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Old 05-07-2014, 05:15 PM   #26
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I'm an atheist I'm proud of it and have been threatened, kicked out of a car, and prayed for because I'm damned to the all firey Hell. I recently denied communion of my mother's pastor (he came to the house, as my mother is disabled and I was there for support). He looked at me as though I was a serial killer and said my faith needed to be renewed. He then went to the back of my yard (a good 20 ft) and placed a "Jesus loves you" paper on my car. I found it very rude and offensive. I politely declined his biblical traditions and was in no way offensive. I have many more stories like this ..lol

I was raised Lutheran (it's like being Catholic, but our pastors get to touch vaginas). I love studying religions and comparing the social policies of the time of their theological origin. I can go on and on why I am atheist, but I tolerate those with faith because I am moral. All atheists aren't ignorant hate mongers - pay attention to the ones that did their research and ask "why are you atheist?", but be prepared to get your panties bunched up from such a loaded question.

I have my reasons they range from childhood indoctrination, gender roles, sociobiological and economical prosperity.
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Old 05-07-2014, 06:03 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by lucca23v2 View Post
Personally I was raised Christian. I consider myself a Christian who has read the bible conver to cover, and I still read it. I find strength and comfort in it.

lol.. the imagine of a grown man trying to get into child size clothing.. funny as hell. smh.. too funny
I once tried to fit into my elementary school t-shirt (because it seriously rocks) and it barely fit over my right arm.

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Snipped...

I understand this and it makes me think of something a "preacher" once said... "the problem with the church, is that there are people in it".

Power hunger, greed, selfishness, etc., can corrupt individuals and those type of people using something (such as religion) for those purposes, can/does make it seem corrupt as well.
I agree completely with your preacher. The radical ideas of Jesus in reference to respecting onself and others, pacifism, communal sharing of resources and supporting our weakest and most desperate members of society are beautiful concepts, but they don't make up for the misogynistic, homophobic, racist, vengeful, insecure, and petty parts of the Christian god that people like to completely glaze over.

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Interesting that you feel like you have to defend your belief in logic over spirituality/belief. A lot of the time I as a spiritual/believer feel the same way...that I have to defend or prove my faith. I remember a philosophy teacher asked a class I was in once, "Who is stronger: the atheist who places his belief in logic and science, or the religious person who places his belief in the unproven/unseen?" The debate that followed was fascinating.

The angry, condescending atheist stereotype isn't really the norm, is it? I have always wondered if the majority of atheists feel the same way about that stereotype that a lot of Christians do about the extremist nut jobs who use religion as a tool of hate.

ETA: thank you for sharing and clarifying your views. I don't often get the chance to interact with many atheists (I don't personally know any,) and my experiences have always ran to the stereotypical atheist I mentioned above.
I guess it depends on where you live. I always felt like the atheists were the underdogs who had to assert themselves as people who weren't just teenagers rebelling against their parents. I'm 28 and my parents still think my lack of belief/faith is "just a phase" that I'll grow out of when I'm older.

I was raised Catholic and followed all their rules until they wanted to put me through confirmation and I refused. My childhood at church mainly consisted of me playing with Ninja Turtles action figures while sitting backwards on the kneel stool thingy. I think I always knew how I felt, but I guess I was ashamed about it until I was a teenager because I didn't want to disrespect or disappoint my peers or parents.

I feel that people think angry, bitter atheists are the majority, but I can tell you that that's not true at all. I find the lack of an afterlife and one, finite life beautiful. The nothingness is comforting to think about sometimes. I like random occurrences and it helps me realize the beautiful simplicity of the world around me.

I argue against a conscious design of the world around us because there are so many flaws. Beautiful, wonderful flaws, but flaws nonetheless. To take a page out of NDT's book, how can we believe this universe was designed solely for us when 99.99% of it would kill us instantly with even the most fleeting of exposure to it?

Thank you all for being so kind to me thus far. I'm glad other atheists/agnostics are coming out of the woodwork to contribute. I enjoy discourse and I've enjoyed reading all of your personal anecdotes and philosophies.
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Old 05-07-2014, 06:20 PM   #28
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It's so nice to see so many other witches here! If this thread hadn't been started, I never would've guessed at who really practiced what on Dims.

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No worries. Some would posit that your belief predates most, if not all of the world's religions.

I'll be honest though and admit I know very little about paganism as such, other than how the Pentecostal church I was raised in viewed such beliefs, which were rather unkind to say the least. Out of curiosity's sake, was that a belief you were raised with or something you found during your own spiritual searching?
Paganism's a very loosely defined term in the modern pagan communities since it's most often used as an umbrella term to cover all those who fall outside the modern big religions, such as the Judeo-Christian traditions, Hinduism, Buddhism, etc. Those who feel the call to certain ancient pantheons (Greco-Roman, Egyptian, Pre-Columbian American, etc.) tend to incorporate those deities into their belief systems & practices in an individually eclectic manner, taking whatever fulfills their spiritual needs as the situations arise. Wicca and Asatru are modern reconstructions of our best guesses at what some pre-Christian European belief systems & practices were like. And then you have the atheist witches who don't believe in deities at all but still believe in magic(k). So to say I'm a pagan is to acknowledge that what I personally believe in doesn't really resemble any other individual pagan's belief set since we're all united under that term in an extremely general & loosely-connected way.

I was originally raised in a very hippy-inspired, pseudo-Christian kind of way: believe in the Christian God & practice the Occult at the same time. I have a lil bit of a family history of doing it that way, & the past three or four generations that I know about tended to all practice divination at the very least. My mom initiated me into reading cards when I was thirteen, and my dad always encouraged me to be skeptical of everything while also warning me never to invite strange spirits into the house, but I developed my beliefs mostly on my own. Ended up breaking family tradition by being the first to self-identify as a witch, drop the connection to that conception of "God," & accept the presence of other mythical entities in my life.

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THIS! ^

Though my transition to these pagan beliefs still feels quite recent and I've been taking the actual practice of said magic(k) very slow..... up to now

Growing up I was a really devout christian, despite us almost never setting foot in church as a family. I started going during my late teens and into my first two years of university. I experienced a few different denominations of christianity, before gradually starting to question everything and recognising what it is I truly think and believe.
We definitely need to speak more about this! I'm aghast & flabbered I never found this out about you until now!

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Old 05-07-2014, 06:22 PM   #29
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Oh, and blessed be to all you Pagans out there
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Old 05-07-2014, 09:29 PM   #30
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My childhood at church mainly consisted of me playing with Ninja Turtles action figures while sitting backwards on the kneel stool thingy.
lol....You were cool even at that young age huh? lol
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Old 05-07-2014, 09:50 PM   #31
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Ninja G - As stated not all Chistians are radicals.

Personally I like all of Luke chapter 6. It covers judging others and how you should treat your "enemies".

That chapter seems to get past the radicals.
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Old 05-08-2014, 04:49 AM   #32
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I agree completely with your preacher. The radical ideas of Jesus in reference to respecting onself and others, pacifism, communal sharing of resources and supporting our weakest and most desperate members of society are beautiful concepts, but they don't make up for the misogynistic, homophobic, racist, vengeful, insecure, and petty parts of the Christian god that people like to completely glaze over.



.

Well, he was saying something serious in a joke... that there are so many differing personalities and levels of maturity that it gets in the way/ causes problems to what should be peaceful and uplifting. Is that what you are agreeing with?

The part of your comment I bolded, are words I have commonly heard from other atheists. Do you base this on how certain people behave/have said to you or what you have studied/read about it?
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Old 05-08-2014, 07:46 AM   #33
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When asked what my religion is I usually just say I was raised Catholic, which I was. My family went to church every Sunday and I received all the sacraments except for confirmation. I decided about a week before it was supposed to happen, after doing all the classes and whatnot that I wasn't positive this is what I believed and so I didn't want to stand up say it was if I wasn't really sure. My parents had me talk to the priest, who is one of my favorite people, and he agreed with my decision. I continued to go to church with my family though my attendance dropped off once I went to college. However, during my senior year of high school and all through college I attended a Congregational church once a month to play bass guitar in their praise band.

I haven't figured out exactly what I personally believe yet. I believe in science and doubt the presence of God, but at the same time I have also had extremely moving religious experiences that make me think that maybe God is out there. I find the idea of God and Christ to be comforting and because I was raised in Catholic church I am drawn to many of the traditions, but I am not a big fan of the Church as an organization and don't agree with all of its teachings. I do like the new Pope and he gives me hope for the Church.

Most of my moving spiritual moments involve music. There are quite a few songs during mass that will get me teary eyed. There's something so powerful to me about a group of people all singing together. That and I just really love how songs in latin sound. I was moved to tears during Adoration at a Catholic Youth retreat one year, which is the one time I have ever really felt anything in a religious setting when music was not involved.

Edit: I realized that Catholics may be the only ones who practice Adoration and it may need some explanation. Catholics believe that the Eucharist (bread) is not just a symbol, they believe that it literally becomes the body of Christ. Adoration is when the Eucharist is placed in a giant fancy shmancy gold holder called a monstrance, and you just sit in the presence of Christ. So in the above religious experience imagine 3,000 teenagers pus chaperones and priests sitting pretty silently (except for crying) under a tent while this is going on.

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Old 05-08-2014, 11:24 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by fat9276 View Post
Well, he was saying something serious in a joke... that there are so many differing personalities and levels of maturity that it gets in the way/ causes problems to what should be peaceful and uplifting. Is that what you are agreeing with?

The part of your comment I bolded, are words I have commonly heard from other atheists. Do you base this on how certain people behave/have said to you or what you have studied/read about it?
I was agreeing with what your preacher implied about humans ruining religions, and then equating it to religious texts. The Bible itself is full of all the latter parts of my statement, but it was also written, edited, condensed and translated by the hand of man, so his logic still applies. Whatever good things may have been present in the original sermons of Jesus, if that's what you believe, they've been nearly completely lost by countless years of propagandizing and twisting the words to suit human needs.

The part you bolded is what I have seen in the words of the bible themselves. Women are painted as more of a villain in the bible than the devil himself. God is vengeful. God is petty. According to the words in the bible, that's a god I would have a lot of trouble respecting or worshipping.
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Old 05-08-2014, 11:42 AM   #35
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^ -Specific women or do you mean women in general?
- Could you please offer some examples of what vengeance or pettiness you are referring to?


By the way, thanks for answering my questions
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Old 05-08-2014, 11:51 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fat9276 View Post
^ -Specific women or do you mean women in general?
- Could you please offer some examples of what vengeance or pettiness you are referring to?


By the way, thanks for answering my questions
Women in general:

"And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire." (Leviticus 21:9)

Being a whore punishable by incineration? Seems kind of harsh.

"Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a woman have conceived seed, and born a man child: then she shall be unclean seven days; according to the days of the separation for her infirmity shall she be unclean." (Leviticus 12:2)

"But if she bear a maid child, then she shall be unclean two weeks, as in her separation: and she shall continue in the blood of her purifying threescore and six days." (Leviticus 12:5)

So a female child is less pure than a male child, basically?

"Behold, here is my daughter a maiden, and his concubine; them I will bring out now, and humble ye them, and do with them what seemeth good unto you: but unto this man do not so vile a thing. But the men would not hearken to him: so the man took his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her go." (Judges 19:24-25)

Rape is not fitting for a man, but it's fine for a woman I suppose?

"Let the women learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression." (I Timothy 2:11-14)

Women live for men only and must submit to them? Got it.

And, specifically, god is vengeful and petty in his own commandments. All other gods besides him cannot be worshipped or it is not only a penalty of pain and suffering, but EVERLASTING pain and suffering. Talk about your insecurities...

"2 The LORD is a jealous and vengeful God; the LORD is vengeful and strong in wrath. The LORD is vengeful against his foes; he rages against his enemies. 3 The LORD is very patient but great in power; the LORD punishes. His way is in whirlwind and storm; clouds are the dust of his feet. 4 He can blast the sea and make it dry up; he can dry up all the rivers. Bashan and Carmel wither; the bud of Lebanon withers. 5 The mountains quake because of him; the hills melt away. The earth heaves before him— the world and all who dwell in it. 6 Who can stand before his indignation? Who can confront the heat of his fury? His wrath pours out like fire; the rocks are shattered because of him. 7 The LORD is good, a haven in a day of distress. He acknowledges those who take refuge in him. 8 With a rushing flood, he will utterly destroy her place and pursue his enemies into darkness." (Nahum 1:2-8)

He's a jealous, insecure, petty being that wants nothing more than the absolute devotion of all of his followers, and anyone who doesn't want to be his follower is damned to hell and everlasting pain. Unbaptized babies are rotting in hell. Aborted babies are rotting in hell. I think that's horrible to even consider.

I could go on. I don't make sweeping generalizations without research. I've read the bible myself.

This isn't meant to sound snarky or condescending in any way, and it's hard to tell through text. I was just trying to paraphrase the passages a bit.
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Old 05-08-2014, 12:08 PM   #37
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This rocked.

And you write very well.


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Originally Posted by Ninja Glutton View Post
Women in general:

"And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire." (Leviticus 21:9)

Being a whore punishable by incineration? Seems kind of harsh.

"
I could go on. I don't make sweeping generalizations without research. I've read the bible myself.

This isn't meant to sound snarky or condescending in any way, and it's hard to tell through text. I was just trying to paraphrase the passages a bit.
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Old 05-08-2014, 01:06 PM   #38
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Unbaptized babies are rotting in hell. Aborted babies are rotting in hell. I think that's horrible to even consider.

I am commenting on this specific portion, because it sticks out the most for me right now. I do not believe in infant baptism nor do I think children and/or babies go to hell if they are not. I understand this to be a widely accepted/taught "Catholic" (and other various denominations) belief but because of verses such as these, I believe children are innocent (sin free, if you will) and go straight to heaven when they pass.

Luke 18:16 ~ 'Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these."

Matthew 18:2-4 ~ "And He called a child to Himself and set him before them, and said, "Truly I say to you, unless you are converted and become like children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever then humbles himself as this child, he is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven…"
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Old 05-08-2014, 01:16 PM   #39
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This rocked.

And you write very well.
Thank you! A Surly compliment means like 100x more than the average person's compliment.

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Originally Posted by fat9276 View Post
Snipped


I am commenting on this specific portion, because it sticks out the most for me right now. I do not believe in infant baptism nor do I think children and/or babies go to hell if they are not. I understand this to be a widely accepted/taught "Catholic" (and other various denominations) belief but because of this verse and other things (i.e. the account with Nicodemus), I believe children are innocent (sin free, if you will) and go straight to heaven when they pass.

Luke 18:16 ~ 'Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these."
I'm glad you feel that way.
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Old 05-08-2014, 01:45 PM   #40
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You can find amazing beauty, awfulness, and even porn in the Bible. It's not a single document, but hundreds that have been bound together.

I don't get fussed over people quoting from Leviticus specifically, or the OT in general to justify their dislike of Christianity. To me that reveals that while they may have read the Bible, they didn't really understand it. Yes, I'm including some of my fellow Christians in this category. The Old Testament is history. "What has gone before," if you will. The rules, laws, and stories in the OT are for the semi-nomadic desert tribesmen that the Jews were at the time. They were never for the goyim. It described the Covenant God had with Israel, and laid out the rules for them to follow to keep the people "pure" for the savior. Well, the savior came, the Covenant was fulfilled, and Jesus laid out new rules to live by. Love your neighbor. Turn the other cheek. That sort of thing. Rules that applied to everyone, not just Jews. Those passages in Leviticus that both the fundies and Christophobes love to quote have zero relevance to the modern world. Ancient history is all it is.
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Old 05-08-2014, 01:47 PM   #41
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I am commenting on this specific portion, because it sticks out the most for me right now. I do not believe in infant baptism nor do I think children and/or babies go to hell if they are not. I understand this to be a widely accepted/taught "Catholic" (and other various denominations) belief but because of verses such as these, I believe children are innocent (sin free, if you will) and go straight to heaven when they pass.

Luke 18:16 ~ 'Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these."

Matthew 18:2-4 ~ "And He called a child to Himself and set him before them, and said, "Truly I say to you, unless you are converted and become like children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever then humbles himself as this child, he is the greatest in the kingdom of heavenů"
The Pope (I believe it was John Paul II) said it completely ok for Catholics to believe unbaptized and aborted babies go to heaven. The belief before that was that they go to purgatory and we have to pray for them to get to heaven.
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Old 05-08-2014, 02:16 PM   #42
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You can find amazing beauty, awfulness, and even porn in the Bible. It's not a single document, but hundreds that have been bound together.

I don't get fussed over people quoting from Leviticus specifically, or the OT in general to justify their dislike of Christianity. To me that reveals that while they may have read the Bible, they didn't really understand it. Yes, I'm including some of my fellow Christians in this category. The Old Testament is history. "What has gone before," if you will. The rules, laws, and stories in the OT are for the semi-nomadic desert tribesmen that the Jews were at the time. They were never for the goyim. It described the Covenant God had with Israel, and laid out the rules for them to follow to keep the people "pure" for the savior. Well, the savior came, the Covenant was fulfilled, and Jesus laid out new rules to live by. Love your neighbor. Turn the other cheek. That sort of thing. Rules that applied to everyone, not just Jews. Those passages in Leviticus that both the fundies and Christophobes love to quote have zero relevance to the modern world. Ancient history is all it is.
Why must I wait to rep you? You summed up nearly exactly the way I see things in your first post here, as well as gave me some new things to look into and with this post you just saved me a lot of typing. Considered it repped in spirit! (Pun intended).
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Old 05-08-2014, 02:22 PM   #43
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Old 05-08-2014, 04:15 PM   #44
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You can find amazing beauty, awfulness, and even porn in the Bible. It's not a single document, but hundreds that have been bound together.

I don't get fussed over people quoting from Leviticus specifically, or the OT in general to justify their dislike of Christianity. To me that reveals that while they may have read the Bible, they didn't really understand it. Yes, I'm including some of my fellow Christians in this category. The Old Testament is history. "What has gone before," if you will. The rules, laws, and stories in the OT are for the semi-nomadic desert tribesmen that the Jews were at the time. They were never for the goyim. It described the Covenant God had with Israel, and laid out the rules for them to follow to keep the people "pure" for the savior. Well, the savior came, the Covenant was fulfilled, and Jesus laid out new rules to live by. Love your neighbor. Turn the other cheek. That sort of thing. Rules that applied to everyone, not just Jews. Those passages in Leviticus that both the fundies and Christophobes love to quote have zero relevance to the modern world. Ancient history is all it is.
The Old Testament is still a part of religious, sacred holy text that the entirety of Christianity is founded upon. I don't really think you can just omit entire chapters because they don't fit the "hip, new" King James Bible.

If you're telling me misogyny is no part of the new testament, then maybe you have not read closely enough:

1 Corinthians 11:3-10 But I want you to understand that Christ is the head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and God is the head of Christ. 4 Every man who has something on his head while praying or prophesying, disgraces his head. 5 But every woman who has her head uncovered while praying or prophesying, disgraces her head; for she is one and the same with her whose head is shaved. 6 For if a woman does not cover her head, let her also have her hair cut off; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to have her hair cut off or her head shaved, let her cover her head. 7 For a man ought not to have his head covered, since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man. 8 For man does not originate from woman, but woman from man; 9 for indeed man was not created for the woman’s sake, but woman for the man’s sake. 10 Therefore the woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels.

1 Corinthians 14:33-35 for God is not a God of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints. 34 Let the women keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but let them subject themselves, just as the Law also says. 35 And if they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church.

What part of this am I not understanding about the role of women as subordinate to men?

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Old 05-08-2014, 04:26 PM   #45
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I have a certain animus against Paul, who wrote Corinthians. He was intent on wiping out Christianity until his Road to Damascus moment. Paul changed sides, he didn't change who he was. He was just as judgmental, bigoted, and misogynistic as he ever was, and it comes through in his writings. The subordination of women was never in Jesus' teachings. Paul was wrong.
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Old 05-08-2014, 06:16 PM   #46
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QUOTE=Ninja Glutton;2069168]The Old Testament is still a part of religious, sacred holy text that the entirety of Christianity is founded upon. I don't really think you can just omit entire chapters because they don't fit the "hip, new" King James Bible.

Yes and it's not about omitting it, it's about how does it apply to Christians? I think the book of Hebrews does the job to explain this. It starts off by telling how God used to talk to His people through prophets but now it's through His son. It talks about how they used to have the High Priest at the temple and the ceremony of washing but now Jesus is our High Priest, we are sanctified through Him. In chapter 10 it says "For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins", then verse 10 goes on to say "By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all."


If you're telling me misogyny is no part of the new testament, then maybe you have not read closely enough:

1 Corinthians 11:3-10 But I want you to understand that Christ is the head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and God is the head of Christ. 4 Every man who has something on his head while praying or prophesying, disgraces his head. 5 But every woman who has her head uncovered while praying or prophesying, disgraces her head; for she is one and the same with her whose head is shaved. 6 For if a woman does not cover her head, let her also have her hair cut off; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to have her hair cut off or her head shaved, let her cover her head. 7 For a man ought not to have his head covered, since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man. 8 For man does not originate from woman, but woman from man; 9 for indeed man was not created for the woman’s sake, but woman for the man’s sake. 10 Therefore the woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels.

1 Corinthians 14:33-35 for God is not a God of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints. 34 Let the women keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but let them subject themselves, just as the Law also says. 35 And if they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church.

What part of this am I not understanding about the role of women as subordinate to men?[/QUOTE]

In many of Paul's epistles, he was addressing issues that were popping up in the new church (congregations) that were relevant at the time. This one was to the "church at Corinth". The one you bring up about 1 Corinthians 11, I have read commentaries suggesting that Paul was addressing issues of prostitution among other things (prostitutes at that time had shaved heads, etc). I am not trying to wash it all away with that but we do have to look at the time it was written, what was going on and what were the roles of women at that time. How long have women's rights truly been around? Paul also said in 1 Corinthians 7:6 said "But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment" seeming to imply he had no actual command to write certain things but permission to do so to serve a purpose.
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Old 05-08-2014, 06:31 PM   #47
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I like that you both have found ways to attribute your own beliefs to simply Jesus' teachings. That's really nice to hear. To me, that is what the true Christian value system should be based upon.

I guess I just find it unusual because I'm so used to people citing the bible as the be-all, end-all of Christian thought. This may be stereotyping and I admit to my own anti-Christian biases wholeheartedly, but I find that majority of Christians that I meet consider the entire text of the bible to be a dogmatic layout of how they should run their lives.

While I fully respect and appreciate the two of you and your stance against the more harmful parts of the text, I don't know if I consider that true of the majority of so-called "Christians."

To me, though, it is people like you two who actually exhibit the Christian values rather than the "Christian" ones, if that makes any sort of sense.
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Old 05-08-2014, 07:37 PM   #48
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I'm an atheist. Religion bores me. If I could go through life without ever having to deal with religion I'd be a happy camper. Unfortunately its a rare day when I don't have to deal with some sort of religious dogma.
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Old 05-08-2014, 08:27 PM   #49
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I'm an atheist. Religion bores me. If I could go through life without ever having to deal with religion I'd be a happy camper. Unfortunately its a rare day when I don't have to deal with some sort of religious dogma.
Here we are, having a great discussion about faith among people of various faiths, and even no faith at all, everyone contributing positive and thought provoking posts, and then you waltz in and drop this load. Given your obvious contempt, I have to wonder why you even looked in this thread to begin with.
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Old 05-08-2014, 09:19 PM   #50
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Really, the idea of religion just offends me because of the hate-filled violence, segregation, social classism, and moral elitism that it's fostered and continues to foster to this day. I would be happy to live in a world without it.
Respectfully, how is this any different than what strict atheist philosophical systems encouraged throughout the 20th century? (I'm thinking of Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, all determined atheists.)

Any philosophical/spiritual system can be twisted. But one that commands its followers to love others (Christianity), to respect others and all of life (Buddhism), or to live thoughtfully in balance with others (Judaism, Taoism, Confucianism) can't be all bad.
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