em, it's coz you're Northern. People are waaaay friendlier once you get North of Birmingham.

[CurvyEm]

Em, it's coz you're Northern. People are waaaay friendlier once you get North of Birmingham.

We certainly are lol

[Shosh]

Whilst what happened to that woman was obviously terrible and I'd agree that it is indicitive of the less fat friendly culture over here (largely because there are less fat people knocking about I think), I think you're going a bit overboard with the whole climate of fear we exist in, Donnie!

The whole 'it is terrifying in this country', backed up by anecdotal evidence seen through shit tinted glasses seems dangerously close to the ignorant discussions I hear all the time about how things used to be back in nostalgia land. I understand that you may have had some bad experiences that could negatively colour your perception of youth culture and all that shit, but from where I'm sat (in a council flat in the ghetto's of Portsmouth lol), so much of that fear and momentum is smoke from a tiny fire fueled by a combination of retarded media looking for sound bite issues to hang their ratings/sales on, ignorance and total unwillingness to engage. Occasionally, yes, shit happens because of some tool kicking off, but going out their 'prepared to face a lot of grumpy ass people' is a self fulfilling prophecy. Building up walls and forming solid preconceptions will not make a happy bunny.

Also, I don't really consider myself patriotic. I'm not particularly proud to be British, but every time you paint the ENTIRE nation as rude or snobbish it ever so slightly niggles me! I don't know if it's the slight stirring of hurt national pride or just a knee jerk recoil towards sweeping statements.

That said, if I were fat I'd rather live in the States as well.

My cousins Rachel and Naomi have lived in the UK for more than a decade without incident.
There is always a small element of people that are feral and give the whole country a bad name when it is not warranted.

[loggamatt]

Isolated thoughts reading the thread...

1) Using pejorative words to describe an entire nation of people is quite simply racist and xenophobic. Having lived in the UK my entire life, I can assure you that I have met some people who are not entirely horrible here.

2) If there is one thing you can do while living in a country that is not your own to make your experience even less pleasant, it's complaining about how horrible that country is all the time. People who live there who are proud of their country will not take kindly to this and it's not a good way to make friends.

3) Disabled people live in the UK. Many of them use wheelchairs to access places that don't have parking right outside.

4) Also, the lack of parking is not a European conspiracy against Americans... the fact is, most of our towns were built before cars existed and thus roads and parking facilities have had to be crowbarred in after the fact. Short of knocking down every building in the UK and starting again from scratch, there's not a whole lot that we can do about that.

5) (and back on topic of the thread) There are assholes everywhere in every country in the world. In the UK one day, a woman was assaulted on a train for being fat... I'm sure the next day, a woman was assaulted on a train in another country for being fat. We're talking about the UK here because this case happened to be reported... but people are being beaten up for all sorts of reasons in every country in the world every day. It's horrible. It shouldn't happen. But it does.

[joswitch]

@loggamatt... Dude don't rag on the Americans.. I'm UK born and raised and I've lived here nearly all my life, in nice places and not so nice places.. And I can tell you authoritatively that Thatcham is a total craphole, without fear of contradiction by anyone living there. And my bbw ex gfs have had loads of hassle and grief (at least one was physically attacked by one such abusive fuck) for being fat, here, in the UK.. Now maybe other countries are better or worse.. But I'll tell you what mate, I've travelled a lot, and Blighty sucks in a lot of ways, esp. as far as fat hatred is concerned, certainly down here in the South.. And seriously - chavs, neds, call 'em what you will, we're talking about them folk who go out of their way to make a pain in the arse of themselves on a regular basis, so let's not be wringing our hands for 'em, eh?

[moore2me]

George and I were assaulted in the street in Belfast a few weeks ago because of our hair. It was a Saturday afternoon, middle of the city centre, and we had Ivy with us in our pram. AND NOT ONE PERSON HELPED US. People just stay away. It's ridiculous but it's out of fear I suppose. I'm angry that no one helped but I don't hate them for it. Disgusted though, as I know I would. I have, on 2 occasions, gotten involved in an incident to try to help.

Bexy and George,

I think it is equally horrible that someone would assault you guys when you were carrying Ivy with you. To pick on an adult is one thing, to pick on a woman is another thing, but to deliberately put a baby in danger is downright barbaric. These days we only hear of it happening in countries in revolution, in drug dens, or in gang violence. Even animals (in most situations) protect their young and the young of others of their species.

I am truly sorry that it happened to you and little Ivy. I hope it never happens again with her in tow.

[Ruby Ripples]

@loggamatt... Dude don't rag on the Americans.. I'm UK born and raised and I've lived here nearly all my life, in nice places and not so nice places.. And I can tell you authoritatively that Thatcham is a total craphole, without fear of contradiction by anyone living there. And my bbw ex gfs have had loads of hassle and grief (at least one was physically attacked by one such abusive fuck) for being fat, here, in the UK.. Now maybe other countries are better or worse.. But I'll tell you what mate, I've travelled a lot, and Blighty sucks in a lot of ways, esp. as far as fat hatred is concerned, certainly down here in the South.. And seriously - chavs, neds, call 'em what you will, we're talking about them folk who go out of their way to make a pain in the arse of themselves on a regular basis, so let's not be wringing our hands for 'em, eh?

I don't believe he was ragging on Americans or wringing his hands for chavs either. Ive read his post over again and he was obviously just defending his country. I live in the UK, and Im the only ssbbw I know from Dims chat that hasnt had people shout rude names at me.. the others are all American. Some of them have even had people approach them in the supermarket and take items back out of their trolley.

If Thatcham is like you say, then maybe it would help if it was made clear that it's only Thatcham that is being called terrible, and not "the UK". Or if its one part of the south of England, then maybe that should be clear too. I truly believe that there will be as anti-fat areas in the US, I know Ive heard some terrible accounts from American ssbbws in chat.

The UK has modern, purpose built shopping centres built on the edges of every town and city, with wide, automatic doors, elevators, escalators, etc. Most have wheelchairs to use for free, they all have disabled, spacious loos. I live in an 800 year old city and I cannot moan about stairs being too steep or narrow, they were there long before me, and are obviously made for the majority of people, not those of unusual size. Also, given the cost of land here, and building regulations, new houses tend to be on the small side, to keep costs from being crazily high. Therefore, staircases will be narrowish and steep, to save on space. However... bunglaows are no more expensive and are available to buy. They also often have wider doors, slopes instead of steps, etc, to accommodate disabled people.

I can see that the UK is not as fat friendly as the US, in terms of plus size clothing, and things like cinemas having some bigger seats or liftable arm rests, and waiting rooms having armless seats. However, I believe this is simply because we are still not as fat as the US. I believe the main reason for that, is WW2 rationing. Some food rationing continued til 1954, fourteen years of calorie controlled rations. This left a real mindset of people being very aware of waste, and being careful with food, portion sizes etc. Families were brought up on what we would now consider very meagre portions of food, which were nutritionally fine, but low in cals, so there were few fat people. They were told by the Government how much of each foodstuff an adult or a child should be fed, and food was precious. This mentality has changed very slowly since then, our McDonalds portions I believe are still smaller than American ones. Though we have much bigger portion sizes generally now than we used to have, we know that when we or friends go to the US, they are stunned by the huge size of portions there. It is seen as "greedy" and "gluttonous", as we have not been used to that.

In another ten years, the UK will be much fatter than it is now, but will probably still not be as "fat friendly" if you will, as the US. Because we can't change the fact that we had food rationing and it made a mindset that isnt changing as quickly as our body sizes. We also have the added issue of the NHS. That will help to keep the "obesity epidemic" high in the media focus.

If I had the choice of being my size in the UK, or being my size in the US with more fat friendly facilities, Id choose being in the UK. Because I can GET proper medical care and treatment. I have a friend in the US who at 400lbs but healthy, couldnt get ANY insurance company to take her on, at any price at all.

I went onto a ramble there, typical me, sorry! Anyway, yes I dont think Matt was ragging or wringing, I think he was understandably annoyed.

I can't believe the US is some ... wonderful oasis of fat understanding. I bet that living in a third floor apartment in an old building in NYC, where it would be v difficult to have a car, would be an utter nightmare compared to living anywhere in England and having a car at your disposal. Just a thought.

[loggamatt]

I don't believe he was ragging on Americans or wringing his hands for chavs either. Ive read his post over again and he was obviously just defending his country. I live in the UK, and Im the only ssbbw I know from Dims chat that hasnt had people shout rude names at me.. the others are all American. Some of them have even had people approach them in the supermarket and take items back out of their trolley.

If Thatcham is like you say, then maybe it would help if it was made clear that it's only Thatcham that is being called terrible, and not "the UK". Or if its one part of the south of England, then maybe that should be clear too. I truly believe that there will be as anti-fat areas in the US, I know Ive heard some terrible accounts from American ssbbws in chat.

The UK has modern, purpose built shopping centres built on the edges of every town and city, with wide, automatic doors, elevators, escalators, etc. Most have wheelchairs to use for free, they all have disabled, spacious loos. I live in an 800 year old city and I cannot moan about stairs being too steep or narrow, they were there long before me, and are obviously made for the majority of people, not those of unusual size. Also, given the cost of land here, and building regulations, new houses tend to be on the small side, to keep costs from being crazily high. Therefore, staircases will be narrowish and steep, to save on space. However... bunglaows are no more expensive and are available to buy. They also often have wider doors, slopes instead of steps, etc, to accommodate disabled people.

I can see that the UK is not as fat friendly as the US, in terms of plus size clothing, and things like cinemas having some bigger seats or liftable arm rests, and waiting rooms having armless seats. However, I believe this is simply because we are still not as fat as the US. I believe the main reason for that, is WW2 rationing. Some food rationing continued til 1954, fourteen years of calorie controlled rations. This left a real mindset of people being very aware of waste, and being careful with food, portion sizes etc. Families were brought up on what we would now consider very meagre portions of food, which were nutritionally fine, but low in cals, so there were few fat people. They were told by the Government how much of each foodstuff an adult or a child should be fed, and food was precious. This mentality has changed very slowly since then, our McDonalds portions I believe are still smaller than American ones. Though we have much bigger portion sizes generally now than we used to have, we know that when we or friends go to the US, they are stunned by the huge size of portions there. It is seen as "greedy" and "gluttonous", as we have not been used to that.

In another ten years, the UK will be much fatter than it is now, but will probably still not be as "fat friendly" if you will, as the US. Because we can't change the fact that we had food rationing and it made a mindset that isnt changing as quickly as our body sizes. We also have the added issue of the NHS. That will help to keep the "obesity epidemic" high in the media focus.

If I had the choice of being my size in the UK, or being my size in the US with more fat friendly facilities, Id choose being in the UK. Because I can GET proper medical care and treatment. I have a friend in the US who at 400lbs but healthy, couldnt get ANY insurance company to take her on, at any price at all.

I went onto a ramble there, typical me, sorry! Anyway, yes I dont think Matt was ragging or wringing, I think he was understandably annoyed.

I can't believe the US is some ... wonderful oasis of fat understanding. I bet that living in a third floor apartment in an old building in NYC, where it would be v difficult to have a car, would be an utter nightmare compared to living anywhere in England and having a car at your disposal. Just a thought.

Spot on. Thanks Ruby, you have put my own points forward far more eloquently than I managed :)

It's interesting what you say about WW2 rationing... I'd never really considered that before but you may be onto something there. I think sometimes people from outside the UK don't realise how devastating WW2 was to the British economy and I only think we've really overcome those lingering hardships over the last 20 years. WW2 was the catalyst for the US realising it's potential as an economic superpower but it had the opposite effect on Britain. So, while the layout of British urban centres means this country will never be as 'fat friendly' as the US, decades of underinvestment in the country following WW2 has probably exacerbated that problem as well.

Bottom line is, we don't do it on purpose just to annoy Americans ;)

As for me being anti-American, anyone who knows me would know that's not the case. If someone was on here making sweeping statements about Americans, I would defend America just as vociferously.

[Sandie S-R]

Let's keep this thread on topic please.

/Mod

[CPProp]

I can not believe that happened. I wonder why no one tried to help her.

The most likely reason is fear of ending up the guilty party, particularly if your a male subduing a female, just making a Citizens arrest is fraught with danger as you would have to hold and restrain the attacker - leaving yourself wide open to molesting charges or assault charges. Its a sad reflection of current UK laws that the perpetrator of a crime seems to hold all the aces whilst the victim or anyone who assists do not have any or very few. - the good news is they are changing them slowly.

[Scorsese86]

The poll in the article, "should discrimination against overweight people be made a hate crime?"... am I the only one finding that one odd. So if you ask a random stranger "fatty" in an insulting way, that's suppoused to be all right, but not if you say the n-word to a black person, or faggot to someone who "looks" gay is a hate crime?
Or am I just too confused to get this?
Also, I saw the poll that it was very 50-50:eek: