Author: FA's Make Me Want To Be Thin

[Jay West Coast]

I was flipping through the cover article in the SFWeekly this morning at my local coffeeshop. The author had weight loss surgery two years ago, but I decided to read it anyway out of pure curiosity. The author goes on about how she actually cherished being 360, but in the world in which fat people have to live, it became "unreasonable" to not to live as a thin person.

As she discusses her life experience being fat (which is well written and I think people ought to be more educated to what the fat experience is), she writes a chapter about dating FA's:

What is there to say about chubby chasers? They objectify fat women, and after eight years of no action, this ho was ready to be objectified. Everything that might disgust you about your body — your hanging belly, your cottage-cheese butt, your floppy, massive titties — got these men harder than concrete.

On the Internet I came across a guy who was conventionally handsome in his picture. He wasn't really the sort of man the thin me would go for — too square — but compared to all the other gnomes out there who liked superbig girls, he was a catch. I instant-messaged him with a picture of myself. He asked for my phone number, and for some stupid reason I gave it to him.

Small talk ensued. I said I was a writer, and he told me he was an actor currently playing Tony in Tony and Tina's Wedding in a Philly dinner theater. He instantly got very pushy about my going there to meet him. "I just feel something between us, you know?" he said. "Like, girls like you are hard to come by. That woman 'Tina' in my play, she's like this Barbie doll, totally what most men would want. She disgusts me. I like fat girls."

"Okaaaaayyyy," I responded, alarm bells going off.

He wanted to fly me out to see his show, and insisted that I would come backstage after his performance: "Yeah!" His voice was picking up in pace and he seemed, er, a bit more herky-jerky.

"You will come backstage! And I will introduce you to Tina!"

"Yeah?" I said. "I dunno ..."

"Yes! You will meet Tina, and ... and ... and then I want you to ... squish her."

He said the "squish her" part with a breathlessness that belied the release that I feared was coming.

"Squish her??!"

"Yeah! Press your big fat body into her! Press her into the floor! Ohhhhhhhh!"

Click.

I think it was at this point that I began to really consider weight-loss surgery.

After reading this, I felt really strange. Is it true? Are we weirdoes? If this liberal ultra-accepting newspaper labels us as fetishistic bucketcases, maybe I've been thinking of this all wrong.

What are your experiences with FA's? Are they the wonderful intentions of creation made to appreciate fat women for the beautiful beings they are, or a collection of fellers who could use some counseling? Was this author's experience indicative, or unfortunate and off-base?

(And, yes, part of me is posting this to hear self-affirming points that FA's are not freaks.)

[LillyBBBW]

'fraid so Jay. Some of you FA's are total pervs lacking in the social restraints the good Lord gave to the common mutt. Meeting one off the bat can be traumatizing enough to make you hit anyone who calls you beautiful as hard as you can and then run away. These circus freaks give the rest of you a bad name and unfortunatley they seem to be the ones who do most of the talking, social restraint not being one of their strong points.

[AnnMarie]

I can't answer this again - but you'll get plenty of "yes, you're freaks" responses, Jay. Hope you're ready for them.

The FAs I've known, loved, dated, etc... not freaks. Good men who find something "unconventional" to be attractive and desireable. I don't consider the rude/tactless/pure fetish cases FAs at all... so that's not part of my experience with "effays".

Freaks to a woman like that because she hated herself and all her fat represents - hard not to see a freak in someone who likes all you loathe.

[Ashley]

Originally Posted by Jay West Coast

What are your experiences with FA's? Are they the wonderful intentions of creation made to appreciate fat women for the beautiful beings they are, or a collection of fellers who could use some counseling? Was this author's experience indicative, or unfortunate and off-base?

(And, yes, part of me is posting this to hear self-affirming points that FA's are not freaks.)

Some of you are.

I kid, I kid.

There are PLENTY of good, loving, normal FAs out there. I've met them, been friends with them, and dated them. What your writer friend here experienced is definitely NOT the norm of real-life FAs.

I think that what the writer was experiencing has less to do with general fat admiration and more to do with a lack of social graces. Sure, it might be appealing (in the dark recesses of the normal FA's mind) to see a Barbie type overtaken by a big fattie. But a well-adjusted FA isn't going to mention that to said fattie. Especially upon first interaction, and especially when the girl is so obviously not comfortable with her size.

I think this is a case of a guy who is letting his fantasies carry him away a little bit. Is there room for squashing fantasies and the like in fat admiration? Of course. Should he have blurted it out as if he were talking about a change in the weather? Probably not.

Also, I think it's important to note that weird and otherwise not-socially-acceptable fantasies exist in all people. Guys who like thin girls are into weird things, too. For some reason, though, we never hear "guys who like thin girls are FREAKS" (except maybe within our own little subculture here).

So no, FAs aren't freaks. But there are certainly some freaks who are FAs. And there are some freaks who are fat women, too. It all works out.

[isotope]

That made me lolzerz. Mostly because as many there are well read and intelligent admirers in our community, there's about five million times more weirdos. That goes for any part of society though. peeple r wrd.

[MissToodles]

There are a lot of maladjusted people online, not just endemic in this community. People don't feel free to censor themselves, so you end up speaking to a lot of um to put it mildly interesting types. It just ends up becoming happy fantasy land, where some parties see the other person just like a phone sex operator.

[sweet&fat]

Clearly this guy was a creep who is also an FA. I guess the question is if you believe that the percentage of creeps among FAs is higher than the percentage of creeps among non-FAs. My instinct is no, there are creeps among any population, but I do wonder sometimes if FAs "gone wrong" try to pull off bad behavior more often than their non-FA counterparts because they think BBWs are easier targets.

[Tooz]

Echo, echo, echo.

The FA community has a lot of weird people in it. So does the non-FA rest of the world (tm). As with everything, though, there are fantastic people within the community. The problem is, every time someone has a bad experience, you are far more likely to hear about it. "My husband likes large women, and he treats me wonderfully. I cherish every day we have together!" doesn't attract readers like "and THEN he wanted me to put my _____ on his _____! CAN YOU BELIEVE IT?"

I have seen the freaks, and I have also seen some respectable guys who are FAs. Like "normal" dating, finding a nice person is pretty much a crap shoot. That article except is depressing, though.

[goofy girl]

Originally Posted by LillyBBBW

'fraid so Jay. Some of you FA's are total pervs lacking in the social restraints the good Lord gave to the common mutt. Meeting one off the bat can be traumatizing enough to make you hit anyone who calls you beautiful as hard as you can and then run away. These circus freaks give the rest of you a bad name and unfortunatley they seem to be the ones who do most of the talking, social restraint not being one of their strong points.

I totally agree. There are some wonderful, intelligent, kind FA's out there, however, they seem to be the minority. Or at least, as Lilly mentioned, they aren't as prominent.

Sadly, the article you quoted seems to describe almost every FA I ever knew. Most of the FA's that I have encountered make me feel used (for the belly, the boobs, the arm fat or whatever it is they are into) and not at all that they genuinely want to know me as a person. They feel that because they admire my body and "treat me like a Goddess" (code word for oral sex, I guess?) meant that I should be OK with them grabbing my fat and shaking it or using the back of my knee as a vagina. Ummmm yeah..NO.

No idea if any of this makes any sense (what else is new??), but..anyway, I don't think that just being an FA makes someone a freak, but there are definitely FA freaks out there-lots of them.

[Forgotten_Futures]

All other arguments about what is and isn't an FA and what fetishes are inherently FA-ish and which just involve fatness aside...

Freakishness, in most any case, is subjective. Even freaks often consider themselves to be so. In the case of fat chicks and FA's, the underlying difference arises between the fat chicks and FA's on an individual level.

You have your fat chicks who are, if not necessarily overjoyed at being fat, are at least accepting of the fact and not grossed out by their own existence. On the other hand, you have the fat people who revile themselves for getting/being fat.

No matter what you do, you aren't going to seem normal to a fat chick who hates herself if you profess, honestly or otherwise, to like her because of or in spite of her fatness. She's as likely to be disgusted by you and your feelings as she is of herself, and that's never a good relationship. You might even be lucky enough to link fatness to sexual pleasure in her head, but that'll possibly cause an even bigger rift if she differentiates what gets you on and her as being two separate things. Eventually something will fail, usually badly.

Then again, even the fat chicks who are at peace (or better) with themselves might acknowledge you as a strange person for deviating from the social norm and wanting them for them.

So yeah, we're freaks. But is that entirely a bad thing?

[Jasminium]

I think the author is being a bit wacko herself. I couldn't imagine ruling out an entire group of people just because some were nuts. If I did that, there wouldn't be anyone left to date.

[Fascinita]

Originally Posted by Jay West Coast

What are your experiences with FA's? Are they the wonderful intentions of creation made to appreciate fat women for the beautiful beings they are, or a collection of fellers who could use some counseling? Was this author's experience indicative, or unfortunate and off-base?

Both: Several really "not well" men who bordered on abusive and/or self-hating (which manifested as secretiveness and dishonesty) and/or manipulative and/or just plain weird. And a handful of really nice, regular guys. At least in my case, the author of that piece had experiences that are somewhat indicative of the situation. Though I don't think her take paints the entire picture. For instance, when I was thinner, I met weirdos, too. What's more, although I think my life would be different as a thin person, I would never get the surgery.

To me the bottom line, as far as whether life would be better as a thin girl, is that the men who wouldn't want me as a fattie are probably not the kind of men that I'd want in turn. I can't think in terms of "what if I were thinner." Well, what if I lived in a land of chocolate? That might be nice, too. But it's a dream. I have to live my life as it is now. I can work toward becoming thinner, if that's important to me. But it's not going to make the world a nicer place, and it's not going to keep me from feeling scorned when the boyfriend who'll date me at 125 lbs leaves me when I start gaining weight again. Life seems too short to live worried about keeping the approval of others. I do understand where this woman is coming from, though, and I have lived stories similar to those she wrote about.

I think that this author probably also experienced the whole nine yards of fat discrimination--not just in dating, but in the way people look/don't look at you, the fear of not being able to find work because one is fat, ongoing isolation, loneliness, all of the other stuff we suffer through. Not all of us are isolated or lonely or worried about not finding work, it must be said. But I don't think it's right to say that what this woman experienced is just something you can shrug off and rise above. Not everyone is equipped to do that. It takes years of patience and self-work, at least as far as I know.

Still. Surgery seems just too much of an extreme to go to to get more and less-weird men to pay attention to me. (Of course, some people have to have the surgery for the sake of staving off some other health condition. Not to mention that there can be health problems at heavier weights--though I've known people who had the surgery, and sometimes it seems they traded in one set of problems for another.) And as I said, being thinner does not mean the world is any nicer. There are weird men who like thin women exclusively, too. So I think you have to be realistic and make a life for yourself NOW. Work with what you have, and don't give out your phone number to people you don't know.

[sweet&fat]

Originally Posted by goofy girl

I totally agree. There are some wonderful, intelligent, kind FA's out there, however, they seem to be the minority. Or at least, as Lilly mentioned, they aren't as prominent.

Sadly, the article you quoted seems to describe almost every FA I ever knew. Most of the FA's that I have encountered make me feel used (for the belly, the boobs, the arm fat or whatever it is they are into) and not at all that they genuinely want to know me as a person. They feel that because they admire my body and "treat me like a Goddess" (code word for oral sex, I guess?) meant that I should be OK with them grabbing my fat and shaking it or using the back of my knee as a vagina. Ummmm yeah..NO.

No idea if any of this makes any sense (what else is new??), but..anyway, I don't think that just being an FA makes someone a freak, but there are definitely FA freaks out there-lots of them.

Yeah, many do not know the difference between admiration and objectification. Are FAs any more guilty of this than others?

[goofy girl]

Originally Posted by sweet&fat

Yeah, many do not know the difference between admiration and objectification. Are FAs any more guilty of this than others?

Like others have mentioned this is probably an issue that affects all sorts of fetishes, or preferences. I'm sure it's all the same no matter what ..."community"?..you are in. But, this is the one I know!

[Mini]

The Internet is a double-edged sword: It gives everyone a voice while reminding us that some people should be silenced. Or, in other words, you're going to meet some nice, normal people, but the ones that you'll remember are the socially inept jackasses. I imagine it's exacerbated somewhat due to our community's relatively small size; sorta how nothing travels faster than bad news.

Does that make any sense?

[goofy girl]

Originally Posted by Mini

The Internet is a double-edged sword: It gives everyone a voice while reminding us that some people should be silenced. Or, in other words, you're going to meet some nice, normal people, but the ones that you'll remember are the socially inept jackasses. I imagine it's exacerbated somewhat due to our community's relatively small size; sorta how nothing travels faster than bad news.

Does that make any sense?

It does

Oh, and I really hope the woman that wrote that article doesn't think that if she loses weight, then all of a sudden she's gonna find Prince Charming a week later. She'll probably have to weed out a few more freaks before she does.

[Forgotten_Futures]

Originally Posted by sweet&fat

Yeah, many do not know the difference between admiration and objectification. Are FAs any more guilty of this than others?

Objectification always comes into play somewhere. If you masturbate, you're objectifying someone or something in order to get off. Thus far in life I've come to the tentative conclusion that if someone turns you on simply by existing, it's probably not admiration.

For instance, there's a young woman who works in a pizza shop next door to where I work. She's pregnant, and showing nicely. I find this a highly arousing thing. However, outside of this pregnancy, I never paid much attention to her - she's simply not my type of person. I'm objectifiying her as a pregnant woman simply by being turned on at her current state. Admittedly, I am somewhat ashamed at myself for this. Still, I admit it's a fact of being human. It happens. Not objectifying people in any way is effectively dooming yourself to a life without arousal. Does that mean it's okay? In the confines of a relationship where both partners are okay with it, sure. In normal day-to-day stuff, yeah. Telling random fat people you want to see them squashing someone without so much as accounting for their opinion on the matter? Defintely not okay.

[Blackjack]

So basically, some FA's are total perverted creeps who objectify fat women.

It's also worth noting that there's some men who are total perverted creeps and who objectify women.

Who would've thought that a difference in preferred body shape might mean that we're like normal guys?

So the guy was a fucking creep. Lots of guys are, regardless of what they like.

[goofy girl]

Originally Posted by Blackjack

So basically, some FA's are total perverted creeps who objectify fat women.

It's also worth noting that there's some men who are total perverted creeps and who objectify women.

Who would've thought that a difference in preferred body shape might mean that we're like normal guys?

So the guy was a fucking creep. Lots of guys are, regardless of what they like.

I think that's the point almost all of us are getting at...regardless of preference, there's creeps and there's non creeps.

Personally, I have met alot of creepy FA's..however, I was also looking for FA's, so I probably met more of them than other types.

This is giving me a headache.

[Blackjack]

Originally Posted by goofy girl

I think that's the point almost all of us are getting at...regardless of preference, there's creeps and there's non creeps.

Yeah, but I did the SparkNotes version for people like myself with limited attention span.

[goofy girl]

Originally Posted by Blackjack

Yeah, but I did the SparkNotes version for people like myself with limited attention span.

is that what we used to call Cliff's Notes??


BTW, you're non-creepy Kevin (usually hahaha)

[Blackjack]

Originally Posted by goofy girl

BTW, you're non-creepy Kevin (usually hahaha)

Means I have to try harder, I guess.

[Sweet Tooth]

Seems that, if you have a couple of people whose primary initial source of connection is one of their bodies, you're going to have some level of objectification. Some people just take it obnoxiously far, as if you're there for their use until they're done with you, as if you have no basic rights or feelings of your own. And it seems that the internet brings out these latent tendencies in people who might otherwise at least *try* to be respectful in person.

Bothers me, but I realize it's going to be the same in other ways for other groups of people. If the person has a fundamental disrespect, it won't matter whether they're attracted to fat women or people of a certain color or whatever it may be. They'll objectify the target of the moment.

I've seen some FAs be pretty pathetic, but I've seen that in non-FAs too.

[liz (di-va)]

That article...oy. Thanks for pointing it out!

It's worth reading the whole thing--there's a lot more than the FA bit--as she was somebody who was very involved with fat politics and burlesque, etc. She wasn't somebody who flirted with the idea of being out and proud as a fat chick; she actually was for a while. But then had the surgery anyhow, also despite a lack of (current) health problems.

It's interesting because it's honest. Also icky and alarming and saddening cause it's honest. Also, because like so many pieces these days, it's hopelessly first-person without any thoughtful context about (for instance) FAs, and whom she was speakin for there. She doesn't do anything very helpful or human in her writing there imho. Last time I checked the internet was a fine way to meet weirdos, period.

Her editors should have cut out this line, give me a break:

"I no longer have to post "Lost Dog" signs around town, all the while not knowing that the Chihuahua is actually wedged between my butt cheeks. D'oh!)"

[ripley]

I struggle with this. A LOT. I don't think all FAs are freaks, but there sure are a lot who are. I don't think this guy is a freak for getting off on the squashing-a-Barbie scenario; I think he is a freak for pushing it on a woman he had just met. And that's the rub. I think liking fat women is almost taboo for some, and when they get in an environment (online, at a bash, whatever) where BBWs abound and are looking for love...I think the possibility of having the taboo FA/BBW love come true makes them run wild with every other fantasy they have ever had. It's almost like "Now all my dreams can come true! YOU THERE, RANDOM FAT GIRL, MAKE THEM COME TRUE!" And the BBW is thinking "WTF? I just want a guy who is nice and funny, into me, and not ashamed to be seen with me in public."

Obsessive people are no fun (whether it is a fat-related obsession or speaking in nothing but Klingon, or collecting Civil War Memorabilia to the exclusion of buying food). One note songs are boring, and played long enough are downright creepy. I don't think I'm rare in saying that if I met a guy, got to know and like him, had had conversations about many other things, and then he shared his squashing-a-Barbie fantasy with me...I'd be game to play at it. It's the difference between a man with a slightly off the norm fantasy and a walking obsession that can only see itself.