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Old 11-30-2012, 07:41 PM   #26
bbwfairygirl
 
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Originally Posted by superodalisque View Post
IMO think people have to stop playing the shame game to be free. we are what we are. our poundage, our measurements our ages etc... it's all a part of us. why be ashamed? it's true that it's not all of who we are but but we should not be running from that part of ourselves. it's our body. it's something to love.

its the way we live the rest of our lives that determines what out lasting identity will be with other people and whether all we ever let them see is our size because that is all we're ever concentrated on. we are the ones who set our definitions. if you concentrate on fat that is what you'll be to the people around you.

we have a choice about whether we keep accepting what society throws at us and i think we really need to stop using society as a reason why we keep beating ourselves up over who and what we are. we know its bogus to define our worth by that but we do it anyway. at the point when you know its bogus it becomes your responsibility to stop torturing yourself with it. if someone still insists on torturing themselves with it they should ask themselves why and what road can they get on to feel that they are worth more than the self flagellation for something they don't even believe in.

people who keep buying into it and feeling ashamed about their own numbers are only supporting the messed up part of society by being secretive. it's not really worth complaining about if you're not willing to break that old tired taboo because like it or not you're a big part of it. until an individual person can address their size, numbers and all, with the same emotional investment as they do their hair or eye color nothing will ever change for them. it's inside of you not outside of you.
Playing devil's advocate here, the "easier said than done" aspect from my perspective and experiences with those who don't have, or haven't had, a good, healthy support network be it family, spiritual/religious, therapeutic or community life.

Unfortunately at times shame is almost forced upon a person. Take a child in elementary/middle school who is bullied for their size. Physically abused, called names, etc. Or a child growing up in a familial situation where they are abused in any way about how they look.

Someone who has been in a position where they receive no support, no understanding or expectation that they are valid just the way they are, how can they know that they shouldn't feel shame?

As adults we are supposed to be responsible for our actions, our lives, etc. but imagine going out to enjoy a picnic at a park, or walk the mall, etc. and you are bombarded incessantly by nasty comments, etc. Or trying to shop for clothes and none fit. Or having your Dr tell you that your problems are because you weight "X" number, etc. Over time it becomes difficult to avoid internalizing these comments and actions by others and shame can prevail.

I wholly believe we should not support and give into the numbers game but it can be easier said than done for many. How about people who read Cosmo or any other glam rag? That supports the numbers game. What about designer clothes? Shopping at Whole Foods? Visiting the dr's office? There are so many pieces of our lives that support the numbers game so we have to take a close look as to how to change this and to know that it can be a challenge for many to overcome the fear of their numbers.

My .02 cents
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Old 12-02-2012, 06:16 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by bbw.fairy.girl View Post
Playing devil's advocate here, the "easier said than done" aspect from my perspective and experiences with those who don't have, or haven't had, a good, healthy support network be it family, spiritual/religious, therapeutic or community life.

Unfortunately at times shame is almost forced upon a person. Take a child in elementary/middle school who is bullied for their size. Physically abused, called names, etc. Or a child growing up in a familial situation where they are abused in any way about how they look.

Someone who has been in a position where they receive no support, no understanding or expectation that they are valid just the way they are, how can they know that they shouldn't feel shame?

As adults we are supposed to be responsible for our actions, our lives, etc. but imagine going out to enjoy a picnic at a park, or walk the mall, etc. and you are bombarded incessantly by nasty comments, etc. Or trying to shop for clothes and none fit. Or having your Dr tell you that your problems are because you weight "X" number, etc. Over time it becomes difficult to avoid internalizing these comments and actions by others and shame can prevail.

I wholly believe we should not support and give into the numbers game but it can be easier said than done for many. How about people who read Cosmo or any other glam rag? That supports the numbers game. What about designer clothes? Shopping at Whole Foods? Visiting the dr's office? There are so many pieces of our lives that support the numbers game so we have to take a close look as to how to change this and to know that it can be a challenge for many to overcome the fear of their numbers.

My .02 cents
and a very good .02 cents it is. there is a whole lot of truth to that. its great to empathize and understand where people have come from and where they are trying to go. but at some point we all grow up, move away from our families, understand the difference between media and real life. we have to push ourselves or we'll stay stuck in old miserable habits because we think familiarity is easier than change.

i hate to make this analogy but it's the only one i can think of that makes what i mean clear. the lack of self acceptance can be like like domestic abuse and drug addiction. it can be the only way of living that people have actually known in their life, just as you said. it's sad but they sometimes have to hit rock bottom to decide to change their life and put a plan into action if things are ever going to get better. i've seen some people get it just talking to to other people. one person i know got it when she talked to a friend of mine who is anorexic and realized she was having similar thoughts. i had another got it when she found out she had untreatable cancer. some people seem to just come to it on their own because they are just tired of living that way.

the quest for personal approval from others can be like an addiction and abuse. it's when someone is constantly looking for something or someone else to make things alright for them in a dysfunctional way. i can forget my troubles if i have that pill or if i can figure out how to be emotionally dance around enough tonight to get through it alive. living like that is hard, unfairly hard. but if we're ever going to get out of it we have to make the effort ourselves . if we can manage to come out on the other side it's well worth it. just like a drug addict or abuse victim we still have to live in a world where our friends relatives and acquaintances do drugs and engage in abuse as though its a normal thing. same with the lack of self acceptance. we are always surrounded by it in one form or another by people who somehow make it okay.

i want to help and protect anybody who doesn't have self acceptance yet but i also don't want to enable them too much. sometimes its hard to put the brakes on empathy because it looks really mean and doesn't always feel so good to have to do it. i think there are lots of people who could use an acceptance intervention. they could use honestly hearing not only what it does to them but to the other people around them. it would bring it to them in away that i think would finally really make sense to their heart. everyone seems to think they are in it by themselves but they aren't. they bring their friends, SOs and children right along with them.

if we don't try to stop it or make people think even in some small way people can get awfully comfortable with constantly emotionally abusing themselves with body dysmorphia etc... and using the rest of society and all of their other problems as a reason why they continue to abuse themselves. everything they say is perfectly understandable until you realize that it only ends up with great people basically mistreating themselves in ways they don't deserve.
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Last edited by superodalisque; 12-02-2012 at 06:25 PM.
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Old 12-02-2012, 06:36 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by bbw.fairy.girl View Post
Playing devil's advocate here, the "easier said than done" aspect from my perspective and experiences with those who don't have, or haven't had, a good, healthy support network be it family, spiritual/religious, therapeutic or community life.

Unfortunately at times shame is almost forced upon a person. Take a child in elementary/middle school who is bullied for their size. Physically abused, called names, etc. Or a child growing up in a familial situation where they are abused in any way about how they look.

Someone who has been in a position where they receive no support, no understanding or expectation that they are valid just the way they are, how can they know that they shouldn't feel shame?

As adults we are supposed to be responsible for our actions, our lives, etc. but imagine going out to enjoy a picnic at a park, or walk the mall, etc. and you are bombarded incessantly by nasty comments, etc. Or trying to shop for clothes and none fit. Or having your Dr tell you that your problems are because you weight "X" number, etc. Over time it becomes difficult to avoid internalizing these comments and actions by others and shame can prevail.

I wholly believe we should not support and give into the numbers game but it can be easier said than done for many. How about people who read Cosmo or any other glam rag? That supports the numbers game. What about designer clothes? Shopping at Whole Foods? Visiting the dr's office? There are so many pieces of our lives that support the numbers game so we have to take a close look as to how to change this and to know that it can be a challenge for many to overcome the fear of their numbers.

My .02 cents
and a very good .02 cents it is. there is a whole lot of truth to that. its great to empathize and understand where people have come from and where they are trying to go. but at some point we all grow up, move away from our families, understand the difference between media and real life. we have to push ourselves or we'll stay stuck in old miserable habits because we think familiarity is easier than change.

i hate to make this analogy but it's the only one i can think of that makes what i mean clear. the lack of self acceptance can be like like domestic abuse and drug addiction. it can be the only way of living that people have actually known in their life, just as you said. it's sad but they sometimes have to hit rock bottom to decide to change their life and put a plan into action if things are ever going to get better.

the quest for personal approval from others can be like an addiction and abuse. it's when someone is constantly looking for something or someone else to make things alright for them in a dysfunctional way. i can forget my troubles if i have that pill or if i can figure out how to be emotionally dance around enough tonight to get through it alive. the difference is we think we can get through it by wearing spanx or pretending numbers we are afraid of don't exist or trying not to see or speak of them so we can go on pretending that we aren't feeling a shame we don't deserve to feel about the body we have.

living either way is hard, unfairly hard. but if we're ever going to get out of it we have to make the effort ourselves . if we can manage to come out on the other side it's well worth it. so just like a drug addict or abuse victim we still have to live in a world where our friends relatives and acquaintances do drugs and engage in the language of abuse as though its a normal thing. same with the lack of self acceptance. we are always surrounded by it in one form or another.

i want to help and protect anybody who doesn't have self acceptance but i also don't want to enable them in being in denial about the size that they are. for me it's like putting a bandaid on someone when there isn't a cut or a doc giving a placebo. it's not getting to the truth. it doesn't really fix anything. sometimes its hard to put the brakes on empathy because it looks really mean and doesn't always feel so good to have to do it.

i think there are lots of people who could use an acceptance intervention. they could use honestly hearing not only what it does to them but to the other people around them. it would bring it to them in away that i think would finally really make sense to their heart. but if we don't do it even in some small way some time or another people can get awfully comfortable with constantly emotionally abusing themselves with body dysmorphia etc... and using the rest of society and all of their other problems as a reason why they continue to abuse themselves and dodge the issue. everything they say is perfectly understandable until you realize that it only ends up with great people basically mistreating themselves in ways they don't deserve.
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Old 12-06-2012, 12:19 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superodalisque View Post
and a very good .02 cents it is. there is a whole lot of truth to that. its great to empathize and understand where people have come from and where they are trying to go. but at some point we all grow up, move away from our families, understand the difference between media and real life. we have to push ourselves or we'll stay stuck in old miserable habits because we think familiarity is easier than change.

i hate to make this analogy but it's the only one i can think of that makes what i mean clear. the lack of self acceptance can be like like domestic abuse and drug addiction. it can be the only way of living that people have actually known in their life, just as you said. it's sad but they sometimes have to hit rock bottom to decide to change their life and put a plan into action if things are ever going to get better.

the quest for personal approval from others can be like an addiction and abuse. it's when someone is constantly looking for something or someone else to make things alright for them in a dysfunctional way. i can forget my troubles if i have that pill or if i can figure out how to be emotionally dance around enough tonight to get through it alive. the difference is we think we can get through it by wearing spanx or pretending numbers we are afraid of don't exist or trying not to see or speak of them so we can go on pretending that we aren't feeling a shame we don't deserve to feel about the body we have.

living either way is hard, unfairly hard. but if we're ever going to get out of it we have to make the effort ourselves . if we can manage to come out on the other side it's well worth it. so just like a drug addict or abuse victim we still have to live in a world where our friends relatives and acquaintances do drugs and engage in the language of abuse as though its a normal thing. same with the lack of self acceptance. we are always surrounded by it in one form or another.

i want to help and protect anybody who doesn't have self acceptance but i also don't want to enable them in being in denial about the size that they are. for me it's like putting a bandaid on someone when there isn't a cut or a doc giving a placebo. it's not getting to the truth. it doesn't really fix anything. sometimes its hard to put the brakes on empathy because it looks really mean and doesn't always feel so good to have to do it.

i think there are lots of people who could use an acceptance intervention. they could use honestly hearing not only what it does to them but to the other people around them. it would bring it to them in away that i think would finally really make sense to their heart. but if we don't do it even in some small way some time or another people can get awfully comfortable with constantly emotionally abusing themselves with body dysmorphia etc... and using the rest of society and all of their other problems as a reason why they continue to abuse themselves and dodge the issue. everything they say is perfectly understandable until you realize that it only ends up with great people basically mistreating themselves in ways they don't deserve.
I like sharin' my .02 cents...lol

Yes, it is wholly up to us, as an individual, whether or not we make the choice to accept ourselves. And it's exactly that...a choice. If need be, hopefully important people in our lives will help direct us in finding what our choices are as well if we haven't had exposure to better ways (for lack of a better term) of living/being.

Often, the lack of self acceptance and self esteem can be causal in situations of drug abuse, etc. so the association isn't misplaced.

The realm of victim-hood. What a vicious cycle that can be. I have a couple of acquaintances plus family members that live, breath and eat that mentality. Honestly I have to keep my distance at times as the negativity and weight of their dysfunction can leave me feeling so tired and down. Pissed too sometimes because it saddens me that they don't want to make change and just spew the same old crap about how miserable they are over and over and over. Even though I fully well know I cannot effect change for them.

But I do support friends and family as I can with regard to them learning to accept themselves (or other lifestyle changes). If I see they honestly have an interest in doing so or I am working to waylay what might come to pass, such as what my kiddo might encounter as she grows up (if there is reason to that is). And always trying to offer a safe environment for any of them if they need or want it.

Sometimes I think an intervention with the proverbial frying pan upside the head, myself included might be in order. Although in general I am usually much nicer about it. I do try to be as honest as I can when people start heading down the victim trail about how it makes me feel, how it I see it affecting them (if asked). Trying to get them to look at it from another perspective if possible. And, learning when to just let it go as well...
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:23 PM   #30
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I've very rarely felt any shame at my "numbers." In part this is because I just didn't weight myself for 5 years. And as for my sizes... No one ever bought me clothing without me being there and trying it on first. I was lucky that my grandmother (who's a size 6...) never pressured me for my numbers; she'd pick up anything from anywhere and ask me what I though of the style or fabric, then subtle follow me to where I was looking to get a better idea as to where I was in sizes.
The only time I ever felt weird, was shopping with my best friend from high school. She was a size 0. No joke. Sadly, she had a very warped idea about body image... to her mind I was only a large. Maybe an xl. Shopping with her hurt, but more because she couldn't love her own body and was clearly ashamed over her own numbers.
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