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Old 03-10-2017, 03:42 AM   #95
TwoSwords
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
First, what you describe is not an emotion. It's an urge or a desire. You stated, in replying to me, that you are not prepared to trust a woman. If you don't trust her, you don't have 'distinctly-positive' emotions for her. You may think she looks attractive, but this is not an emotion.
This is incorrect, and a misunderstanding of my feelings.

Happiness and joy are feelings. Relief is a feeling. These feelings come about under certain conditions, and describing them any better than "I feel relieved/happy" requires going into specifics. If the only feelings I can explain are why I'm angry or miserable, then that's hardly a relationship I can imagine anyone wanting to be a part of.

Secondly, what I said was, and I quote...

"I want to trust someone again, which is why I'm still on the lookout for someone I can be open with"

If you have good evidence to think that the person you're talking to is about to jump down your throat for expressing your feelings, trusting them not to would be foolish. No, it's not a positive emotion to mistrust someone, and it's also not a positive emotion to get openly angry at someone who's only trying to pay you a compliment.

P.S.: You could make the same claim (urge, not feeling!) with regard to insecurity. Insecurity is an largely-unwarranted urge to despise good things about yourself, and/or yourself in general. In a certain sense, all emotions are urges.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
In the case of those who may have been derided for their appearance, the mere mention of their physical presentation could justifiably set off some alarms. Self-acceptance is self-acceptance, not your acceptance.
I don't expect anyone to accept me right away, but they'll have to do it at some point, or that's not much of a relationship, is it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
Of course there are many women of size who are completely comfortable with their appearance, who revel in it, and who are quite aware (without a validating opinion from a male) that they are attractive. To have this reiterated ad nauseum could be taken as an implication that perhaps they should be considered unattractive by most people, save for the White Knight graciously bestowing his praise.
I'm sorry to hear that, because as I've said, this is the one matter in which I have basically no choice. Yes, I can understand, in theory, how a person could think that black is white in this way, but unless there's some way for me to head this off and prevent it, I'm willing to accept that there's not much I can really do about it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
You don't get to decide what creeps someone out, any more than you can dictate what they should feel good about.
Or what I feel good/bad about. Admittedly true, but I seriously don't think that Kristal grew more and more emotionally stressed by leaps and bounds, the longer she avoided posting that here, which is just about all I can think of that would have justified it. I mean, it's not relevant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
There is no double standard at play here. I would wager that, without 'feelings of insecurity' (on the part of large women) to battle, you'd find it difficult to present yourself as a savior solely by dint of your dropping a few 'nice' words.
With those feelings, it's impossible to be even liked.

And yes, there is a blasted double standard. One class of people's feelings are being treated as trumping the feelings of another class of people. That's the application of different rules of conduct to different groups, which is what a double standard is.

I also don't appreciate the implication that I could, do or have take advantage of people's insecurities to make my feelings seem more legitimate. Ever since high school, I've sworn that I'd never inflict myself on any women until I knew it could work. It's why I start, as I said, with baby steps, and never manage to get past them due to the awful, awful insecurity that everyone seems to nurse.

Now, insecurity is an emotion of a sort (fear, essentially,) and I'm not fully convinced that people can alter their emotional state, but I am convinced that people can exercise effort, to face their fears, just as I, every day, face my far-stronger emotions and conquer them, in spite of the harm it does to my own emotional and psychological state. I think it's quite reasonable to expect people to accept at least some responsibility for the blasted choices they've made, instead of loading everything on me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
Why would someone's 'insecurity' not be worthy of consideration?
It is, provided that person is also willing to show consideration for the feelings of others, and doesn't demonstrate all the signs of someone who just snaps at every emotional (as you say) urge that occurs to them.

I've never criticized happily_married's suggestion that self-control should be practiced. I think it should be. I do it every day. The problem is that I seem to be the only one holding up a mountain here, while everyone else grins, and laughs, and cries, and gets mad over minutiae, and I'm sick of being that guy who shoulders the whole burden, while others shift responsibility.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
'Coddled'? Is that what common decency looks like to you?

Nobody is attacking 'feelings of admiration and delight'. What's being attacked is borderline harassment.
Incorrect. Harassment is a very specific thing; namely; "aggressive pressure or intimidation." If anyone is being harassed in this context, I am, by my own blasted emotions.

In a business or workplace context, harassment represents threats or the withholding of business rewards or payments in exchange for sexual favors of one sort or another (sometimes even just things like style of dress.) I have done nothing of the sort. Instead, I took the very reasonable position that a relationship cannot work if one of the people involved is entirely committed to opposing the normal feelings of the other person.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
I do not profess to speak on behalf of the Dimensions population en masse. We are not a monolith.

I am only expressing opinions based on empathy, respect, and consideration.
Not for everyone, and that's the problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
Rest assured, there could be many reasons people have taken exception to your views.
In a very real way, I expect people to find me challenging. None of my views, after all, are popular or well-liked (at least, none of the ones I've expressed here.) However, this has been such a big trend in my life that, past a certain point, I had to learn to justify myself with reason, rather than relying on others, who had only criticism to offer. I can do that now; I can present reasons for the things I say, do and even for my feelings, and as far as I can see, that's a darn sight more work than most people have put into examining their emotions. I still don't think that anything I've said here has been unreasonable or unfair. If anyone should be capable of accepting that the world contains people of many kinds, who should be treated, at the very least, with respect, and perhaps even some degree of sympathy for their struggle, (especially in cases where people are blasted determined to tell them that they have no hope, and no one will ever love them,) it's the people on this board, yet I see no degree of tolerance whatsoever when it's something you don't already like...

...Which is blasted hilarious, when you consider that that "something" is the whole reason this section of the board exists.

I'll keep watching this thread for useful tidbits, but I'm about ready to say, "forget this!"

Oh, and by the way...

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker View Post
Effusive praise for one's physical attributes from a stranger or casual acquaintance is...well, it's creepy.
Let's say, I don't feel like shouldering the emotional burden of responding to this, because I hate repeating myself, and that makes me feel uncomfortable, so instead, I just wave to you and tell you to re-read the entire thread, to learn why this doesn't apply to me (and it doesn't. I've explained that in spades.) Given that you've never asked me to do this, would that be fair to you?

To me, feeling uncomfortable around others has become a normal part of life, because others despise everything I treasure, and they're very open about it (on this issue and on numerous others.) Well, I see no reason whatsoever why they should have total license to terrify me by telling me that they think I've lost weight, but I can't even say anything good without being branded a degenerate. (And before you tell me I should consider how they feel, I do, [a consideration that I am not receiving in return, if you'll notice,] but I don't feel their feelings. I can't, so my knowledge of how they feel does nothing to make this situation any more fair. That's the point.)

I don't know whether you meant this comment to be an actual response to what I'd said, or just to the thread topic itself, so I don't know how I feel about it, other than confused.
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