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Old 02-02-2009, 10:28 AM   #26
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If I wasn't married (to a guy) I could see myself going out with women. I even tried dating a few women, but got bit by the because I wasn't "pure lesbian". So my experience with the female sex got cut off before I had a chance to even find out if it was truly for me.
I'm happy with my man, don't get me wrong...but I am willing to bet had I fell (given the chance) for a girl it could have worked out just as well
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Old 02-02-2009, 10:39 AM   #27
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If I wasn't married (to a guy) I could see myself going out with women. I even tried dating a few women, but got bit by the because I wasn't "pure lesbian". So my experience with the female sex got cut off before I had a chance to even find out if it was truly for me.
I'm happy with my man, don't get me wrong...but I am willing to bet had I fell (given the chance) for a girl it could have worked out just as well
i have heard a lot of women saying that. I hate that so many bi-sexual lassies have said that mean lezzers have put them off having more girl experiences!! I have had more experiences with bi women than gay women.. Actually, ive had more experiences with "straight" women than gay..actually..which is weird now i think about it. Though, i used to be (i'm a monogomous beasty) one of those lesbians who didnt care about Bi-curiosity..i'm all for experimentation!
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Old 02-02-2009, 11:51 AM   #28
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On the subject of desires and sexual research I recently saw this article about some new research on that subject:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/25/ma...t.html?_r=2&hp

It's a long read, but interesting, going over a study about what people say arouses them and then what arousal is measured at the same time. Really I can't do it justice in a short description, but it is a good read for anyone interested in the topic.
That was a very interesting read, thanks for linking to it! I recall a study coming out a year or two ago, somewhat along the lines of what was discussed in this article, where they'd measured arousal with brain scans. It had also found that women's sexuality tended to be pretty broad, while it concluded that men were either homo or hetero sexual. On the other hand there are men, even if not so many, who consider themselves to be bisexual, so I don't know how that relates to studies that say guys just aren't.

Something else I wonder about is the 'typical' male or female brain, and how many of us really are typical? Can a man have sexual programming more like a woman? Can a woman have sexual programming more like a man? I'm probably particularly interested because in my case, a lot of what I read about women's sexuality seems to describe how I feel much more closely than what I read about male sexuality, even though I'm a predominantly hetero-sexual guy. And when you think about it, how well do most of us fit into any particular category?
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Old 02-02-2009, 05:08 PM   #29
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Bexy,
What an amazingly awesome thread! Until today, I had no idea Kinsey's scale existed, but I'm tickled to learn about it--I've always said/felt few are really 100% homosexual or heterosexual and I'm glad to see Kinsey backing me up!

Many of you have in essence, summed up my feelings, but I think bi-sexuality is absolutely a "real" sexual orientation. Although I identify myself as (mostly) heterosexual, I have had sexual experiences with girls, though I found them "lacking" in some intangible way. These, I know, are merely my encounters, and have nothing to do with anyone else's sexual experiences and/or feelings.

Furthermore, I wish more people would have the awesomely open-minded and eloquently worded feelings you all seem to have about one's sexual orientation. Honestly, the only thing I want for other people I know is for them to be happy with their life, and I firmly believe part of that happiness is the ability to express yourself sexually, no matter how you do it or with whom. All I want is for others to be able to express themselves without fear, bias or prejudice. Kudos to Bexy for another step in the right direction by starting this thread!
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Old 02-02-2009, 05:57 PM   #30
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I am really enjoying reading everyone's responses!
I guess I use the term bisexual as I have been with women, find women equally as attractive as men, and could be in a long term relationship with either sex.

SO bisexual seems to fit, but thats probably because there is no term for "girl who likes mostly fat girls, mostly slender guys, but sometimes likes chubby guys, likes her girls to be girly and her boys to be even girlier"

I am curious to explore more those girls who do and have kissed women but refer to themselves as straight.
To me, straight is someone who is 100% hetero, opposite sex only thank you very much
Am I wrong to think that? Is there another word to describe this that isn't bicurious or bisexual? Does it even matter lol!?
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Old 02-02-2009, 06:16 PM   #31
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I can only speak for me, bexy, but I would love to be able to say I was bi. I just don't think it's fair to women who like to be completely sexual with other women, as it would be misleading.

"Hi, I'm bisexual, but don't actually want to touch your vajayjay" seems more than a little disingenous to me. lol.
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Old 02-02-2009, 06:22 PM   #32
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SO bisexual seems to fit, but thats probably because there is no term for "girl who likes mostly fat girls, mostly slender guys, but sometimes likes chubby guys, likes her girls to be girly and her boys to be even girlier"
I believe the term you are looking for is "Bexy".
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Old 02-02-2009, 06:31 PM   #33
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I can only speak for me, bexy, but I would love to be able to say I was bi. I just don't think it's fair to women who like to be completely sexual with other women, as it would be misleading.

"Hi, I'm bisexual, but don't actually want to touch your vajayjay" seems more than a little disingenous to me. lol.
Is that just my vajajay or any woman's?

I totally get what you mean though. It really does seem terms such as straight, gay and bi are still very open to interpretation and mean different things to different people.

And as has been said before, sexuality is so very fluid and therefore ultimately impossible to describe with those three words.
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Old 02-02-2009, 06:34 PM   #34
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I wonder if the whole attitude "you're not really into women if you're also attracted to men" is a kind of 'straightophobia' (made that up just now)?

As far as the original question goes, when asked I will identify as a bi-sexual because I am attracted to men and women equally and have been intimate with both. My first sexual encounter was with a woman, and my best friend swears on her pink triangle that makes me a lesbian. But as Butch mentions, my sexuality is kind of hard to pin down.

Great topic, though. The responses have been phenomenal to read. Very thought provoking.
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Old 02-02-2009, 06:34 PM   #35
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If I COULD make an exception for any woman's, it would be yours, Bexy. lol. I'm somewhere between straight and bi...closer to straight...but I still looooove kissing a beautiful woman.

I'd make out with mszwebs and/or Cold Comfort in a blinking heartbeat. Shhh....
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Old 02-02-2009, 07:13 PM   #36
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To me, straight is someone who is 100% hetero, opposite sex only thank you very much
Am I wrong to think that? Is there another word to describe this that isn't bicurious or bisexual? Does it even matter lol!?
Interesting that you mention this. I have always thought that a lesbian is someone who is attracted to biological females who identify as females only. I am not at all sexually, romantically and emotionally attracted to males, but I don't identify as a lesbian because I have a far broader interpretation of gender than most of my queer friends.

I really like butch women, but the line between a stone butch (in other words, an extremely masculine butch woman) and a transgendered butch (one who actually identifies as male) is often blurred. I feel that by insisting that I am a lesbian, I would be dismissing my former stone/transgendered butch partner's transient male identity. That relationship didn't exactly feel like a heterosexual one either, despite what my friends said.

Years later, I fell for a pre-op MtF transsexual. Most of my friends didn't see her as a real woman even though she is extremely feminine, has been living as a girl for years and could pass well. And well, now I am with someone who is biologically male but gender-neutral. I used to brood about being unable to claim a lesbian identity (after all, it was what I came out as and for a while, I felt like I belonged), but I have more or less given up on what others think.

I guess I am just inexplicably drawn to genderqueer folk. Out of the twentyish people I have dated, only one of them can be said to be conventionally and biologically female. The label pansexual fits my strange sexuality best, but even then it is misleading because I am not gender-blind (I care about my partner's gender a lot!) and I can never date a biological and male-presenting male.

Rambling over.

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Old 02-02-2009, 07:23 PM   #37
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I usually identify as bisexual as I feel it best describes me, but I think sexuality is so.. undefinable, in a way. It's also fluid.. I've felt more attracted to either men or women throughout my life, but always both.. just sometimes my preference for one outweighs the other. At this particular point, I find myself mainly attracted to men. It's hard for me to picture myself having a girlfriend at this point, although I have had one before. Maybe it's just because I haven't connected with any girl on that level in quite awhile. As far as the pansexual vs. bisexual thing Cors brought up.. I just wanted to say, I agree about that pansexual is more.. general, more like, you are attracted to all people whereas bisexual is specifically male and female. I consider myself bisexual rather than pansexual because although I like both genders, I like them partially because of gender rather than regardless of gender, if that makes sense. I think part of it is that I'm attracted to stereotypically masculine men and feminine women, so I appreciate those qualities in someone as seperate things rather than regardless of masculinity/femininity. I'm not sure if I'm making sense at all. :/

I just wanted to comment on the Kinsey scale. I know it's a little outdated and everything but I really think that it, along with the research Kinsey did, is extremely insightful and I feel like it gets a bad rep for being outdated and old. I really feel like Kinsey had it pretty much right, in my experiences anyway.
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Old 02-02-2009, 09:37 PM   #38
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Do you think that you define yourself as hetrosexual even though you have had experiences with women and intend to again because of the non acceptance socially? If you find women attractive wouldnt that make you bi-sexual? Or if you dont, what is your reason for these experiences past and potentially future?? If i am being too nosey tell me to fuck off!
I suppose...when it comes to being in bed, sexually, I might be bi-sexual. But I always reckoned bisexuality is when you can date and fall in love with both sexes- which I couldnt' see happening to me.

Does that make sense?
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Old 02-03-2009, 07:05 AM   #39
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Hmm i know what you are saying.
I always thought though that "bi-sexual" was only about who you have sex with. I know now we (the world) has taken homosexuality/bi-sexuality etc to encompass who you would date/marry/happy ever after etc but in essence its really just who you are sexually attracted to.
I, like bexy was wondering why some "hetrosexual" identified women might want to sleep with another woman??
I think people should be able to identify however they want and in whichever way makes the most sense to them. Like cors identifying more with "lesbian" when she has been with more men because it feels more how she feels. I think the same goes for "hetrosexual" women who have and will sleep with women. I dont think the termonology is a huge issue really cause i think when you actually get to know someone you "get" what they are all about...anyway...i am rambling..
I also get the being attracted to people but not wanting to be sexually intimate with them..i get that a lot when i meet thin people as well as guys. To be honest i used to just end up sleeping with these people anyway but it wasnt really fair to them because for me something was always missing. I dont think i have ever slept with a guy and felt really conected although i have normally enjoyed the experience.
OH WAIT!! i had a revelation!!!
I was thinking there... i was thinking that actually i have felt connected to thin partners sexually in the past BUT that was before i knew i was an FA (bare with me)...
Then i remember totally feeling sexual feelings (like butterflys) for guys when i was younger and didnt know i was gay yet...
I think maby there is some sort of sexual morotorium where you get crushes on everyone because your sexual identity hasnt really settled in yet. hmmmm... I think maby thats just adolecence.. though my Fa sexuality took longer to catch up than my gender sexuality...
Anyway... i am totally rambling.. and i cant even remember the question anymore..
I think maby people who are straight and fuck women are the ones that give bisexuals a bad name though!!! lmao Though, in my own personal head encyclopedia i would say if a woman has sex with another woman by choice when she also has sex with guys then she is bi-sexual. Because its all about the sexin, no matter if it sexin is emotionless or not.
I think the exception is in jail.
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Old 02-03-2009, 08:51 AM   #40
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This is in part why I usually cop out by saying, "I don't have a sexual orientation!" I think there are so many different KINDS of people in this world, and "bi" represents only two of them. Anyway!
This is why we have terms like pansexual, and, as previously stated, MY personal favorite, Queer.

Queer... it's the best umbrella term EVER.
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Old 02-03-2009, 08:52 AM   #41
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yup! i love queer. Also just 'sexual' works for me too!
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Old 02-03-2009, 10:34 AM   #42
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This is why we have terms like pansexual, and, as previously stated, MY personal favorite, Queer.

Queer... it's the best umbrella term EVER.

I looove queer. I used to use it all the time before I embraced the term bisexual. But I could also be pansexual. Im mainly attracted I'm attracted to bears, butches and tranbois.

Ever had a friend catch you looking at bear porn in a sex shop? EmBEARassing. Harr.
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Old 02-03-2009, 11:18 AM   #43
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I looove queer. I used to use it all the time before I embraced the term bisexual. But I could also be pansexual. Im mainly attracted I'm attracted to bears, butches and tranbois.

Ever had a friend catch you looking at bear porn in a sex shop? EmBEARassing. Harr.
Haha.
I <3 Bears.
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Old 02-03-2009, 11:22 AM   #44
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Haha.
I <3 Bears.
me too!! I'm going to txt my bear friends right now and get them to join!!!
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Old 02-03-2009, 11:29 AM   #45
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Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!Weeze has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!
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me too!! I'm going to txt my bear friends right now and get them to join!!!
You should!!!

I think the cutest thing i've EVER seen was going to see Doubt with my ex and being seated right behind two bears that held hand through the entire movie
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Old 02-03-2009, 11:37 AM   #46
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You should!!!

I think the cutest thing i've EVER seen was going to see Doubt with my ex and being seated right behind two bears that held hand through the entire movie
awww.. that is cute..I love my friend bear (who i call bear) cause he is all big and hairy and tatooed and then comes up and yells "hiyaaa" in a way that doesnt belong to his body!! its fab! I think the cutest thing i ever saw though it was on tv was i was watching a docu about 'furries' and there were two gay boy furries, one was a squirrel and one was a fox and they were holding hands walking about!!! aww.. it was so cute i actually squeeled!! Then i realised how patronising that must be..i am also like that with height challenged people..like mini me.. cant help it..shhhhhh.
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Old 02-03-2009, 12:04 PM   #47
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I'm attracted to bears, butches and tranbois.
Me tooooooo! Ahhhh. <3

I haven't been this excited in a while.
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:03 PM   #48
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I think people should be able to identify however they want and in whichever way makes the most sense to them. Like cors identifying more with "lesbian" when she has been with more men because it feels more how she feels.
Hm, I won't say I've been with more men since I don't actually consider any of my dates male. I mostly went out with stone butches (hard to define I guess, even they themselves aren't certain) and androgynous women (mostly female-identified). Among my more serious relationships were an XXY woman (biologically ambiguous but female-identified), a pre-op MtF (biologically male but as femme as can be so I consider her female) and one gender-neutral bio-male.

I guess I am hung up about the lack of a lesbian identity because I feel like I have lost the solidarity I once had. I mean, I have always known that I like women and that I found anything vaguely male unappealing, so it was easy enough to come out as lesbian. The lesbian friends I kept back then turned out to be incredibly narrow-minded, bi-phobic, trans-phobic and possibly queer-phobic people. When they found out I wasn't actually seeing a female-identified bio-female, they started invalidating my attraction for women, the work I did for the community and even called me all sorts of horrible, triggering names ("oh you cock-slurping sell-out"). I am mostly over it, but it still hurts sometimes.

As for simply going by a "queer" identity, well, I can't exactly get away with it here. Sample conversation:

Friend: So, are you lesbian or bi?
Cors: I am queer.
Friend: Yes, but what exactly do you like? Men, women or both?

You get the idea. These days I am too tired and lazy to have to justify myself to a stranger who is probably going to react in an ignorant, negative way. :/
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:22 PM   #49
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When they ask "Men, women, or both" could you just say "Yes?"
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Old 02-03-2009, 01:24 PM   #50
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When they ask "Men, women, or both" could you just say "Yes?"
I guess it would simplify things, but I can't get over my virulent hatred and disgust for anything too male.
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