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Old 04-17-2009, 11:58 PM   #1
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Default Fat Admiration - Journals, Papers, Books, Blog Posts and News Articles Thread...

Fat Admiration is a subject that has been getting greater news and TV coverage in recent years. As our visibility as a group increases, I figured that it might be interesting/useful, from the point of view of seeing whats being said and written about us, to create a thread relating to media articles and scientific studies on the subject.

Additionally, whilst researching a related topic for a sociology paper, I've been coming across several interesting papers relating to Fat Admiration. One in particular (Big Beautiful Women: The Body Size Preferences of Male Fat Admirers, Swami, Tovee, 2009) considers the range of body type preferences (FAs have a much broader aesthetic), which has led other researchers to question if so called 'normal' weight range preferences in Non- FAs (typically around +/- 30lbs) are more fetishistic in nature than FAs?

The Fat Admirer - Erich Goode

After following up on a few authors, I came across a book called 'Extreme Deviance'... Whilst initially a little irritated by the title, I'm glad I took a look through the chapter on Fat Admiration as it makes a whole lot of useful and interesting observations on FA behavior, different types of FA, the reasons why people remain closeted, the dynamics of FA guilt etc....

here's the link to the google book . The article is pages 80 to 89... The conclusion on page 89 is worth looking at alone, even if you don't fancy reading the whole article...

"Differently Straight" - BStu (Shapely Prose)

This is a pretty good account of the FA experience from a guy who used to post here a couple of years ago.
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Old 04-18-2009, 12:32 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by James View Post
Fat Admiration is a subject that has been getting greater news and TV coverage in recent years. As our visibility as a group increases, I figured that it might be interesting/useful, from the point of view of seeing whats being said and written about us, to create a thread relating to media articles and scientific studies on the subject.

Additionally, whilst researching a related topic for a sociology paper, I've been coming across several interesting papers relating to Fat Admiration. One in particular (Big Beautiful Women: The Body Size Preferences of Male Fat Admirers, Swami, Tovee, 2009) considers the range of body type preferences (FAs have a much broader aesthetic), which has led other researchers to question if so called 'normal' weight range preferences in Non- FAs (typically around +/- 30lbs) are more fetishistic in nature than FAs?

The Fat Admirer - Erich Goode


After following up on a few authors, I came across a book called 'Extreme Deviance'... Whilst initially a little irritated by the title, I'm glad I took a look through the chapter on Fat Admiration as it makes a whole lot of useful and interesting observations on FA behavior, different types of FA, the reasons why people remain closeted, the dynamics of FA guilt etc....

here's the link to the google book . The article is pages 80 to 89... The conclusion on page 89 is worth looking at alone, even if you don't fancy reading the whole article...

"Differently Straight" - BStu (Shapely Prose)

This is a pretty good account of the FA experience from a guy who used to post here a couple of years ago.
I appreciate your starting this thread to discuss how fat admiration is being viewed in academia and mainstream culture. At peril of stating the obvious, haven't all people who have deviated from the norm had to contend with derision in engaging in choices rediculed by the those who cannot think beyond the norm? It takes courage to be a fat admirer - no one who has brought new awareness in the world was embraced heroically, Plato drinking hemlock is the enduring reminder of that.
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Old 04-18-2009, 04:25 AM   #3
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"There must be something wrong with him if he likes me the way I am." GAAHHH!
It's like some cruel logic puzzle.
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Old 04-18-2009, 06:04 AM   #4
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Thanks for posting the BStu blog entry. It's well-written and informative, especially for someone who doesn't quite understand it all quite yet. I think I may send the link to my mother...
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Old 04-18-2009, 07:17 AM   #5
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Here's an earlier article by the same guy in another sexuality book: http://books.google.com/books?id=grW...dq=Fat+Admirer

And also some more books academic and not in google books, some interesting, some just schlocky 'weird' pieces:
http://books.google.com/books?q=Fat+...G=Search+Books
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Old 04-18-2009, 10:34 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by marlowegarp View Post
"There must be something wrong with him if he likes me the way I am." GAAHHH!
It's like some cruel logic puzzle.
Yeah, I think a lot of us hear you on that! Cruel logic puzzle indeed!

I think this is what FAs actually mean when they say they prefer confident BBWs... i.e. a confident BBW doesn't view one's attraction to her as a suspicious, sinister or 'wrong' behavior...
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Old 04-18-2009, 10:43 AM   #7
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Yeah, I think a lot of us hear you on that! Cruel logic puzzle indeed!

I think this is what FAs actually mean when they say they prefer confident BBWs... i.e. a confident BBW doesn't view one's attraction to her as a suspicious, sinister or 'wrong' behavior...
Hmm, I don't know about that, James; that's not my perception of that phrase, having been on the receiving end of it, but it's definitely possible that I've misinterpreted it. I'd be very interested in hearing other FAs' takes on it. I think it would make a great thread, actually.
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Old 04-18-2009, 12:47 PM   #8
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its entirely possible that different FAs mean different things when they say that they prefer 'confident' partners. For me this has meant that my attraction isn't on trial or considered wrong... Maybe I'll start a thread on the subject...? (on here or the main board..? hmmm?)
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Old 04-18-2009, 01:13 PM   #9
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Maybe I'll start a thread on the subject...? (on here or the main board..? hmmm?)
I think that's what I just suggested.

And here seems the perfect spot!
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Old 04-18-2009, 07:26 PM   #10
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this should probably be an archive in the main site area rather than a thread, or at least a sticky.

but here:

http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/2006/06/22/big_love
http://www.orlandoweekly.com/columns/story.asp?id=11662
http://www.clevescene.com/2003-10-01...g-game-hunters
http://livinginsmallsizes.com/2007/0...rld-of-fat-sex (this link refers to an article from Details that someone should find and scan, it's not on the web)

and of my own:

http://stylusmagazine.com/reviews/gr...weet-stuff.htm
http://kissoutthejams.blogspot.com/2...-interest.html
http://askaguywholikesfatchicks.blogspot.com

be warned, some of these are not positive articles, but i think it would be an delusional mistake to not include them for reference.
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:24 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by exile in thighville View Post


"I won't accept being labeled a closet Kevorkian just because I love a woman and her fat, too"


Nice article!

Last edited by James; 12-17-2009 at 09:04 PM.
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Old 05-03-2009, 12:48 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James View Post
Yeah, I think a lot of us hear you on that! Cruel logic puzzle indeed!

I think this is what FAs actually mean when they say they prefer confident BBWs... i.e. a confident BBW doesn't view one's attraction to her as a suspicious, sinister or 'wrong' behavior...
Your preference for a BBW who considers your attraction to her reasonable is a tall order for a BBW or a thin woman. There is a double standard of sexual conduct defined as men being able to respond to their sexual desires with impunity and women who are conditioned to believe that the only appropriate outlet for their sexuality is a committed relationship or marriage. Most women feel conflicted about their sexuality since they receive conflicting messages from the culture and that conflict is reflected in feeling uncomfortable with male attention. Women who sexually behave on their own terms have been denigrated as "nymphos" or mentally ill.
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Old 05-03-2009, 01:31 PM   #13
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*sigh* I miss Brian!

James, I guess by your definition I'm a "confident" bbw. However, and I think you'll agree, confidence embodies so many other things as well.

Nice thread.
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Old 05-03-2009, 05:25 PM   #14
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James, thanks for posting that link to the google book Extreme Deviance and that Erich Goode article in it. Some interesting and kind of sad stories in there. But I love how they call serious FAs "mountain men." Actually, that whole book looks pretty fascinating, despite it's silly title. Where I come from, viewing things like tattoos, FAs, and belief in aliens as somehow ""extreme"" is itself kinda "extreme" in a hilarious way.
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Old 05-09-2009, 11:27 AM   #15
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More coverage of the Swami paper...

http://www.ukmedix.com/weight-loss/s..._women4610.cfm

Note the end of article disclaimer...
Quote:
You should always strive to have a healthy BMI because it is the healthiest way to be and not because of any other reason
a "healthy" BMI? Gah... this isn't the place for discussing it perhaps, but the notion that BMI is any measure of health whatsoever is infuriatingly misguided!
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Old 07-02-2009, 09:54 PM   #16
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great thread and interesting article.

i also like the definition of a confident BBW discussed here since a lot of BBWs translate that into sexually available instead of an unquestioning submission to the fact that she herself is an attractive woman. sexual availability does not necessarily = confidence. it was good to clear that up.
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Old 07-17-2009, 07:44 PM   #17
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Default not the greatest article in the world....

but its tangentially relevant to FAs...

Quote:
....However, even though the mainstream of the world is beginning to see that full figured women are also sexy, some men are too concerned about their image. They worry that their friends or relatives won’t approve their relationship with a big woman. So they choose a ‘traditional’ girlfriend or wife. But behind their closed doors, they take out their credit cards and browse through adult websites with big beautiful women.
http://www.ecommerce-journal.com/art...n_size_matters
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Old 07-19-2009, 06:52 AM   #18
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I'm surprised no one has mentioned the ethical controversy that surrounds Erich Goode's work. He slept with a lot of fat women when he was doing his academic research, and that is big no no in the social sciences field.

Here's his info:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erich_Goode

Unfortunately his sexual history has degraded the standing of his research in the academia, and that is a real shame, becasue FAs and Fat people deserve better.
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Old 07-19-2009, 08:30 AM   #19
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I'm surprised no one has mentioned the ethical controversy that surrounds Erich Goode's work. He slept with a lot of fat women when he was doing his academic research, and that is big no no in the social sciences field.

Here's his info:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erich_Goode

Unfortunately his sexual history has degraded the standing of his research in the academia, and that is a real shame, becasue FAs and Fat people deserve better.
Yuck.

I had never heard of this guy until you posted, but apparently he was a sociologist who joined NAAFA in the early 80s and slept around as part of his "research." Twenty years later he published a vaguely self-congratulatory article in a sociology journal about what a groundbreaking researcher he was for breaking the taboo on sleeping with your subjects. His academic colleagues (rightly) called him out on it.

I did some googling; you can read his whole article here.

Goode is ambiguous, perhaps deliberately, as to whether he's genuinely attracted to fat women or whether he was just pretending to be so that he could break into the community for the sake of his research. He identifies himself to other NAAFA members as an FA, but he also tells some lame, self-justifying stories about how the mean NAAFA people wouldn't let him study them until he proved his bona fides by sleeping with a bunch of fat women. Eventually he ends up fathering a child out of wedlock with one of his informants.

The impression the article gives is of a guy with poor social skills and no self-awareness. It seems not to have occurred to him that hopping into bed with every woman who made herself available would disrupt his attempts to get an unbiased view of the scene. How does a guy without a drama radar become a sociologist, anyway?

To be fair, it's interesting to read an outsider's account of what NAAFA was like back in the day. Some of the situations and personalities Goode describes could have come straight from Dims 2009. (History moves on, but drama springs eternal.) Still, my verdict is "clueless tool."
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Old 07-19-2009, 09:09 AM   #20
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Yuck.

I had never heard of this guy until you posted, but apparently he was a sociologist who joined NAAFA in the early 80s and slept around as part of his "research." Twenty years later he published a vaguely self-congratulatory article in a sociology journal about what a groundbreaking researcher he was for breaking the taboo on sleeping with your subjects. His academic colleagues (rightly) called him out on it.

I did some googling; you can read his whole article here.

Goode is ambiguous, perhaps deliberately, as to whether he's genuinely attracted to fat women or whether he was just pretending to be so that he could break into the community for the sake of his research. He identifies himself to other NAAFA members as an FA, but he also tells some lame, self-justifying stories about how the mean NAAFA people wouldn't let him study them until he proved his bona fides by sleeping with a bunch of fat women. Eventually he ends up fathering a child out of wedlock with one of his informants.

The impression the article gives is of a guy with poor social skills and no self-awareness. It seems not to have occurred to him that hopping into bed with every woman who made herself available would disrupt his attempts to get an unbiased view of the scene. How does a guy without a drama radar become a sociologist, anyway?

To be fair, it's interesting to read an outsider's account of what NAAFA was like back in the day. Some of the situations and personalities Goode describes could have come straight from Dims 2009. (History moves on, but drama springs eternal.) Still, my verdict is "clueless tool."
Agreed 100%. I just read his article, too, and wow. It makes me want to take a shower, and not in a good way. Clueless and smug, a very unattractive combination.
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Old 09-09-2009, 02:35 PM   #21
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Default a historical newspaper article

From 1976....

Its interesting to see the term used in print this early on. I believe that this is the first record (on the internet at least) of the words 'fat admirer' being used?

I'm not sure about the 'break her neck' comment... I would like to assume that was meant in a comedic manner but without qualification from the journalist, I guess there is no way of knowing?
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Old 10-16-2009, 11:42 AM   #22
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I'm not sure if the FA forum is the best place for this one as its a bit weight gain/relationship specific... but it popped up on my 'fat admirer' google alert so I figured I'd share the link.

http://www.metrotimes.com/culture/story.asp?id=14468

(n.b. for hetero FFAs - there's a cute little image on the page you may like? I didn't link it here because it probably breaches dims rules)

[edit - I just realized that this article is also being discussed on the main board - http://www.dimensionsmagazine.com/fo...d.php?t=65249]

Last edited by James; 10-16-2009 at 11:49 AM.
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Old 11-04-2009, 10:04 PM   #23
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"I am a Fat Admirer"

article posted on sizenet - http://www.sizenet.com/showdoc.asp?id=242
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Old 11-04-2009, 10:24 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by James View Post
...Erich Goode....

I remember Erich. He was a pretty serious researcher and we had some interesting discussions at Long Island NAAFA events in the early 1980s.


And Karen Scott-Jones! Now there was a fighter!

Last edited by Webmaster; 11-04-2009 at 10:26 PM.
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Old 11-11-2009, 05:52 PM   #25
superodalisque
 
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James, thanks for posting that link to the google book Extreme Deviance and that Erich Goode article in it. Some interesting and kind of sad stories in there. But I love how they call serious FAs "mountain men." Actually, that whole book looks pretty fascinating, despite it's silly title. Where I come from, viewing things like tattoos, FAs, and belief in aliens as somehow ""extreme"" is itself kinda "extreme" in a hilarious way.
it is a little nuts, but saying as an SSBBW its weird but i get approached by a lot of X-sports types--trick bikers, base jumpers, high divers, mountain climbers,motocross guys etc... in short a lot of risk takers. i've always wondered why. when i was in my 30s i thought it was because i looked their age. now that i'm 46 i'm pretty sure i don't look like a 20 something anymore. i'm not sure if the book will answer any of my questions but at least it looks interesting.

here's a link for those who want to take a look at the FAT STUDIES READER

http://www.amazon.com/Fat-Studies-Re...der_0814776310

needless to say i'm buying it

Last edited by superodalisque; 11-11-2009 at 05:56 PM.
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