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Old 04-10-2009, 05:11 AM   #26
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I think there has to be some form of guilt within all of us FA/FFA, unless you happen to be heavier as well. Or as the feeding fetish is concerned, a mutual gainer.

And as for the guilt factor is concerned, for me it is that I like this and though I have been much heavier in the past and being that I'm younger and more naive than many members here, I don't truly know how it is. I can imagine....but I can't KNOW. So for me to like this and take pleasure in expressing my love for it, yes I do feel a twinge of guilt at moments.

The obesity epidemic issue was raised earlier. My oppinion on it is if you're okay with your body fine, if not, change it. Being overweight doesn't always lead to health issues. But the seccond it does, an FA/FFA should, despite their carnal instincts, help them fix it......as long as we are truthful with our intentions and they are consenting.....I think that then and only then can we feel free of guilt
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So shall we recap this pathetic life?
I'll role the clip, you'll hold the knife.
Rewind back to when you cared,
then fast-forward to the scars we bare.
And we'll open our eyes to find everything's fading.
Reckon it's fatal, but just look at the ratings.
Because the populace indulges through TV screens,
TiVo the laughter and mute the screams.
Thus we bottle all our tears inside,
repress the pain till our hearts collide...
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Old 04-10-2009, 06:06 AM   #27
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yes, absolutely and I know that while ultimately it's not my decision what some one chooses to do with their body, I HATE feeling like I'd be putting any kind of pressure on some one to stay a certain way just because I like it. I know some girls do, of course, love being fat, but I also know it's not that easy, because there will always be that conflict within oneself. It's hard when you're bombarded with antifat sentiments everytime you leave the house, turn on the television, read a magazine.

I know sometimes it's difficult not to feel guilt when something happens and you feel like you just got the wind knocked out of you and you're trying to reason with yourself and all you can think of is "I'm somehow responsible for this" but that is how we work. Fat or thin, when something negative comes along in life, everyone is going to try to say "if only I'd done this or that" but all you can really do is pick yourself back up and say, yes, it's not easy, but ultimately it's better for me to be as supportive as I can and stay true to myself because in the end bad things do happen and then you'll be kicking yourself even harder when you're not there to help that person pick themselves back up and say I am here for you, guilt or no.

so, yes, sometimes I feel guilty, but the shame of walking away in fear of what COULD and sometimes does happen would far outweigh whatever guilt I feel and I never want to know what that is like.

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Old 04-10-2009, 06:13 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by BothGunsBlazing View Post
yes, absolutely and I know that while ultimately it's not my decision what some one chooses to do with their body, I HATE feeling like I'd be putting any kind of pressure on some one to stay a certain way just because I like it. I know some girls do, of course, love being fat, but I also know it's not that easy, because there will always be that conflict within oneself. It's hard when you're bombarded with antifat sentiments everytime you leave the house, turn on the television, read a magazine.

I know sometimes it's difficult not to feel guilt when something happens and you feel like you just got the wind knocked out of you and you're trying to reason with yourself and all you can think of is "I'm somehow responsible for this" but that is how we work. Fat or thin, when something negative comes along in life, everyone is going to try to say "if only I'd done this or that" but all you can really do is pick yourself back up and say, yes, it's not easy, but ultimately it's better for me to be as supportive as I can and stay true to myself because in the end bad things do happen and then you'll be kicking yourself even harder when you're not there to help that person pick themselves back up and say I am here for you, guilt or no.

so, yes, sometimes I feel guilty, but the shame of walking away in fear of what COULD and sometimes does happen would far outweigh whatever guilt I feel and I never want to know what that is like.

Beautifully said....quite the intellectual when ur sleepy haha
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So shall we recap this pathetic life?
I'll role the clip, you'll hold the knife.
Rewind back to when you cared,
then fast-forward to the scars we bare.
And we'll open our eyes to find everything's fading.
Reckon it's fatal, but just look at the ratings.
Because the populace indulges through TV screens,
TiVo the laughter and mute the screams.
Thus we bottle all our tears inside,
repress the pain till our hearts collide...
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Old 04-10-2009, 12:00 PM   #29
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I keep hearing about how the health risks involved with obesity are overinflated. I'm sorry, but empirical evidence alone largely tells me otherwise--there are hardly any healthy supersized people over the age of 60 walking around.

I love fat women. My gf, who was overweight when we met, has gained around 50 pounds and is now morbidly obese. I don't feed her, but I certainly have passively encouraged the wg, and yes, I accept responsibility for probably taking years off her life. No, I haven't held a gun to her head, and yes, maybe some obesity studies are flawed, but saying those things to myself makes my internal bullshit justification siren go off.

I do feel guilty, and frankly I think any FA or especially feeder/encourager should as well. Anyone who doesn't is, imho, engaging in some pretty intricate self-deception.

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Old 04-10-2009, 12:07 PM   #30
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Let me add, however, that I also don't think it's healthy to hate yourself, and do think FAs do some amount of service and possibly balance the scales (no pun intended) a bit, by eliminating some of the body-issue stress that fat people have to deal with all the time.

Anyway, good timely topic and I'm happy this forum got started.

Last edited by MisterGuy; 04-10-2009 at 12:08 PM. Reason: and another thing!
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Old 04-10-2009, 01:55 PM   #31
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Interesting subject, and I confess I've learned a lot from this thread. I have to say though that if it boils right down to statistics then single women live longer than those in a relationship so if it's all about concern over length of life then maybe it would be better if you all just left the big ladies alone?

More seriously though, I've been touched by the depth of feeling here and its not something I've ever really understood before. I was inclined to just discount FA guilt as self indulgence or as an excuse for not wanting to deal with the issues associated with being with a Supersized woman and clearly I was wrong.

I would say though that as an Supersized women I exist in my own right and I got here through my own decisions and choices. I'm not here purely as a reflection of the desires of FA men and I would exist even if I wasn't 'desired.'

I fully understand the risks of being 500lbs plus and if anyone were to assume that I didn't I would be patronised and a little insulted. I carry every single one of the risks and associated fears around every day but to do that without the support of FA's would make a hard job even harder. Having the direct support of a partner is fantastic - but being single even just knowing that there are so many other FA's out there who understand is a huge bonus. It makes me feel better about my life and helps me get through the day and achieve what I need to do. None of you made me fat and none of you is keeping me fat - but you do help me live my life with a smile and a lighter heart.

I do understand the 'FA guilt' a lot better now, but for all the guilt you feel the good you do is HUGE. If you feel the need to beat yourselves up I cant stop you - but I would encourage you to pat yourselves on the back from time to time too.

Tracey xx
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Old 04-10-2009, 02:45 PM   #32
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I wanted to thank the Ladies that popped in to offer insight into why feeling guilty for something so wonderful is for lack of a better term "Silly". and it is just that. it's silly to feel guilty for loving anything, it's silly to feel like we are responsible for the woes of the BBW or BHM, Beabea's right if anything we can provide a little boost to someone who's having a Not so great day.

Like i said in my initial post, Misty and i have discussed this all before and you ladies have echoed her almost exactly. and hearing it from others just really solidifies it, not that i don't believe misty but she's biased when it comes to me and my inane rambling.

So Thank you A.M, Eclectic Girl, Beabea and all the other BBW's her at dimensions

I find it very funny that it seems just about every FA harbors a little bit of guilt over being attracted to fat, ultimately it was bred from the media hammering into us that fat is bad! but after the last 4 years we see what a wonderful resource mass media Is.
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Old 04-10-2009, 05:08 PM   #33
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I guess I'm with the girls here on this one. While I don't deny that being fat can have ill effects on health, what good has ever been done saying, "I find you attractive as a fat person but I know for your own good you should be smaller." We as FAs may have some role in encouraging women to get fatter, but I really can't believe anyone except for the most damaged amoung us would feel compelled to get fat, or fatter, just to please an FA. I know with my own relatively piddly struggles with weight that I was only able to get control of my body and health when I was able to like myself and accept myself, even if I didn't fit the fantasy image in my head. And a lot of that I owe to a partner who loved me and made me feel attractive even when I didn't. If health of our partners or the women we admire is what we're worried about, our acceptance and admiration will trump our guilt any time.

Mea culpa: I thought this board was dumb and unnecessary and said so, and meanwhile I'm amazed at how so many topics have been so brilliantly analyzed here in it's short existence.
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Old 04-10-2009, 05:31 PM   #34
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Well so, some of the posts here have touched on what I suspected and have had diffiuculty expressing or fully understanding - the sense that FA/FFA are somehow responsible for their partner's bodies...because of the way some of you identify with fatness, some of you may feel like you have ownership of your partner's fat, and in a way you do. But that kind of ownership is not the same as the ownership a fat person has over their own bodies....what happens to a fat person's body is up to the fat person alone. Sometimes I feel like well, if I have to deal with society alone, then society should trust me enough to make my own decisions even if those decisions don't always make sense to people.

....All of this makes me wonder how guilty you all would feel if you were fat yourselves. Would those of you who are thin have a hard time living as fat people? Would you hate your bodies? Would you hate FAs? I'm also not sure if this guilt is the result of simple thin privilege or some kind of self-loathing, or some combination of the two or neither.

It's also kind of shocking to know that on some level this really boils down to people feelling like monsters for loving other monsters. I've never thought of myself as a monster and I don't think of FAs as monsters either. The people who make you feel like shit over it are the monsters. Screw them.

Sorry if I'm just rambling or sound harsh and not adding anything to the discussion, but this is the kind of stuff that knocks around my brain sometimes and writing it out helps to make it make some kind of sense.

I also agree with all the other BBW who've posted so far. I don't feel guilty about my own existence. I'd exist regardless. So please don't feel guilty for me. I'd rather have loving support, and I need the FA I end up with to be able to give me that.
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Old 04-10-2009, 05:45 PM   #35
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I have been thinking about this thread a lot.

I am very interested to hear what people have to say about all this 'from the other side.' Wouldn't presume to know what it's like.

From my own POV, I agree very much with what's been (wonderfully) put earlier; I guess in the end I don't find guilt a very helpful thing. It isn't, usually, in practice.

(That is, what I can use, and do like, is support. I take care of myself, and I like boyfriends/partners who support that activity. It has nothing to do with changing my body size, though. I don't want to, haven't tried for years, not sure my body would. This, perhaps, is an advantage of age; at this point this topic is much less about any theoretical changes in body size, and more about general care, which--if you're looking for places to put all that energy--can definitely be work. Plus - I like how I look. Guilt doesn't make much sense in that context.)

Anyhow, I definitely want to listen more than I talk on this board, so I shan't ramble on. Just saying...I absolve thee! No guilt. *wave of fatty fingers* Heh. Not to belittle anything! Just being...goofy. Now I subside and listen.
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Old 04-10-2009, 05:45 PM   #36
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Fantastic thread, and very much needed considering all that has happened as of late.

I can very much relate to both the FA guilt and the concern over health from both sides, especially since I've been on both sides. While I am healthy and in pretty decent shape now, I admit that I went to physical and psychological extremes to get rid of the fat I once had. About a decade ago, I fell hard into Anorexia, and I'm still paying for it. Truly, the obsessive, self-hating tendencies have never completely died away, and I have a feeling they will always cause a conflict in me. Add in the fact that I am, through and through, an FA, and the conflict and guilt within becomes a dangerous cocktail of badness.

I think Ben's post was spot on, pitch perfect to some of the things that I have felt and struggled with over the years. In the past I've dated BBW's, but never actually explored, or had the opportunity to explore, the concept of FA guilt because they were relatively short lived. It wasn't until my relationship with the Candy Coated Clown where I finally began to truly experience it, and because of some of her own body issues, brought on by the fact that an ex had no treated her natural shape with any modicum of respect, I had a hard time just jumping right out and telling her "yes, I am an FA. We exist, and I don't want you to ever feel like you have to change your size or shape to please me." Ever since coming right out, though, we have really begun to embrace her size more and more, and she knows that my view on it, more than anything, is that I LOVE chub, but more than anything I'm attracted to a natural body shape. If that's 100 pounds, fine and dandy - she would still be stunningly beautiful to me. If it's 200 pounds, then I'm just as thrilled. If it's 300 or more, then yes, I would worry about health and mobility, but she would still be gorgeous.

I guess the true feelings of guilt really reveal themselves once you begin to see or perceive that limitations might present themselves. Like I do not, and have never, fantasize about immobility. It just doesn't do it for me. When I think about the possibility of joint and muscle pains, or diabetes, or high blood pressure that could otherwise be avoided (I know a lot of skinny people have that too, but I'm referring to it being as a product of intentional gaining or something like that) all of that acts as a sort of FA kryptonite, and that's when I begin to look at myself and say that I am not in this to objectify fat. What I want, truly, is a person who is happy and healthy in their natural state. And if that happens to have a few more rolls and curves on that natural state, all the better. But it's not about the fat. I love the contrast between our skin colours, our sizes, our upbringings, but I don't objectify that, and when I stand back and realize that, when I understand that it can be equated, for me, to liking a certain hair colour or style, or even being gay or lesbian, it is all a lifestyle preference taken into the realm of physicality.

I have a feeling this is rambling, but my thoughts really are sort of all over the place at the moment. When it comes down to it, I don't believe that I am promoting any unhealthy behaviour by simply showing my love and adoration for her body and the mind and soul contained therein. So long as she is happy, healthy, and understands my feelings, that's all that is needed.
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Old 04-10-2009, 05:53 PM   #37
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I started this thread some time ago:

http://dimensionsmagazine.com/forums...ad.php?t=35670

I think some aspects of it apply to this argument as well.

Cheers.
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Old 04-10-2009, 05:57 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by liz (di-va) View Post
I have been thinking about this thread a lot.

I am very interested to hear what people have to say about all this 'from the other side.' Wouldn't presume to know what it's like.

From my own POV, I agree very much with what's been (wonderfully) put earlier; I guess in the end I don't find guilt a very helpful thing. It isn't, usually, in practice.

(That is, what I can use, and do like, is support. I take care of myself, and I like boyfriends/partners who support that activity. It has nothing to do with changing my body size, though. I don't want to, haven't tried for years, not sure my body would. This, perhaps, is an advantage of age; at this point this topic is much less about any theoretical changes in body size, and more about general care, which--if you're looking for places to put all that energy--can definitely be work. Plus - I like how I look. Guilt doesn't make much sense in that context.)

Anyhow, I definitely want to listen more than I talk on this board, so I shan't ramble on. Just saying...I absolve thee! No guilt. *wave of fatty fingers* Heh. Not to belittle anything! Just being...goofy. Now I subside and listen.
it's healthy to second-guess yourself now and then and damning if it plagues your existence
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Old 04-10-2009, 06:13 PM   #39
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it's healthy to second-guess yourself now and then and damning if it plagues your existence
I agree! [And I didn't mean to be flip--my apologies if so (was all the Easter imagery out there that got me thinking all pope-ily). I understand that guilt is the topic at hand! Didn't mean to be dismissive.]
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Old 04-10-2009, 06:45 PM   #40
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Well so, some of the posts here have touched on what I suspected and have had diffiuculty expressing or fully understanding - the sense that FA/FFA are somehow responsible for their partner's bodies...because of the way some of you identify with fatness, some of you may feel like you have ownership of your partner's fat, and in a way you do. But that kind of ownership is not the same as the ownership a fat person has over their own bodies....what happens to a fat person's body is up to the fat person alone. Sometimes I feel like well, if I have to deal with society alone, then society should trust me enough to make my own decisions even if those decisions don't always make sense to people.

....All of this makes me wonder how guilty you all would feel if you were fat yourselves. Would those of you who are thin have a hard time living as fat people? Would you hate your bodies? Would you hate FAs? I'm also not sure if this guilt is the result of simple thin privilege or some kind of self-loathing, or some combination of the two or neither.

It's also kind of shocking to know that on some level this really boils down to people feelling like monsters for loving other monsters. I've never thought of myself as a monster and I don't think of FAs as monsters either. The people who make you feel like shit over it are the monsters. Screw them.

Sorry if I'm just rambling or sound harsh and not adding anything to the discussion, but this is the kind of stuff that knocks around my brain sometimes and writing it out helps to make it make some kind of sense.

I also agree with all the other BBW who've posted so far. I don't feel guilty about my own existence. I'd exist regardless. So please don't feel guilty for me. I'd rather have loving support, and I need the FA I end up with to be able to give me that.
OK, I am by no means speaking for all FAs here, but I want to try to explain how this scenario goes in my head. It's really not about the ownership of someone else's fat in my opinion. I realize in the context of ONE relationship with one partner, it could seem that way, but this is more about the overall ownership of my attraction as an FA to fat. In an individual relationship, most of us FAs, I think/hope would want our partner happy and healthy and whatever it takes to do that is what many of us would support. But for me and my guilt that is not the issue at hand at all. Here's a fictional scenario to try to explain:

FA dates a 500 pound fat person. The fat person starts having health issues and loses weight. The fat partner is now around 300, let's say, still fat, and is healthy, happy, etc. The FA is thrilled that his/her partner is happy, healthy, etc, but can't deny to themselves that they STILL found their partner sexier at 500 pounds EVEN WITH KNOWING ALL OF THE PROBLEMS IT CAUSED. Many FAs are going to feel that that is like saying "damn it why can't I find her/him attractive at the healthier size. Why do I find the sicker version more attractive and yearn for it still. AND WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT ME AS A PERSON?"

And then the FA knows that this will be true of every person over and over. Now, of course, my example pertains to SSBBW/SSBHM, but that concept as a whole, I think, floats around the minds of many FAs who prefer smaller partners as well because instead of health issues, it could be joint pain, or no longer being able to do something they like. It isn't about owning the partner's fat, it's that you can't be sexually as happy if your partner becomes a different size even if you are still happy with the relationship. I really think a lot of FA guilt is summed up in the "what sort of person does that make me" way. There is also the fact that many fat people were in some way unhappy with their weight at one time. While I understand that being an FA is not something to be guilty about in general and that being fat is not a bad thing, it can make you wonder about yourself that the quality in your partner you find very sexually attractive may be the very thing that made her/his life unhappy in the past. And while yes, FAs often help make the lives of fat people very happy when they are in a relationship with one of us, the general concept that you are attracted to something that someone has to learn to accept about themselves in the first place can make you feel sometimes like you're attracted to a negative. (Obviously, I don't mean that being fat is negative, but the idea that it can cause so many negative experiences for fat people).
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Old 04-10-2009, 07:37 PM   #41
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I'm really enjoying the conversation and so glad you're all having it. I've known and been around many FAs for years, and this is something I've discussed with them and it's always interesting. I hoped this board would foster that type of candid discussion, and I'm so glad it is.


This is a topic I could go on and on about, but much of what I would have shared has been stated by other fat women here so there's no reason to belabor the point.

No one here should tell you what to feel, if you struggle sometimes - you're clearly not alone. I hope that reading some of our input has helped you realize that we're very much our own people living our own lives and your desires and likes are an addition to that life we're living - not a cause of it. We like that you like! If we didn't, then it's possibly a very different conversation.

I'm not a woman who struggles with my own body image and things, so I can't answer for them. Perhaps there is some "I want to please him, but it goes against my own desires for my body" issue with fat partners who are in some sort of limbo between body hatred and minimal body acceptance.


I'm rambling, I'm sorry - a bit unstructured here.

1. I think some guilt is healthy in a check and balance way. I don't think being riddled by it is healthy or productive, but keeping in check the reality of a situation can help you be there and real and supportive and WHOLE with your SO - that's a great quality and admirable one.

2. We talk a lot about how your fat partner can be healthy so it's all just fine. You know what? We're not all healthy. We're just not. I had a shitty back that's thankfully been treated, but I know it was worse because I weigh over 400lbs. I'm better now, and that's great, but should it flare up again - will that issue be something that inspires guilt in a future partner? I hope not, but I realize they may see that issue as a physical defect caused by my fat. In that line of thinking, they like fat, fat caused pain, pain is bad. They like fat, fat is bad. Wow, we're right back where we started with society.

What I try to make clear is that, as others have said, my fat exists and my life exists without any FA. My life is better and more fun and more enjoyable when with an FA that I love and who loves me back.

I don't want a caretaker, and I know some men feel some level of guilt for not wanting to find themselves in that position. I also get that.

*whole issue of guilt vs. pity, but seems better for another time?*

I hope you guys keep talking about this. I really think it helps just to know so many of you deal with these thoughts sometimes. Hopefully it will make you all realize that it's part of the dynamic, but not something that should keep you from pursuing the women who are just out here living their lives. How much better they can be with a guy who's aware enough to even consider their impact on another.
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Old 04-11-2009, 12:52 AM   #42
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I've never had a partner , so i don't know how far this can go without that experience. I don't feel guilty. Why? Because its what I find attractive and beautiful. If someone disagrees or feels different that is fine. I hard a time figuring this out when I was younger, but I think that I'd be betraying myself if I did feel guilty about my love of fat women and I think that'd also hurt someone more who might be looking for comfort in the knowledge of my feelings of that love. Do I feel bad when someone has trouble because of it? Yes, but thats a separate issue I think. Feeling guilty because of what you like and feeling guilty thinking that its because of what you like is a different thing to me. One implies that you don't believe in your feelings and the other implies doubt about positive/or negative influences of your feelings on other people.


This can be applied to anyone really, and well since this is the fa specific thread, I implore FAs and company not to ascribe guilty feelings on yourselves because this world that we live in already does enough of that to us. And if you do end up having guilty feelings, well thats okay too because you're only human and you're supposed to have feelings on things.

English was never my strong point, nor writing so I may have a grammatical error and structural sentence issues :P
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Old 04-11-2009, 05:21 AM   #43
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After a lifetime of being bombarded with messages that say fat=bad, it is beyond most people's powers of skepticism not to have internalized them to some degree. So as an FA, the rest of the world is saying "you like something bad." Compound that with a partner who may be ambivalent about their weight, or may be having weight-related health/social/professional problems, or just knowing people (online or irl) who are experiencing them, it's very difficult to be positive about one's preference for the very thing that's causing these issues. And that's even if the FA knows objectively that they really have no control over the fat partner/friend/acquaintances' weight. It's certainly a recipe for self-hatred. It takes a lot of constant attention to keep your head straight and disrespectfully decline much of the world's opinion on the matter and just be yourself.
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Old 04-11-2009, 11:51 AM   #44
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I'm with Liz, I'm here to listen more than I am to participate, but this is something I need I need to chime in. As much as I hate to do a "me too" post, I can't really add anything else that Carrie, AnnMarie, Carla, Tracey and Liz haven't already said and said it beautifully...I'm just showing my support.
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Old 04-11-2009, 12:53 PM   #45
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I have had some FA guilt, but I got over it when I realized that feeling guilty over my preferences isn't going to change them. I have my fantasies about fat girls getting fatter, but it remains just that, afantasy. I know in reality that this fantasy has adverse effects. So I say, if you're feeling FA guilt, don't. Just keep a clear head about things, and I think everything will turn out all right.
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Old 04-11-2009, 02:40 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. P Marshall View Post
OK, I am by no means speaking for all FAs here, but I want to try to explain how this scenario goes in my head. It's really not about the ownership of someone else's fat in my opinion. I realize in the context of ONE relationship with one partner, it could seem that way, but this is more about the overall ownership of my attraction as an FA to fat. In an individual relationship, most of us FAs, I think/hope would want our partner happy and healthy and whatever it takes to do that is what many of us would support. But for me and my guilt that is not the issue at hand at all. Here's a fictional scenario to try to explain:

FA dates a 500 pound fat person. The fat person starts having health issues and loses weight. The fat partner is now around 300, let's say, still fat, and is healthy, happy, etc. The FA is thrilled that his/her partner is happy, healthy, etc, but can't deny to themselves that they STILL found their partner sexier at 500 pounds EVEN WITH KNOWING ALL OF THE PROBLEMS IT CAUSED. Many FAs are going to feel that that is like saying "damn it why can't I find her/him attractive at the healthier size. Why do I find the sicker version more attractive and yearn for it still. AND WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT ME AS A PERSON?"

And then the FA knows that this will be true of every person over and over. Now, of course, my example pertains to SSBBW/SSBHM, but that concept as a whole, I think, floats around the minds of many FAs who prefer smaller partners as well because instead of health issues, it could be joint pain, or no longer being able to do something they like. It isn't about owning the partner's fat, it's that you can't be sexually as happy if your partner becomes a different size even if you are still happy with the relationship. I really think a lot of FA guilt is summed up in the "what sort of person does that make me" way. There is also the fact that many fat people were in some way unhappy with their weight at one time. While I understand that being an FA is not something to be guilty about in general and that being fat is not a bad thing, it can make you wonder about yourself that the quality in your partner you find very sexually attractive may be the very thing that made her/his life unhappy in the past. And while yes, FAs often help make the lives of fat people very happy when they are in a relationship with one of us, the general concept that you are attracted to something that someone has to learn to accept about themselves in the first place can make you feel sometimes like you're attracted to a negative. (Obviously, I don't mean that being fat is negative, but the idea that it can cause so many negative experiences for fat people).
Aahhh. Thanks for the explanation. "What sort of person does that make me?" "attracted to a negative" Those I understand all too well. How it pertains to my sexuality is a bit different but that horrible feeling is probably the same since some of the things I do are the kinds of things that would horrify normal folks, so I think I'm understanding this a bit better. I can't lie, sometimes I wish I didn't need the things I do sexually because it would increase the pool of men I can be with and just make my (sex) life easier in general, but I can't imagine my life without it at this point, so I just don't think too hard about the negatives anymore.

Anyway this is a good thread. I'm glad for the chance to understand this better, so I'll try to do less talking and more listening.
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Old 04-11-2009, 03:58 PM   #47
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Would this be a good comparison?

Say you were someone turned on by smoking. Say you started dating someone who smoked 2 packs a day before you met and continues to, once you're together. Maybe they even start smoking a little more because they know you like it.

Now, you are not ultimately responsible for this person's smoking habit, but if you're a normal person w/ a conscience you'll probably feel some degree of guilt about the passive encouragement. Even guilt about accepting their smoking, b/c really, if you do anything other than encourage them to stop smoking, you're possibly complicit in damaging their health and shortening their lifespan. On top of all this, you're not just accepting of it, inside, you're getting turned on by it. And if they did cut down to one pack a day, part of you would fondly reminisce about when they chain-smoked and feel guilty about that, as well.

I realize this isn't a perfect comparison--a lot of fat people can't help being fat and smoking is ultimately a choice, but then again, a lot of people really can't quit smoking, either. Dunno, just a lame attempt to explain the FA guilt-complex outside the terms of fat and weight gain.
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Old 04-11-2009, 05:10 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by MisterGuy View Post
Would this be a good comparison?

Say you were someone turned on by smoking. Say you started dating someone who smoked 2 packs a day before you met and continues to, once you're together. Maybe they even start smoking a little more because they know you like it.

Now, you are not ultimately responsible for this person's smoking habit, but if you're a normal person w/ a conscience you'll probably feel some degree of guilt about the passive encouragement. Even guilt about accepting their smoking, b/c really, if you do anything other than encourage them to stop smoking, you're possibly complicit in damaging their health and shortening their lifespan. On top of all this, you're not just accepting of it, inside, you're getting turned on by it. And if they did cut down to one pack a day, part of you would fondly reminisce about when they chain-smoked and feel guilty about that, as well.

I realize this isn't a perfect comparison--a lot of fat people can't help being fat and smoking is ultimately a choice, but then again, a lot of people really can't quit smoking, either. Dunno, just a lame attempt to explain the FA guilt-complex outside the terms of fat and weight gain.
I'm actually a smoker. I'm going to smoke regardless of whether or not it turns someone on. Whether or not I quit is my responsibility and mine alone. It actually pisses me off when people try to convince me to quit. So you know they can talk till they're blue in the face (ha, pun) but as far as I'm concerned they are not complicit or morally irresponsible in any way. Their guilt is their responsibility and theirs alone. I'm not gonna quit to assuage someone's guilt, and if I do it will only be for my own health. How responsible to other adults are we really? There has to be a line, or at the very least mitigating circumstances and I don't think smoking is one of them.

I was making a comparison to bdsm which has its own diabolical traps and pitfalls (ha, another pun). It seemed apt because to a lot of people who are into it, it is a way of life. Something they can't live without. At that point it's no longer a choice and is firmly a part of who you are. A lot of what we do is at best dangerous (emotionally, physically) and at most fatal if not done properly, but the pleasures are worth the risk, and the guilt talk, especially if the person is a Sadistic (but caring) Top can be kind of difficult to navigate even if they have accepted that part of themselves. Some people deal with the guilt by no longer engaging in bdsm activities and some do fine that way, but some find they can't live without the activities for too long and they are right back to where they started. I talk about this stuff so much I just assumed most people knew what I was talking about. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

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Old 04-11-2009, 05:19 PM   #49
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I think this is a fascinating thread. FA guilt is truly a strange phenomenon but it is one that most FAs experience on some level, at some time or another?

FA guilt occurs, on the most benign level, when one is aware of the pressure that one imparts as an FA, simply by having an aesthetic that runs contrary to the desires of a partner. There does not even have to be any overt directional pressure from either party... when the category for an FA's aesthetic beauty is in direct conflict with another's indicator for self worth then there is unavoidable friction.

I think that there is great potential for miscommunication in such scenarios based on the way that people try to please partners in relationships. An FA may try to suppress his aesthetic in order to avoid generating this guilt-ridden pressure upon a partner. This can often lead to stunted sexuality from the FA. This seems to be especially true for those FAs with a gain-fantasy aesthetic. (Indeed, from discussions with other FAs I've heard that this kind of FA guilt is frequently a component factor for remaining closeted?). Another frequent scenario that one sees, is for BBWs to fake enthusiasm towards their size, as a means to raise their desirability, by reducing the potential for the 'friction' described above. Both scenarios can lead to 'pressurized consent' situations that are ultimately dishonest, and therefore likely to lead to more guilt...

I have found that one of the best ways to tackle guilt is through direct conversation on this 'friction' topic. I would much rather know the actual thoughts of a partner and for them to know mine... up front... and then work it through (if necessary) rather than to fight ghosts and second guess all the time!
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Old 04-11-2009, 05:33 PM   #50
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i dont know if we are really supposed to chime in or not, but i love this thread, but let me say, is this liking someone that you like any different than someone who wants a thin wife, a this or that wife or partner...

if i want someone with a certain body type am i wrong to go after it? what if it means dieting for them, what if it means surgery for them, what if it means lipo or implants or injections for them, or drugs or whatever...

there are so many things to feel guilty for in this world, surely liking and CARING for someone shouldnt be one of them.

there are whole other examples but i am on a time crunch before work, but i cant help but wonder, how many feel guilty for wanting a size 5 on their arm, when it takes that person a hell of a lot of work to stay there...is it any harder having a size 50?
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