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Old 05-31-2013, 03:25 PM   #51
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Okay, time out. I've lurked for a long time on these boards and never felt the need to post, but this line did it.

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Fat ACCEPTANCE is about ACCEPTING people and not judging them on their body and instead judging them on their thoughts, their behaviours and themselves as a person.
No, no, no. No. Nonono. No.

Going from judging someone to judging someone is not accepting anything. In fact it's a lot worse, because it makes you think you're accepting them, and think you're being tolerant. No, you're doing nothing of the sort. What someone does with her life is her own business, as are her motivations, reasons and methods. Judging her or anyone else based on anything is still judging and it hurts just the same.
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Old 05-31-2013, 03:43 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by stealthrider View Post
Okay, time out. I've lurked for a long time on these boards and never felt the need to post, but this line did it.



No, no, no. No. Nonono. No.

Going from judging someone to judging someone is not accepting anything. In fact it's a lot worse, because it makes you think you're accepting them, and think you're being tolerant. No, you're doing nothing of the sort. What someone does with her life is her own business, as are her motivations, reasons and methods. Judging her or anyone else based on anything is still judging and it hurts just the same.
I don't know if it's being judgmental or not, but advising a fat person that it's a bad idea to put on 200 pounds, seems like an act of kindness to me. Sorry.
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Old 05-31-2013, 03:46 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Marlayna View Post
I don't know if it's being judgmental or not, but advising a fat person that it's a bad idea to put on 200 pounds, seems like an act of kindness to me. Sorry.
Heaven forbid they get too fat, because once someone is bigger than 400 pounds they're just wrong.
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Old 05-31-2013, 03:54 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by Blackjack View Post
Heaven forbid they get too fat, because once someone is bigger than 400 pounds they're just wrong.
I didn't say they were "wrong", just like getting one's face and body covered in tattoos isn't "wrong", it's just very limiting. God Bless America, everyone has the right to do what they want. To each their own.
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Old 05-31-2013, 04:03 PM   #55
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The pay site board is all about chicks gorging on shit food for money. Why the fuck should we care if this girl does it?
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Old 05-31-2013, 04:41 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Saoirse View Post
The pay site board is all about chicks gorging on shit food for money. Why the fuck should we care if this girl does it?
because there are people reading this stuff who are young impressionable or unexposed and have no idea of the reality and there is no disclaimer.
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Old 05-31-2013, 04:44 PM   #57
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I didn't say they were "wrong", just like getting one's face and body covered in tattoos isn't "wrong", it's just very limiting. God Bless America, everyone has the right to do what they want. To each their own.
have you ever noticed that a lot of people pushing the idea often don't want to gain that kind of weight themselves. if it's always so wonderful for everyone in every case why don't they do it as well? why aren't they in line to inhibit themselves physically?
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Old 05-31-2013, 05:34 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by superodalisque View Post
because there are people reading this stuff who are young impressionable or unexposed and have no idea of the reality and there is no disclaimer.
Forgive me for assuming that on a messageboard for adults the people reading the topics and such would be, themselves, adults, rather than impressionable children.

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have you ever noticed that a lot of people pushing the idea often don't want to gain that kind of weight themselves. if it's always so wonderful for everyone in every case why don't they do it as well? why aren't they in line to inhibit themselves physically?
Oh cool, we get to have this discussion (yet) again where you won't acknowledge the existence, let alone the arguments, of feedees who list the ways you're wrong because you have your own personal anecdotal "friend of a friend" urban legend evidence that proves that all feeders are manipulative men who get off on debilitating women and then ditching them.

Never mind that you're ignoring the nature of desire or the basic workings of this fetish/philia/kink, or that you refuse, once again, to understand the goals of the whole thing (which vary from person to person, just like anything). You know someone who heard about somebody who gained like a hundred pounds overnight and died after meeting a feeder.
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Old 05-31-2013, 05:45 PM   #59
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Even the most cursory glimpse at a site dedicated to feederism reveals that there's a shitload of people who are "mutual gainers" (likely outnumbering feeders on some forums). Asking why people who are feeders but not into mutual gaining why they're not into it if getting fat is so great is asinine, different people have different kinks. I like being squashed, but have zero desire to trample my wife because it doesn't do anything for me.
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Old 05-31-2013, 05:58 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by stealthrider View Post
Going from judging someone to judging someone is not accepting anything. In fact it's a lot worse, because it makes you think you're accepting them, and think you're being tolerant. No, you're doing nothing of the sort. What someone does with her life is her own business, as are her motivations, reasons and methods. Judging her or anyone else based on anything is still judging and it hurts just the same.
I'm pretty sure that humans still reserve the right to freely form our own opinions based on our evaluations, and voice those opinions. The "acceptance" aspect is not blind, blanket tolerance... it is the absence of superficial prejudice in the aforementioned evaluation.

You could say that someone is making a stupid choice... but to say "fat people make stupid choices" is just a mindless insult. Hence why she said there is a difference between insults and opinion, that's all.
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Old 06-01-2013, 07:09 AM   #61
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Whether we believe everything in the newspaper is true or not is a mute point; this article was posted for discussion so people are discussing the article itself, not whether or not they actually believe the model does everything she says in it. For simplicities sake we assume it is true and give our opinions on it because that is why it was posted, for a discussion of the topic.
Pointing out that the original premise is demonstrably untrue and therefore not worth discussing is a valid point in the discussion.
Assuming things are true when they are obviously not does not make for simplicity
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Old 06-01-2013, 06:50 PM   #62
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Forgive me for assuming that on a messageboard for adults the people reading the topics and such would be, themselves, adults, rather than impressionable children.



Oh cool, we get to have this discussion (yet) again where you won't acknowledge the existence, let alone the arguments, of feedees who list the ways you're wrong because you have your own personal anecdotal "friend of a friend" urban legend evidence that proves that all feeders are manipulative men who get off on debilitating women and then ditching them.

Never mind that you're ignoring the nature of desire or the basic workings of this fetish/philia/kink, or that you refuse, once again, to understand the goals of the whole thing (which vary from person to person, just like anything). You know someone who heard about somebody who gained like a hundred pounds overnight and died after meeting a feeder.
a) there are underage people on message boards everywhere because message boards don't actually screen for age they just ask people to click to say that they're over 18. any 12 year old can and has done it including a lot of people here who now post as adults.

b)i never said ALL of anything -- as usual an exaggeration. and actually it's not an urban legend but 1st hand experience of what many feeders have told me themselves either as friends or as someone who would like me to do those things. the newer you are the more seriously some try to get you to do certain things because it's then that you're less likely to understand what it's all about and become trapped in a way of life that you don't want.

c) i think i have a truer idea about feeders than you would since i am usually their target. what they say to you is not always what they really think or do. after all why would any of them tell you the whole truth? they get nothing from that and they don't think it's any of your business. and what little they say in front of each other is not the same at all as what they reveal in their real private life--just like most sexual situations. and if there are so many willing feedees then why is it that most feeders claim they have never found true feedee--especially one who truthfully likes her body and is fully at home in it even in public not surrounded by people from the community for protection?

d) why would a feedee tell people the truth who are trying to maintain fantasy. they protect fetishists from residual guilt --especially the public who are trying to sell them stuff.

c) no one said anything happens overnight. but the cumulative encouragement of the dependence of women on attention paid ONLY because they are of a certain size is not very healthy, especially when it's made clear that she will no longer be physically attractive at all if she loses weight. it may be a fetish. it's fine to have fetishes but not when another person who actually wants more is pressured to play servant to them and has to give up any semblance of unconditional love and maybe even their own health.

d) people who are impressionable are not just the young. and things do get away from them because they have gone beyond what is good for them personally encouraged by people who'll never have to make the same considerations and never ever have to face that risk themselves. over thirteen years i have seen that happen to many not just an anecdotal few. there are lots of people out there with regrets who are trying to reverse the process they've set in motion but it isn't so easy once they've disrupted their metabolism.

e) when anyone who has experience says anything in any way that interferes with the fantasy they are attacked and silenced. so no one can talk truthfully about their health unless they totally leave this venue to do it. little do a lot of innocent people know that a lot of the main people pushing this stuff are seriously ill, infirm and nearly immobile if not nearly totally so. they don't know how difficult life is in reality for these people. they don't now about the dependence on disability and food stamps for some. they don't know how little web modeling actually pays. when and if they finally do get to see the reality they are shocked by the total difference between that and what they've been told. at some point, if not managed by people with honesty and mutual respect, fantasy can become an outright lie. fantasy is fine but it needs to always be tempered by some reality somewhere. it's the refusal to face any at all that is the problem.

f) i personally don't confuse kink and fetish with reality but many do and have because that is NOT their world. it benefits some to purposefully confuse the two and then later pretend that was not their intention. it's an easy way to have their kink cake and eat it too--leading the unsuspecting down a garden path and the later claiming they were stupid for getting into trouble and getting sick and pretend that absolutely everyone no matter how new to it they are MUST know what it is all about unless they are stupid.

g) and as i said before this is often done with no disclaimers whatsoever anywhere so its very hard for anyone not in the know to decipher. by then it can be a huge problem for someone not in the know confronted with someone who is unscrupulous. it would be much better if it had the same safeguards as BDSM. but instead it's disorganized and it does not embrace the reality in the same ways and does not have the same protections for the participants AT ALL. there are some fat people who haven't spent hours upon hours online surfing fetish sites. some fat people do have a life outside of a little glowing box. the difference is that some people with philia or kinks etc..take full responsibility for everything that can possibly happen and try ore seriously to look out for one another. i'm still waiting for some of you to do this. having a fetish philia or kink does not exempt a person from being a human being.

h) the article was originally posted on the main board so it was up for all kinds of psychological and socio - political discussions it would not be up for here on this board. that has nothing to do with people's personal fetish or kinks but what it does have to do with is an open and honest discussion of the possible effects of this on various people and what it might mean on a psychological and social level to people who may or may not be fetishists. it is unfair to put it on a protected board where it's true that people's right to fetish should be protected. better it were somewhere else where people who wanted to could avoid the discussion altogether.
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Old 06-01-2013, 07:14 PM   #63
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Pointing out that the original premise is demonstrably untrue and therefore not worth discussing is a valid point in the discussion.
Assuming things are true when they are obviously not does not make for simplicity
the problem is when they are presented as truths in a situation when people without understanding have no yardstick with which to measure the truth by. we are often upset when the public misunderstands and goes off on a fat hate tangent. if the public in general can misunderstand then why is it not possible that unexposed fat people will not understand and get themselves into trouble or be lead that way by disreputable people? the BDSM groups never pretend there isn't anyone ever to be careful of in their community. they even warn each other of dangerous actors. why aren't we doing the same? it makes me wonder if it's because generally the men are just as much at risk in BDSM as women. but in this particular fetish it seems that the lion share of people at risk are women and women are not supposed to tell. that is the part we need to start being more responsible about. how often do you see BDSM fantasy represented as some kind of truth in the media? really? get serious now!
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Old 06-01-2013, 07:25 PM   #64
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That is a valid point. However it is not entirely clear that he has any control over her behavior. Tammy seems to be far more concerned with profiting from her gaining than health.

I would also like to point out that her boyfriend Johan seems to be peripheral to the whole story. Most coverage I read barely mentions him though an article from the Mirror portrays him rather well. It seems that she would be gaining whether or not she had a significant other.
I think that is all she is interested in. For her it's not about the pleasure from eating and gaining it's about the money money money... oh and fame... don't forget the fame.
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Old 06-01-2013, 07:42 PM   #65
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Even the most cursory glimpse at a site dedicated to feederism reveals that there's a shitload of people who are "mutual gainers" (likely outnumbering feeders on some forums). Asking why people who are feeders but not into mutual gaining why they're not into it if getting fat is so great is asinine, different people have different kinks. I like being squashed, but have zero desire to trample my wife because it doesn't do anything for me.
hey i'm going by the stand alone article as it was presented to me as an outsider. i was asked for my personal opinion and i gave it. i'm giving you my take on it. i've been around for more than 13 years and i have absolutely no interest in the ratio between feeders and gainers and i don't look at their sites. i definitely would be lying if i said i was interested enough to calculate that statistic. i'm like most people-- just saying. the only thing i know about male feeders is how they've come at me and friends of mine. that is my concern. have any come at you in private? if i don't understand the way that you think i should then other people not in the know wouldn't get it either. no one talked about having to judge that article in the context of a site. i think one problem is that people's perspectives can often get imprisoned in website myopathy. there are other ways of seeing things than via the viewpoint or perspective of a website. i think it would do people a lot of good to realize that.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:04 PM   #66
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if i don't understand the way that you think i should then other people not in the know wouldn't get it either.
If you don't understand the way that we think then I think that by this point I'm justified in refusing to have any sort of discussion with you on this matter as you've just demonstrated that you do not listen. You haven't in the past when these discussions have been held, and you will not now.

This whole debate that you're attempting to force has been undertaken many times before with you and you still bring the same tired points up as though you're saying anything new after all these years. Your opinion doesn't seem to have changed in any way whatsoever.

Simply put, there's no benefit to be had from talking to you about this, as it will only cause frustration on my end (and others such as myself), and you will once again refuse to acknowledge anything that's said that goes against what you already believe.
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Old 06-01-2013, 11:38 PM   #67
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hey i'm going by the stand alone article as it was presented to me as an outsider. i was asked for my personal opinion and i gave it. i'm giving you my take on it. i've been around for more than 13 years and i have absolutely no interest in the ratio between feeders and gainers and i don't look at their sites. i definitely would be lying if i said i was interested enough to calculate that statistic. i'm like most people-- just saying. the only thing i know about male feeders is how they've come at me and friends of mine. that is my concern. have any come at you in private? if i don't understand the way that you think i should then other people not in the know wouldn't get it either. no one talked about having to judge that article in the context of a site. i think one problem is that people's perspectives can often get imprisoned in website myopathy. there are other ways of seeing things than via the viewpoint or perspective of a website. i think it would do people a lot of good to realize that.
what the fuck did I just read
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Old 06-01-2013, 11:44 PM   #68
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what the fuck did I just read


Well for starters ... there should be any matters for debate - at least within the rules of this forum...
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Old 06-01-2013, 11:53 PM   #69
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I'll try to write up a response tomorrow morning but as it stands now it's well late and I've got to go restrain my feedee and force three gallons of heavy cream down her throat against her will. I'm shooting to get her to 1,000 lbs by the end of the year and will not be denied. </superoanecdotalesque>
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Old 06-02-2013, 12:44 AM   #70
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I'll try to write up a response tomorrow morning but as it stands now it's well late and I've got to go restrain my feedee and force three gallons of heavy cream down her throat against her will. I'm shooting to get her to 1,000 lbs by the end of the year and will not be denied. </superoanecdotalesque>
be flippant while you ignore another reality that may exist. and you too know exactly what absolutely all fetishist have to say and try to get fat women who aren't and never wanted to be gainers or feedees to do in private right? even though you aren't and never will be a woman or fat.

as long as people childishly look at this issue in a self absorbed way as a discussion about them personally the prejudice will persist. as long as responsibilities are never taken for how ever many or few the bad actors are the stereotype among may will remain the same. the BDSM community no longer does that and as a result have become more acceptable--because it has become protective of it's members and educates aspiring members. it doesn't just say you're stupid because you simply didn't really understand what you were getting into. it doesn't say tough luck. it has disclaimers on everything and encourages people to make sure they totally understand what they're getting into. i think it will take until the first successful lawsuit and parts of the fat community will finally begin to do the same as well because some will finally be forced to "get" it.
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Old 06-02-2013, 12:45 AM   #71
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what the fuck did I just read
sorry about that i was interrupted by something important before i could edit.
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Old 06-02-2013, 12:50 AM   #72
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Yeah it's almost as depressing as people who don't understand that fetishists aren't universally abusers and victims and fetishists have their desires whether within or without a relationship.
this self flagellation as an abused misunderstood class has gotten boring and old and no one believes it. it doesn't take much to be responsible for new people who get involved who don't quite understand what it's all about yet in order to make sure they can participate safely. how hard is that?
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Old 06-02-2013, 01:04 AM   #73
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This is an incredibly well-made point. I couldn't give more Rep so I quoted just to say that this should be read, re-read, and then re-re-read again before bed... for a few nights... by a LOT of people. Treating people equally is not about polarizing their identity based on whatever the normally-persecuted trait is and canonizing them for something they're normally crucified for. It's about looking beyond it and understanding them as a person and a mind and soul, not a body shape or a skin color or a sexual orientation. So thank you again for an excellently made point about double-standards and staying objective on hot topics. It's like removing the politics out of a political debate and actually talking about *people* again.

I also agree wholeheartedly that this young lady may or may not really be pursuing this as a lifestyle, and as Superodalisque continues to point out so clearly, it's not up to a fetish model to make a public service announcement to clarify the "reality" of her situation. It's up to us as thinking, rational people who support each other in life to draw the line between fantasy and actualization.

most definitely!
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Old 06-02-2013, 01:35 AM   #74
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Okay, time out. I've lurked for a long time on these boards and never felt the need to post, but this line did it.



No, no, no. No. Nonono. No.

Going from judging someone to judging someone is not accepting anything. In fact it's a lot worse, because it makes you think you're accepting them, and think you're being tolerant. No, you're doing nothing of the sort. What someone does with her life is her own business, as are her motivations, reasons and methods. Judging her or anyone else based on anything is still judging and it hurts just the same.
something is never someone's own business if it's done in public for the purpose of influencing the thoughts intentions and actions of another.
intolerance not always a bad thing. intolerance of the portrayal of something actually or potentially detrimental to another is a desirable character attribute. should we also be tolerant of the stories of extreme dieting and exercise for thinness? should we make bulimia a cause celeb and anorexia okay as well even when it is being lauded by a small model with a personal svengali for cash as preteens look on? being fat does not exempt someone from having a decent character and ethical behavior. purposefully misleading the naive and innocent for money is not ethical behavior for anyone of any size.
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Old 06-02-2013, 04:56 AM   #75
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Default Free For All in the Weight Board

I don't see why there is an ongoing debate- when this "topic" has been moved to the proper forum and is no longer on the main board.

If folks want to continue the debate - then open another topic in another forum....

What's the point of having protected forums in Dims? There are some practices in the Size Acceptance community that I don't follow-but, if there is a protected "forum" for it then there has to be "respect" for those participants within that Forum.
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