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Old 06-26-2008, 08:39 PM   #251
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Originally Posted by largenlovely View Post
I honestly feel that in a LOT of instances the feedee winds up being the more dominant partner in those situations. I believe feeders go into worshipping mode.
My current relationship is the only relationship I have been in with a "feeder" but I must say, he is the more submissive one. So I would agree with this statement, I am goddess.

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Old 06-26-2008, 09:05 PM   #252
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Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
having a fantasy is perfectly fine and totally healthy, regardless of what that fantasy is and as long as it stays a fantasy if it endangers the health or safety of themselves of someone else.
Maybe so, but if my boyfriend confessed to me that he fantasized about seeing me so fat I can't move and have to lie in my own filth, I would find it personally very disturbing. As fantasies go, we all have our limits. I don't understand why it's fine to express the fantasy, but not fine to express that one is disturbed by it.

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don't you think they have enough internal guilt about their fantasies as it is?
Isn't the guilt part of the thrill? In my rudimentary understanding of psychology, people who enjoy transgression tend to enjoy it because it is transgressive--it's the awareness that something is "forbidden" that makes it so appealing. Once something ceases to be tabboo, the thrill of breaking the tabboo goes away, too.
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Old 06-27-2008, 05:57 AM   #253
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Originally Posted by dodo View Post
I went to the Terminal Cancer and Oncology/Chemo Admiration Board and tried to find those things sexy. I can't help you. In fact, I've given thought to all sorts of scenarios (some involving livestock) and - only one does it for me. Blame it on the dna. I'll take blubber.
I'll take "fantasies involving livestock" for $200, Alex

I do have a male friend who finds bald women extremely sexy. Obviously, he's not looking for a cancer survivor (though ... he did find Natalie Portman attractive beyond belief in "V for Vendetta" ... and to me, she looked about 5 lost pounds away from death) but given his prediliction, I've no doubt he's ogled a chemo patient or two. Of course, he'd have no way of knowing the reason behind why the object of his lusty gaze is bald. He just likes bald chicks. The prevert

(General Disclaimer: That's a joke. I am in no way judging my friend who likes 'em bald. Nor am I comparing fat women to bald people. Or claiming that Jeebus liked to torture cute 'n cuddly animals)
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Old 06-27-2008, 09:34 AM   #254
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Originally Posted by Fascinita View Post
Maybe so, but if my boyfriend confessed to me that he fantasized about seeing me so fat I can't move and have to lie in my own filth, I would find it personally very disturbing. As fantasies go, we all have our limits. I don't understand why it's fine to express the fantasy, but not fine to express that one is disturbed by it.



Isn't the guilt part of the thrill? In my rudimentary understanding of psychology, people who enjoy transgression tend to enjoy it because it is transgressive--it's the awareness that something is "forbidden" that makes it so appealing. Once something ceases to be tabboo, the thrill of breaking the tabboo goes away, too.
Wow...good post Lady.
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Old 06-27-2008, 11:32 AM   #255
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I'd post this in the Arousal Survey thread but I expect it'd be considered verboten hate speech there?

I've been thinking about why I'm so uncomfortable with some of these fantasy discussions. Basically I think it's somewhat because I've hardly ever had any? The fact that I am borderline Asperger’s syndrome (high functioning autistic) probably has something to do with it? I basically just lack imagination.

There's also the fact that because I physically matured very early there wasn't much time between when I started thinking about sex and when I actually started having it (age 13). Again, perhaps because of the aspergers I'm largely lacking in social skills and awareness. I have been an out and proud FA from the beginning. Never shy about letting BBW know I was interested. Quite frankly when you can do that it keeps you a little busy to bother with fantasies.

That said, I have been in relationships with BBW/SSBBW most of my life since adolescence. I have cared for, lived with and been married to them for a long time. That means when they are embarrassed, uncomfortable or hurting I've been there with them. I am not the most empathetic person in the world, far from it. Seeing her face as we wait interminably with a group of friends for a table rather than a booth, watching her struggle through crowds both for breath and room, feeling her anxiety as she tests a chair with her weight, treating her wounds that don't heal because of poor circulation and a hundred other things with a dozen different women, I wonder how I’m supposed to fantasize or be aroused by what has already been frighteningly real?

I wonder too, how many of the respondents on the survey thread have ever been on so much as a date with a BBW? How many have ever been in a committed relationship or married to one, or ever will be? Hard not to think of that New Testament verse:

“When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.” I Corinthians 13:11 *

Selfish fantasies, and for me that means ones that degrade or objectify others, are childish. Not so much abhorrent as pitiable in a grown man. Almost like a the way a boy role plays about the honor and grandeur of war until he grows up and sees the unspeakable cruelty of it all.

All this by way of saying I’m through apologizing for how I feel about degrading fantasies. If you need them to enjoy sex maybe you’re just not mature enough to be having sex? And as always I freely and completely acknowledge this is just my opinion. It's not intended to suppress or deny anyone else their truths or happiness. Infantile wankers. Well, at least I feel better now.

* I'm a non-observant Jew, fyi. Don't want any undue aspersions cast against Christians.
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Old 06-27-2008, 11:41 AM   #256
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Originally Posted by Ernest Nagel View Post
Words go here
For those who didn't bother to read all that, I'll summarize:

"I'm going to stop apologizing for what I think, which is that you're freaks and shouldn't be having sex."
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Old 06-27-2008, 11:52 AM   #257
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Originally Posted by Blackjack View Post
For those who didn't bother to read all that, I'll summarize:

"I'm going to stop apologizing for what I think, which is that you're freaks and shouldn't be having sex."
Or, another version (likely closer to the truth): "I'm uncomfortable with the thought of obtaining any kind of pleasure from the suffering of other people."

Ernest, to clarify: You aren't suggesting that the fantasy itself is wrong, are you? I've read you to mean that carrying out such fantasies is the act that you find personally unacceptable.
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Old 06-27-2008, 12:01 PM   #258
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Originally Posted by TraciJo67 View Post
Or, another version (likely closer to the truth): "I'm uncomfortable with the thought of obtaining any kind of pleasure from the suffering of other people."

Ernest, to clarify: You aren't suggesting that the fantasy itself is wrong, are you? I've read you to mean that carrying out such fantasies is the act that you find personally unacceptable.
Oh please don't leave out the gratuitous name calling. That's the funniest part. But he's the victim in all of this, just so we're clear.
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Old 06-27-2008, 02:11 PM   #259
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Originally Posted by TraciJo67 View Post
Or, another version (likely closer to the truth): "I'm uncomfortable with the thought of obtaining any kind of pleasure from the suffering of other people."

Ernest, to clarify: You aren't suggesting that the fantasy itself is wrong, are you? I've read you to mean that carrying out such fantasies is the act that you find personally unacceptable.
Yes, thank you Traci, but I want to be completely honest. That anyone should take even imaginary pleasure from real suffering is more than troubling to me. Since the real suffering described in the survey very much DOES exist however, the fantasy line seems very blurry. They get hard from thinking about those things but not actually seeing them, so that's OK? (Yeah, right) Or they didn't personally cause those things so their arousal is "innocent"?

I understand the whole "forbidden fruit" attraction. No problems there. Fantasize away. This strikes me more as a "rights" issue, though. As in "My right to swing my fist ends at your nose" My right to a hard-on ends at your hardship. Still leaves lots of room for brazen and blazing kinkiness, imo.

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Originally Posted by LillyBBBW View Post
Oh please don't leave out the gratuitous name calling. That's the funniest part. But he's the victim in all of this, just so we're clear.
Passive-aggressive much? I enjoyed the company of every abundant woman I've ever been with and continue to choose them without hesitation. It's never occurred to me for an instant that I've lost anything that wasn't more than compensated for by the companionship of some very lovely ladies. Do I wish society could be a little more accepting of them and those who love them? Sure. Are the physical consequences of being very large troubling to me? Absolutely! If that makes me a victim in your determination then what is Dims but Victim Central?

I'm not really defending myself to you, btw, Lilly. just letting others know they don't have to put up with yours or anyone else's bullying if they don't choose to. I don't embrace everything you do. You're the one who's got a problem with that and has gone out of her way to attack me. Fine. I've never attacked you, unless you object to the truth as a counter-attack? Which one of us does that make more intolerant?

As to gratuitous name calling; I referred to those who fantasize about the suffering of others as pitiable children. You either didn't read any other part of my post or you don't understand the meaning of the word "gratuitous". The "infantile wankers" comment was clearly intended by the emoticons as a joke. Be sure you pick up your sense of humor when you log off.
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Last edited by Ernest Nagel; 06-27-2008 at 02:18 PM. Reason: Took back something harsher than I meant to say.
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Old 06-27-2008, 02:17 PM   #260
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well it seems i have two options

1) years of therapy to rid myself of this evil curse
2) hang myself

sorry i'm the way i am.
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Old 06-27-2008, 06:24 PM   #261
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First off, Lilly is not "bullying"- she's responding to you implying that feederism is a sick, twisted, sadistic evil thing, and that those who enjoy it are lesser beings than you.




Also, we get it, Ernest- you have a problem with it.

I repeat:

You have a problem with it.

Once more:

YOU have a problem with it.


That, I think, is more the issue here than the eroticizing of size and such- which you manage to get totally wrong, by the way.

There's a difference between being aroused by suffering and pain (which is normally called "sadism", if I'm not mistaken) and being aroused by supersized partners. The fantasies exist separate from the pain and suffering and such for most people, I should think.

It's not the joint aches, the poor healing, the embarassment or whatever that turns some feeders on. Those are usually (but not necessarily) side effects of what does, and nonetheless I'm pretty damned sure that most rational people would be more worried about those things and the well-being of the other person than their boner or panty puddles.

Yes, there are cases where people get that backwards and are more concerned about getting off than they are about the well-being of others; I would agree that those people are less mature than the ones who're a bit less selfish and kinder.

But those cases are the extremes and not the norm, from what I can tell.

Please, stop acting as though everyone who's into feederism is on the lunatic fringe, putting their own desires over what's sensible, reasonable, or ethical.
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Old 06-27-2008, 07:14 PM   #262
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Originally Posted by Blackjack View Post
First off, Lilly is not "bullying"- she's responding to you implying that feederism is a sick, twisted, sadistic evil thing, and that those who enjoy it are lesser beings than you.




Also, we get it, Ernest- you have a problem with it.

I repeat:

You have a problem with it.

Once more:

YOU have a problem with it.


That, I think, is more the issue here than the eroticizing of size and such- which you manage to get totally wrong, by the way.

There's a difference between being aroused by suffering and pain (which is normally called "sadism", if I'm not mistaken) and being aroused by supersized partners. The fantasies exist separate from the pain and suffering and such for most people, I should think.

It's not the joint aches, the poor healing, the embarassment or whatever that turns some feeders on. Those are usually (but not necessarily) side effects of what does, and nonetheless I'm pretty damned sure that most rational people would be more worried about those things and the well-being of the other person than their boner or panty puddles.

Yes, there are cases where people get that backwards and are more concerned about getting off than they are about the well-being of others; I would agree that those people are less mature than the ones who're a bit less selfish and kinder.

But those cases are the extremes and not the norm, from what I can tell.

Please, stop acting as though everyone who's into feederism is on the lunatic fringe, putting their own desires over what's sensible, reasonable, or ethical.
Couldn't have said it better myself....props to you Kevin.
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Old 06-27-2008, 07:16 PM   #263
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what HE said lol

I don't think i should ever post again...i'll just take snippets of what everyone else says and just agree with it lol

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackjack View Post
First off, Lilly is not "bullying"- she's responding to you implying that feederism is a sick, twisted, sadistic evil thing, and that those who enjoy it are lesser beings than you.

Yes, there are cases where people get that backwards and are more concerned about getting off than they are about the well-being of others; I would agree that those people are less mature than the ones who're a bit less selfish and kinder.

But those cases are the extremes and not the norm, from what I can tell.

Please, stop acting as though everyone who's into feederism is on the lunatic fringe, putting their own desires over what's sensible, reasonable, or ethical.
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Old 06-27-2008, 08:57 PM   #264
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Originally Posted by Ernest Nagel View Post
Yes, thank you Traci, but I want to be completely honest. That anyone should take even imaginary pleasure from real suffering is more than troubling to me. Since the real suffering described in the survey very much DOES exist however, the fantasy line seems very blurry. They get hard from thinking about those things but not actually seeing them, so that's OK? (Yeah, right) Or they didn't personally cause those things so their arousal is "innocent"?

I understand the whole "forbidden fruit" attraction. No problems there. Fantasize away. This strikes me more as a "rights" issue, though. As in "My right to swing my fist ends at your nose" My right to a hard-on ends at your hardship. Still leaves lots of room for brazen and blazing kinkiness, imo.



Passive-aggressive much? I enjoyed the company of every abundant woman I've ever been with and continue to choose them without hesitation. It's never occurred to me for an instant that I've lost anything that wasn't more than compensated for by the companionship of some very lovely ladies. Do I wish society could be a little more accepting of them and those who love them? Sure. Are the physical consequences of being very large troubling to me? Absolutely! If that makes me a victim in your determination then what is Dims but Victim Central?

I'm not really defending myself to you, btw, Lilly. just letting others know they don't have to put up with yours or anyone else's bullying if they don't choose to. I don't embrace everything you do. You're the one who's got a problem with that and has gone out of her way to attack me. Fine. I've never attacked you, unless you object to the truth as a counter-attack? Which one of us does that make more intolerant?

As to gratuitous name calling; I referred to those who fantasize about the suffering of others as pitiable children. You either didn't read any other part of my post or you don't understand the meaning of the word "gratuitous". The "infantile wankers" comment was clearly intended by the emoticons as a joke. Be sure you pick up your sense of humor when you log off.
Damn. You're so good. You caught me, I never log off. Only long enough to relieve myself, eat, smear salve on my bedsores and engage in deviant activities. See, this is how it works. You post something, we post something in return. Sometimes we agree, sometimes we don't. Sometimes you find what we say offensive, sometimes we find your sentimants offensive. You have the right to express any opinion or judgements on personal character you like apparently. If that were not the case you would have been banned long ago. The downside of all of this is everyone else gets to express their opinion on what you say too and tolerance was never among any of my claims. There are plenty of things I have no tolerance for nor can I find humor in, just as you. I hope you can deal with that.
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Old 06-27-2008, 09:34 PM   #265
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Originally Posted by LillyBBBW View Post
Oh please don't leave out the gratuitous name calling. That's the funniest part. But he's the victim in all of this, just so we're clear.
Oh, um right. Reasoned, well thought out and articulate response. Not attacking me personally. Pointing out the flaws in my reasoning. Not attempting to paint me as an outsider challenging the reigning elite here. No, I guess you're right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackjack View Post
First off, Lilly is not "bullying"- she's responding to you implying that feederism is a sick, twisted, sadistic evil thing, and that those who enjoy it are lesser beings than you.




Also, we get it, Ernest- you have a problem with it.

I repeat:

You have a problem with it.

Once more:

YOU have a problem with it.


That, I think, is more the issue here than the eroticizing of size and such- which you manage to get totally wrong, by the way.

There's a difference between being aroused by suffering and pain (which is normally called "sadism", if I'm not mistaken) and being aroused by supersized partners. The fantasies exist separate from the pain and suffering and such for most people, I should think.

It's not the joint aches, the poor healing, the embarassment or whatever that turns some feeders on. Those are usually (but not necessarily) side effects of what does, and nonetheless I'm pretty damned sure that most rational people would be more worried about those things and the well-being of the other person than their boner or panty puddles.

Yes, there are cases where people get that backwards and are more concerned about getting off than they are about the well-being of others; I would agree that those people are less mature than the ones who're a bit less selfish and kinder.

But those cases are the extremes and not the norm, from what I can tell.

Please, stop acting as though everyone who's into feederism is on the lunatic fringe, putting their own desires over what's sensible, reasonable, or ethical.
First, check the wording of the survey, which is specifically what I was responding to. It doesn't say "aroused by images or thoughts of" or "aroused by fantasies of" does it? I can cut and paste if you want me to?

Secondly, did I say one damn word about feeders? Was that survey about Feeders? If so you're gonna need to cut and paste that one for me cuz I'm totally missing it.

Again, for the umpteenth time I have never said or implied ANYONE is sick, twisted, evil or sadistic. Not on these boards and nowhere irl, either. My personal philosophy, for whatever business it is of anyone's, doesn't even acknowledge the validity of any such concept as "evil". Nor will you find any instance where I have suggested that Feederism is on the lunatic fringe. What I've said, repeatedly, and you've really gotta be working overtime to miss this one, is ANYTHING among consenting adults is entirely their business. Now if there were to be a debate about the nature of consent, whether someone is giving informed consent in particular, you might not like my interpretation but I've not spoken specifically to that here.

If you or anyone else disagrees with me I have absolutely no issue with you, no problem. When you misrepresent both my words and intent solely for the purpose of bolstering your own argument and purporting that I'm some self-righteous dickweed (and yeah, you plainly DID imply that, just so we're clear on what the word means) just because I can't personally sign off on specific things that strike me as very disrespectful of BBW, causes me to doubt your security with your own position.

Why is my standing for my personal conviction in this so threatening and offensive? Are you that insecure? I'm one guy trying to articulate what skeeves me out about the responses to that survey. I don't want to be identified or assumed a feeder. I don't wanna be identified as a Catholic priest, rodeo clown or academic either. Doesn't mean I'm condemning those things. They're just not my bag.

In closing, if you're gonna attack me I'd appreciate some valid points based on facts. I'm not that hard to vilify for completely legitimate reasons. I will complain about this type of outright lies and misrepresentation if it occurs again. I'm not a victim but I do believe allowing this kind of ad hominem BS to persist is unhealthy for the future of Dims.

As if I should have to say this, none of the foregoing, in this or previous posts is to suggest that I am superior in any way to those who hold contradicting opinions. The fact that I won't lie to make a point or disguise my position to appear other than what I am? Yeah, maybe a little superior in that.
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Old 06-27-2008, 10:05 PM   #266
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Other people's opinions aren't personal attacks, you know.

Additionally, I like how we're supposed to respond to your opinion with facts.
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Old 06-27-2008, 11:51 PM   #267
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I'd post this in the Arousal Survey thread but I expect it'd be considered verboten hate speech there?
Really? Why?

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I've been thinking about why I'm so uncomfortable with some of these fantasy discussions. Basically I think it's somewhat because I've hardly ever had any? The fact that I am borderline Asperger’s syndrome (high functioning autistic) probably has something to do with it? I basically just lack imagination.
I've never been pregnant and I don't have any kids. Surely I have a lot of opinions and some of them are wrong. I can stand as stoicly behind them as I like but without first hand experience it would not be surprising to have expectant mothers get upset when I pontificate repeatedly about how to bear and raise children.


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There's also the fact that because I physically matured very early there wasn't much time between when I started thinking about sex and when I actually started having it (age 13). Again, perhaps because of the aspergers I'm largely lacking in social skills and awareness. I have been an out and proud FA from the beginning. Never shy about letting BBW know I was interested. Quite frankly when you can do that it keeps you a little busy to bother with fantasies.
I matured early also. I did not begin having sex until my early 30's. Yes, it was because I was frigid and prudish, I wanted to wait until I was in a comitted relationship with someone who cares about me and not about gathering experiences. My knowledge of sex even now is rather limited due to extreme selectiveness on my part, however I do know a lot about fantasies. Those I enjoyed liberally so I consider myhself somewhat well versed on that subject. I won't lecture you about what goes on in your bedroom.

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That said, I have been in relationships with BBW/SSBBW most of my life since adolescence. I have cared for, lived with and been married to them for a long time. That means when they are embarrassed, uncomfortable or hurting I've been there with them. I am not the most empathetic person in the world, far from it. Seeing her face as we wait interminably with a group of friends for a table rather than a booth, watching her struggle through crowds both for breath and room, feeling her anxiety as she tests a chair with her weight, treating her wounds that don't heal because of poor circulation and a hundred other things with a dozen different women, I wonder how I’m supposed to fantasize or be aroused by what has already been frighteningly real?
No one is asking you to fantasize or be aroused by anything. Stay as you are. What most take issue with is you judging people on something you have no common frame of reference for.

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I wonder too, how many of the respondents on the survey thread have ever been on so much as a date with a BBW? How many have ever been in a committed relationship or married to one, or ever will be? Hard not to think of that New Testament verse:

“When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.” I Corinthians 13:11 *

Selfish fantasies, and for me that means ones that degrade or objectify others, are childish. Not so much abhorrent as pitiable in a grown man. Almost like a the way a boy role plays about the honor and grandeur of war until he grows up and sees the unspeakable cruelty of it all.
This analogy about people here not having experiences with BBW's or ever having to care for one is one of the most inflammatory statements you've said so far. My expereinces go back generations, not even counting my own personal existence as a SSBBW. What I am is what I am and I do what I have to do. You can feel what you want to feel but keep your pity. I don't appreciate you smugly lecturing me on how I'm supposed to feel about it.

Fantasies are selfish. I really don't even know what else to say to you Nagel. You could reveal a fantasy about having sex with two women at once to your lover but she probably won't share it. This does not mean the fantasy will go away or that by thinking about it you are subjecting her to some cruelty or you're cheating on her. The fantasy is for you. It is a selfish indulgence that began long before you ever met her.

When I was a child I thought I wanted to be a nurse. When I got older I researched and found out via other first hand experiences that being a nurse is a shitty job. Knowing myself well I was certain that I wouldn't like it so I stopped wishing for it. Knowledge is what made me stop thinking as a child, not fairytales and wonderous guessing at what nursing must be like. And I certainly don't think nurses childish because they didn't see things as I did. My imaginings at my younger age would seem amusing to a real nurse who's on her feet all day dealing with the reality.

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All this by way of saying I’m through apologizing for how I feel about degrading fantasies. If you need them to enjoy sex maybe you’re just not mature enough to be having sex? And as always I freely and completely acknowledge this is just my opinion. It's not intended to suppress or deny anyone else their truths or happiness. Infantile wankers. Well, at least I feel better now.

* I'm a non-observant Jew, fyi. Don't want any undue aspersions cast against Christians.
I don't recall you ever apologizing for how you feel nor do I recall anyone demanding that you do. Go ahead and keep posting what you feel whenever you feel so inclined. You can post them here or you can post them over there. Someone is bound to have an opinion on it and will post their feelings too. It can't always be back slaps and beer steins Nagel, sometimes someone will strongly disagree with you. When they do it does not mean you are being attacked or persecuted. It means they are exercising their right to voice their opinion on what you say just as you've done. Your defensive stance is what makes you appear to be making yourself out to be a victim here.
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Old 06-28-2008, 04:15 AM   #268
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Default Geez, why am I even bothering?

This thread is making my head spin. I've lost track of the actual number of arguments going on in here right now. But I saw one thing in this post of Ernest's and I just wanted to address this. And Ernest, I hope you know, I'm not attacking you. I'm really not. This is actually meant in a very friendly way.
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First, check the wording of the survey, which is specifically what I was responding to. It doesn't say "aroused by images or thoughts of" or "aroused by fantasies of" does it? I can cut and paste if you want me to?
That's the reason so many people had trouble with the wording of the questions in that poll. Because to answer the actual question you had to accept an aspect of it that might not actually be true for you as an FA. For example, I answered the first two categories, but I do not enjoy anyone's embarrassment or struggle. But the things listed next to those words were things that I did get turned on by. See? That's why everyone said the wording was out of hand judgmental, because to say you like to see someone pop a button off a blouse meant you had to answer that you enjoyed their embarrassment. For some both things may be present, but for others, it's just the actual popped button or broken chair or whatever. But we still had to say we liked the embarrassment because it was in the question. It would have had far fewer responses if only people who liked those things and liked the pain, struggle, etc answered.

As for these other shenanigans, what ever happened to gradations and combinations and different extremes of things? When did an interest in feederism automatically mean that you want to see someone immobile? Or degraded? There are so many permutations and combinations that can fall just under the heading of a feeder/feedee relationship alone and that's before you get to all the other fetishes. And then there's still all the different questions of embarrassment or pain etc, and being turned on by it or not and then feeling guilty about it or not and on and on. But somehow all the different shades of fetishism are getting lost and suddenly it's FA only or menace to your fellow humans. And apparently, I'm not real because I keep seeing that there are no women who enjoy a partner's weight gain or any of the things on the infamous arousal list or whatever. This is all so bizarre. Look, you've confused me and I'M A FETISHIST.

I get that it bothers you Ernest when someone such as yourself who has no fetishes is lumped in with those of us FAs who do have them. I get that. And, strangely (because I'm in a strangely good mood and you and I, traditionally, get along) I am not actually offended by your stance. I'm guessing it's because you think it makes all BBW more leery of FAs because they think all FAs are feeders, is that right? So, women who don't want that type of relationship will automatically reject FAs because they would think an FA is a fetishist. OK, fine. I can kind of see that, except for a couple of things. There are BBW in this very thread defending feederism. I also think many of the BBW of the world can tell the difference between a feeder and a non-feeder. I'm not trying to be snarky with you, Ernest, you know that. I'm trying to understand why it is that this issue bothers you so much. I really am. I don't think you should have to pretend that you're OK with something you're not, but I don't see why you think it's so important to split off "FA only FAs" and "fetishist FAs." And how would you even do that? There's so much overlap about so many things. And some people might not be fetishists, but have an interest in exploring certain things on certain occasions. And I think if everything on that arousal poll makes a person a fetishist, you'd probably find a small number of FAs who didn't find at least one thing on that list arousing.

Here's the thing, I'm sure some people fit into these extreme categories as fetishists, but most do not. Most of us fall somewhere on a spectrum and we have differences within the fetishes and things like that. In my little fetishist head, none of this is quite as complicated or as sinister as you're making it out to be. Maybe it is for some, but it's not for me. To me, it's actually pretty straight forward and the only issue for me is guilt or no guilt. And yes, for some things there is guilt and no, in my personal case I do not find the guilt and taboo exciting. I find it the kind of thing that gave me insomnia and used to keep me up crying at nights worrying that I should never go within 50 feet of anyone I might actually ever care about because I would no doubt bring about their destruction because I was a freak and I couldn't possibly be trusted. It's true. And I didn't even need anyone else on this board to tell me that, I came up with all that berating on my own. But I thought about things A LOT, read things here on the boards, thought about experiences I'd had in my life and learned my own boundaries. And now, I'm comfortable with them and I can deal with them and I feel that I have control over my fantasies and my desires and everything else. Really, for many of us it's a process. Sure, some never get that far, but really many of us do and we struggle with it and everything else. But WE CAN'T CHANGE HOW WE FEEL. If you believe that someone is "hard wired" as an FA(and I'm guessing you believe that to be true of at least some FAs) why can't you accept it might be true of fetishists too? I'm not comfortable getting any more detailed here on the board, but honestly, Ernest, this is a sincere offer, PM me if you want to have me explain my personal path and my personal thoughts and feelings to you on this matter. I can't help you on the immobility one since I'm not into that, but I've got a fair number of the other things covered to some degree. You can ask me anything. I mean that. And I won't try to convince you of anything being right or wrong, or that I'm not a monster or anything else, but at least, you'll have the chance to hopefully see that, while you may not want anything to do with us, we're not really so menacing that an actual division needs to be thrown up. That's what I'm hoping and that's why I'm offering. I also am pretty sure you don't think I'm a monster, so maybe hearing it from me would help. So, again, it's a sincere offer, no snark, no offense on my part, nothing.

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well it seems i have two options
1) years of therapy to rid myself of this evil curse
2) hang myself

sorry i'm the way i am.
3)reread this thread over and over until it drives you slowly insane to the point you can no longer form a coherent thought and none of this will bother you any more

Seriously my friend, I know exactly how you feel.
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Old 06-28-2008, 04:16 AM   #269
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What if I'd described a scenario in which I watched a friend or family member suffer from a life-threatening illness, and I witness her falter, shrivel into a hollowed-out husk of what she once was, lose her hair from chemo, develop sores all over the areas of her body targeted by radiation ...

... and the response I got was, "Wow .... that's sad, but bald heads are *so* sexy!"
So, have you had that conversation with your friend who likes the bald girls? And did you let it slide because you actually know him personally and know that he's not a monster that prowls around hospitals to find a date?
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Old 06-28-2008, 08:05 AM   #270
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*******Dr. P's Brilliant Post******
I was raised by and around SSBBW's. One in particular became ill and her husband left her. She became crabby and ill tempered due to her aches and pains and her loss of mobility. Somehow between that, the constant help and allowances that had to be made for her and her turning to alcohol to deal with stress he ended up leaving her for another woman. I never saw this other woman but the family trashed her as a young hussey. Don't know if she was thin or fat, a good person or a bad person but I do know my aunt was devastated and was never quite the same when he left her. He just couldn't handle her illness

A cousin of mine married late in life. She died of cancer a year or so ago but her outcome was completely different than my aunts. She and her husband handled the aging process with such a graceful dignity. Anything that happened to either of them they dealt with, it was just a part of living. At one point she had to care for him after his emergency bypass that neither of them saw coming. Nobody saw an illness, a limp, thinning hair or surgical scars they saw a 'person.' He truly loved her and was a serious FA. He loved her sway when she walked, he loved her sway when she used a cane, he loved her sway when she was in a walker - he loved and was turned on by HER in whatever state she was in. Her smile still warmed him as she lay balded and weak in a hospital bed. I'm holding out hope that I can have what they had. I don't want someone like my uncle.

The wording of that questionaire made it difficult to express true intent. It really was as Sandie said: like asking someone if they still beat their wife. A person may not be turned on 'by' someone suffering but the love and desire for the person never ceases. Speaking only for me I don't want someone furrowing their brow at my distress. That's not what I'm like and don't want someone bringing me down and looking at me and only seeing physical hardship, aging and glorying in my physical deterioration under the guise of concern. I certainly see myself as more than that and if someone can still appreciate my humor, value my friendship, look forward to my company and think I'm hot even as I'm ambling through my daily struggels it's all good. I'm not knocking anyone elses feelings, this is just how I feel.

EDITED TO ADD: If someone sees my struggles as disgusting they're all wrong for me.
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Old 06-28-2008, 08:18 AM   #271
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Just a note, the poll thread is the poll thread, this thread is this thread.

Bringing responses here just to avoid the rules of the area where the poll was placed, and deliberately placed by the person who started it, is not going to be tolerated.

You don't get to just drag other threads in here because it's already contentious and a free-for-all.

Thank you.

Slash, mod.
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Old 06-28-2008, 10:15 AM   #272
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as a woman who has never just shut up and taken it, i feel like i should add that in many of these situations where the woman is gaining and her partner is enjoying it and getting off on embarrassing situations or struggle, sometimes (often even, in the couples that i know and myself included) also are getting off on the struggle and embarrassment.

in many feedee/feeder relationships the feedee is actually the dominant one. she orders her feeder around and has the upper hand in the situation. i know several such couples. some of which even involve the feedee verbally degrading the feedee while making demands.

there are many examples of female suffering being eroticized in our culture, but there are also many exampled of men being forced to suffer in an erotic situation as well. (CBT, forced cross dressing, human ash trays, human furniture, general verbal humiliation, etc.)
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Old 06-28-2008, 01:29 PM   #273
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Submission aspects?

Well, if you really want to go there, women have long been conditioned by society to submit to the “might of the penis.” In other words, it is beaten into their heads that sexuality is only for the enjoyment of men and they must be good little girls and submit to the desires and fantasies of men without question.

Resulting in many people of both genders having an unhealthy view of sexuality in my opinion. Too many people view sex as a battle of dominance and submission and not one of mutual enjoyment and or an expression of love. Again, in my opinion.

Marry me.



...or



... ummmmm



... we could just have some of that mutually enjoyable sex!



*giggles*




*blushing* and *hiding*


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Old 06-28-2008, 02:15 PM   #274
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So, have you had that conversation with your friend who likes the bald girls? And did you let it slide because you actually know him personally and know that he's not a monster that prowls around hospitals to find a date?

I don't think that you're a monster, Bruce. I don't know anything about you, actually ... aside from a few posts that I heartily disagreed with, that had nothing whatsoever to do with feederism. Whatever I think of those posts, I do not believe that you are a monster, or anything approaching that.
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