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Old 04-16-2007, 03:32 PM   #176
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Far from being a bunch of nutjobs and freaks, I think that the majority of people here are caring, intelligent, bitchin' people. I hang out on the Weight Board because I find the discussions here so interesting.

If I ever seem like I'm being closed-minded, kick me in the shins.

Also, that interview above is SO great! What a neat person.
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Old 04-16-2007, 03:35 PM   #177
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AMEN! You don't have to like it..you don't even have to PRETEND to like it..but what's going on in someone else's house is really no one's business.
If someone is abusing their spouse or partner, it is a crime. Whether you are caught or not, it's still breaking the law.
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Old 04-16-2007, 03:45 PM   #178
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I too have to say thank you for some of your wonderful posts...i think it is easy to see how some of us end up where we are...

the only thing i have to add is this...i think americans are more guilty of this than any other population...we always think it wont happen to us...i can gain weight, it wont happen to me, i can play football, it wont happen to me, i can smoke, it wont happen to me..you get the picture, but unfortunately, it does happen often...

some people would say my mobility problems are more related to me working in intensive care for 26 years, and of course, i only want to work in really jumping ones (damn adrenaline junkie)...so which came first, the chicken or the egg, doesn't matter, my weight is an issue...

to all of you who shared your comments without turning feral, i appreciate it, and it gave me something to think about....
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Old 04-16-2007, 03:45 PM   #179
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If someone is abusing their spouse or partner, it is a crime. Whether you are caught or not, it's still breaking the law.
You can't always assume that someone is being abused.

I'm loud when I have sex..Very loud.....I also like some BDSM...so that makes me even louder..lol..and things are crashing around sometimes..it can get very...well exciting....and on top of that..I bruise easily...I'm not being abused...well..I am willingly..but what happens in my bedroom is my business.

Now, if I'm in public..lol..feel free to watch or whatever
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Old 04-16-2007, 03:46 PM   #180
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If someone is abusing their spouse or partner, it is a crime. Whether you are caught or not, it's still breaking the law.
That's not actually the case, if the person in question has expressed (either explicitly or implicitly in some cases) consent.

The issue is one of "Informed Consent", that is, if the person receiving the "abuse" has "given consent based upon a full appreciation and understanding of the facts and implications of any actions, with the individual being in possession of all his faculties, and his judgment not being impaired at the time of consenting."

The parameters of this are fairly well understood, and while it is used most commonly to determine the legality of medical procedures, it's also used in conjunction with sex or sex-related play.

In the event of actually injury, for instance in a BDSM relationship, there is some question in certain jurisdictions about what constitutes consent, and there are a few cases pending in the UK about this very issue.

But by and large, if you consent to an activity, and are an adult of sound mind, unimpaired by drugs or alcohol, the activity is lawful.

It may, to you, be totally unethical. But ethics and legality aren't always the same thing.
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Old 04-16-2007, 03:50 PM   #181
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but what happens in my bedroom is my business.

A person abusing their partner in public, their house, bed room, garage, basement, living room, etc. is still abuse.
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Old 04-16-2007, 03:51 PM   #182
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A person abusing their partner in public, their house, bed room, garage, basement, living room, etc. is still abuse.
No one is disagreeing with you on that fact. What we are saying is that you don't know when someone is really being abused...or if it's part of "play."

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Old 04-16-2007, 03:52 PM   #183
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I just want to take a minute to thank every single person who's contributed to this thread in a rational, balanced, and sincere manner.

I really believe that we could have more conversations of this nature on these boards if we go into them with the right attitude and a basic respect of everyone's right to express themselves and be heard, even if that doesn't equal agreement.

Please continue, but I just wanted to thank you. I had a lot of fear in starting the discussion, and I'm very happy to say I'm impressed by all of you.
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Old 04-16-2007, 03:57 PM   #184
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No one is disagreeing with you on that fact. What we are saying is that you don't know when someone is really being abused...or if it's part of "play."

So here's a question: If you suspect someone is being abused, do you think it's better to not get police involvement because it might be consensual sexual activity?
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Old 04-16-2007, 03:58 PM   #185
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That's not actually the case, if the person in question has expressed (either explicitly or implicitly in some cases) consent.
The morals and ethics of S&M or "rough sex" aside, I find it hard to believe actually beating your partner is legal. Any a-hole could get away with beating the piss out of their wife with that kind of loop hole.

Abusing a person because they hate themselves enough to take it or is too scared to speak up it doesn't make it right. It makes you a sick pathetic piece of shit for doing it.
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Old 04-16-2007, 03:59 PM   #186
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No one is disagreeing with you on that fact. What we are saying is that you don't know when someone is really being abused...or if it's part of "play."

Making someone immobile goes beyond play and into causing them harm.
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:00 PM   #187
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A person abusing their partner in public, their house, bed room, garage, basement, living room, etc. is still abuse.
In a lot of situations I agree with you, but that's an emotional and moral judgment, not a legal one. We may think that what two people engage in is just awful, but that doesn't make it illegal.

The fact remains that if an act is agreed upon by both parties, our own moral or ethical problems with it are moot.

I know I just posted it, but seriously this is the crux of the matter:

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Informed consent is a legal condition whereby a person can be said to have given consent based upon a full appreciation and understanding of the facts and implications of any actions, with the individual being in possession of all of his faculties (not mentally retarded or mentally ill), and his judgment not being impaired at the time of consenting.
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:00 PM   #188
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So here's a question: If you suspect someone is being abused, do you think it's better to not get police involvement because it might be consensual sexual activity?
I would approach the person I thought was being abused. I would think that you could tell by their actions and body language if they were in fact being abused even if they were denying it.

I'm sure that..for example, it was my upstairs neighbor, if it got to be too much, I'd call the police anyways..
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:01 PM   #189
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Making someone immobile goes beyond play and into causing them harm.
If I'm consenting..it's my right to be made immobile.


I think a lot of people are getting caught up in the whole immobility debate. I wonder what the actual numbers are for feederism that has actually lead to immobility.
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:04 PM   #190
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If I'm consenting..it's my right to be made immobile.
Again, abuse is not a right or an alternate lifestyle. People don't have the right to abuse their partner whether they or willing or not.

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Abusing a person because they hate themselves enough to take it or is too scared to speak up it doesn't make it right. It makes you a sick pathetic piece of shit for doing it.
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:06 PM   #191
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Not sure if I posted my thank you a few moments too soon.

There are tons of things that are painful in life that we choose to do anyway... tattoos, piercings??? I'm bleeding and hurt, but I asked for it and paid to have it done. Is that abuse?? It's injured me, it's hurt me, I might cry during it, I will bruise and scab... is the practitioner an abuser?

It's not up to anyone to decide, except in the eyes of the law... no, all is fine. I consented and requested that treatment. If they walked up to me on the street and did it without my consent, I could put them in jail.

I think we all get this, and belaboring the point over what one views abuse and another views play seems nitpicky at this point in the thread. We all know that we don't see eye to eye on consent - one person's abuse is another person's fun Friday night.

(That was not said as a mod, but as a participant.)
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:07 PM   #192
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Again, abuse is not a right or an alternate lifestyle. People don't have the right to abuse their partner whether they or willing or not.
Well..your opinion is that it's abuse...doesn't make you right..but you're allowed to have your opinion..just as I am.
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:08 PM   #193
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[COLOR="Purple"]If I'm consenting..it's my right to be made immobile.
You distilled into one sentence what I was writing a novel trying to say.

I notice that what's going on is that people are approaching this issue with their emotions, which is totally understandable but won't necessarily lead us to any end point in the argument. I think that infantilism is horrible and gross and sick. Really. But I would never say that someone shouldn't be able to engage in it. That's none of my business.

And if you're not insane and you to practice a sexual kink that I find fucking weird, that's also none of my business.

Re actual abusive situations-- you can call the police, and in fact i would encourage it if you really think that someone is being harmed. If they are, they still have to press charges in order for it to legally go forward (I'm assuming both parties are adults). It isn't as though the police will arrest someone they think is abusive if both people say that it's consensual rough sex.

Misty, I wonder as well how much immobility actually comes into play. It seems like that's a particularly extreme example of an already fringe fetish, so it's probably not too common.
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:08 PM   #194
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Not sure if I posted my thank you a few moments too soon.

There are tons of things that are painful in life that we choose to do anyway... tattoos, piercings??? I'm bleeding and hurt, but I asked for it and paid to have it done. Is that abuse?? It's injured me, it's hurt me, I might cry during it, I will bruise and scab... is the practitioner an abuser?

It's not up to anyone to decide, except in the eyes of the law... no, all is fine. I consented and requested that treatment. If they walked up to me on the street and did it without my consent, I could put them in jail.

I think we all get this, and belaboring the point over what one views abuse and another views play seems nitpicky at this point in the thread. We all know that we don't see eye to eye on consent - one person's abuse is another person's fun Friday night.
I agree. No tattoos or piercings for me though
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:08 PM   #195
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I would approach the person I thought was being abused. I would think that you could tell by their actions and body language if they were in fact being abused even if they were denying it.

I'm sure that..for example, it was my upstairs neighbor, if it got to be too much, I'd call the police anyways..
Fair enough.

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If I'm consenting..it's my right to be made immobile.


I think a lot of people are getting caught up in the whole immobility debate. I wonder what the actual numbers are for feederism that has actually lead to immobility.
I think you're right there. For those whom immobility is a goal though, it raises some important questions:

Now that these people are disabled and cannot work to support themselves, are they entitled to government benefits?

When someone's behavior becomes harmful in the other extreme, like in anorexia nervosa, they are hospitalized.

Why is being so fat you can't walk more sane than starving to the point where you can't stand without fainting?

Should someone who wants their body altered to the point of self-harm be considered mentally ill?

If my boyfriend helps me starve to death, he gets in HUGE trouble. That's considered abuse. Again, why is it different if a guy feeds a woman who some would deem as mentally ill to the point where she is incapable of self-care?
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:11 PM   #196
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Not sure if I posted my thank you a few moments too soon.

There are tons of things that are painful in life that we choose to do anyway... tattoos, piercings??? I'm bleeding and hurt, but I asked for it and paid to have it done. Is that abuse?? It's injured me, it's hurt me, I might cry during it, I will bruise and scab... is the practitioner an abuser?
This is a really good point. I've paid people hundreds and hundreds of dollards to shove ink under my skin with needles to make pictures. I mean, if you think about it, GROSS!
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:13 PM   #197
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I consented and requested that treatment.
So if a guy that gets off on beating the piss out of women finds a woman that hates herself enough to seek out abusers, that's fine and dandy when he beats her? I say no.

There might be a legal fine line in abusing your partner but there is damn well not an ethical one in my opinion.
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:15 PM   #198
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If my boyfriend helps me starve to death, he gets in HUGE trouble. That's considered abuse. Again, why is it different if a guy feeds a woman who some would deem as mentally ill to the point where she is incapable of self-care?
Exactly. It's the same and it's still abuse.
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:15 PM   #199
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Fair enough.



I think you're right there. For those whom immobility is a goal though, it raises some important questions:

Now that these people are disabled and cannot work to support themselves, are they entitled to government benefits?

When someone's behavior becomes harmful in the other extreme, like in anorexia nervosa, they are hospitalized.

Why is being so fat you can't walk more sane than starving to the point where you can't stand without fainting?

Should someone who wants their body altered to the point of self-harm be considered mentally ill?

If my boyfriend helps me starve to death, he gets in HUGE trouble. That's considered abuse. Again, why is it different if a guy feeds a woman who some would deem as mentally ill to the point where she is incapable of self-care?
You've brought up some really interesting points. The one I bolded is the one I have questions. How can anyone prove that he enabled you to be anorexic? How would anyone be able to prove that a guy was the cause of massive weight gain in a woman?

Unless there was documentation that the feedee was being force feed, I can't really see how someone would be able to prove that the guy actually caused the weight gain. We all eat.. there are millions of fat people that over indulge on a daily basis, how could one prove that another person was responsible for me getting fat?
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Old 04-16-2007, 04:16 PM   #200
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Now that these people are disabled and cannot work to support themselves, are they entitled to government benefits?

When someone's behavior becomes harmful in the other extreme, like in anorexia nervosa, they are hospitalized.

Why is being so fat you can't walk more sane than starving to the point where you can't stand without fainting?

Should someone who wants their body altered to the point of self-harm be considered mentally ill?

If my boyfriend helps me starve to death, he gets in HUGE trouble. That's considered abuse. Again, why is it different if a guy feeds a woman who some would deem as mentally ill to the point where she is incapable of self-care?
I think these are excellent questions, especially in terms of government services.

It's also a slippery slope... if I didn't force myself to get fat, but chose to lead my life as a fat person and someday was disabled as an effect of something related, am I also denied? I'm sure some would say yes... it's your fault.

I'm not arguing, to be clear, I just think it's an interesting train of thought, and could lead in a lot of very weird/scary directions for the "naturally" fat among us.

I suppose bottom line though, is that disabled is disabled, no matter how it happened... I don't think someone suffering from meth mouth and on the skids has any trouble getting assistance if they're playing the game and jumping through the bureaucratic hoops.
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