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Old 09-11-2009, 10:55 PM   #26
Tina
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Originally Posted by Green Eyed Fairy View Post
Winds up James doesn't want it on the FA/FFA board so I asked him to put it on the weight board.
Hmmm... maybe I was wrong in suggesting it then. Sorry about that, GEF.
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Originally Posted by Admiral_Snackbar View Post
My cardinal rule is that porn should be an enhancement at best, a placebo when necessary, but never a replacement for healthy sexual relations.
Agreed.
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Porn also tends to have a precipice effect; milder scenes sometimes (not always) lead to more hardcore, more fetishistic, more fantastical scenes. This is often the boat the anti-porn crusaders ride: Pinups lead to Playboy, which leads to hardcore XXX which leads to fetish porn which leads to bondage porn which leads to illegal rape porn which leads to actual rape which leads to rape/murder and so on. This does happen, in rare instances but it's not the norm.
Yeah, I think that's the worst-case scenario. However, there are some very frequent really crappy scenarios, as related to addiction, in which your average every day porn leads to more porn, which leads to more graphic porn, which leads to chats which leads to real life hook-ups. This is more common than one might think. Less commonly, as with addiction, it never accelerates at all. I just want to make it clear that I'm speaking about addiction and addicts, not your average porn use, whatever that is.
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Obviously mileage varies. Some couples have made peace with each other's respective porn (a girlfriend of mine long ago LOVED watching gay porn--it was not my cup of tea, nor did she grab her dildo and eye my butt lasciviously), and in some cases it has wrecked relationships and marriages.
Heh. I'm sure you were relieved... Or, were you secretly eying that copy of "Bend Over, Boyfriend"?
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Old 09-11-2009, 11:28 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Admiral_Snackbar View Post

The only response I could make to a woman who suddenly finds her man's computer hard drive or video box full of hardcore anal or facial porn is not to prejudge. There's a good chance he had that interest before meeting you, and that it has little to do with how he desires you or sees you; it's an outlet for his fantasies, and there is likely a good chance he may never expect or ask you to replicate it. In a slightly similar analogy, just because your husband spends a lot of money and time on fantasy football doesn't mean he'd leave you in a heartbeat for a chance to play the gridiron. If however he starts buying Vaseline by the case or thinks squirting you with a water gun full of hand lotion is hot, you may want to have a heart-to-heart.

.
Your post seems to be you saying what is harmless and what is not. That is fine for your life...but it does not fit for everyone. It does not always matter if the man is going to ask something of me...or not. If it something that I find really offensive, I will do all the judging I want. Yes, I wouldn't have known ( maybe...as those kinds of secretive behaviors can come out in ways as far removed from the issue as possible ) if I hadn't found it...but, if I do find out...it is my life...not anybody elses.

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Old 09-12-2009, 05:50 AM   #28
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While the points I'm about to make relate to what is right for me, and me only, I think that some people may be able to wrap their hands around some of this and see where it might fit in with their perspective.

First, I believe that BBW porn is different than mainstream porn, for the same reasons why I feel that being attracted to BBW's is different than what the rest of the world would consider "normal". As FA's, guys are attracted to fat, curves, cellulite and many other things that the non FA world would not be attracted to. I don't believe that it's fetish related, but may border on it.

I also believe that BBW porn sets an unrealistic perception about BBW's in general that makes it hard for the non webmodels to overcome. Most BBW porn these days centers around eating, gaining weight, tight, or tearing clothes, and other things that the majority of the BBW's that I know are not necessarily all about. So, the FA goes out into the real world and believes that every fat woman he's about to meet wants to eat, gain weight, rip their clothes, get stuck in chairs, and satisfy every fantasy that he's seen on a paysite or video. I think we can all agree that it isn't healthy for real life relationships to have preconceived notions like this.

Another note of concern is how FA's take this to events like meetups and bashes. I've written in previous posts how I get shocked over the many men who come to events JUST to see the webmodels, walking right past many beautiful (and sexy) women who simply CHOOSE not to make BBW porn. Again, I believe that it screams to women that as a FA, I will not choose you unless you have a website. It demeans the women who have made a conscious choice, and as a FA I may at some point have to overcome a perception that I may be like all the rest of "you guys". I don't want to be part of that generalization, just as the non-website women don't want to necessarily be considered gainers, feedees, etc......

Lastly, with the plethora of BBW webmodels on the net these days, there is so much NEW free porn at a guy's disposal. I think it's easy for a guy to sit back and survey the porn field on a daily basis looking for new fap material. I think having an overabundance of this in your life certainly affects any relationship one might be in, both in a sexual and psychological way. My guess is that in many cases, if your guy isn't paying as much attention to you as he was before, it's because he's having an online obsession with the newest fat webmodel.

Now, I'm not saying this is true of all FA's by any means, but I know a lot of guys who have fallen into this trap, and have lost many good women as a result.

I could probably write pages about this, and may do so at a later date, but at least wanted to get my basic feelings about the subject into this thread. As someone who has struggled with a SO participating in BBW porn, I also have a lot to say on how BBW porn modeling affects relationships as well, but that's not what this thread is about.
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Old 09-12-2009, 10:03 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by wrestlingguy View Post
While the points I'm about to make relate to what is right for me, and me only, I think that some people may be able to wrap their hands around some of this and see where it might fit in with their perspective.

First, I believe that BBW porn is different than mainstream porn, for the same reasons why I feel that being attracted to BBW's is different than what the rest of the world would consider "normal". As FA's, guys are attracted to fat, curves, cellulite and many other things that the non FA world would not be attracted to. I don't believe that it's fetish related, but may border on it.

I also believe that BBW porn sets an unrealistic perception about BBW's in general that makes it hard for the non webmodels to overcome. Most BBW porn these days centers around eating, gaining weight, tight, or tearing clothes, and other things that the majority of the BBW's that I know are not necessarily all about. So, the FA goes out into the real world and believes that every fat woman he's about to meet wants to eat, gain weight, rip their clothes, get stuck in chairs, and satisfy every fantasy that he's seen on a paysite or video. I think we can all agree that it isn't healthy for real life relationships to have preconceived notions like this.

Another note of concern is how FA's take this to events like meetups and bashes. I've written in previous posts how I get shocked over the many men who come to events JUST to see the webmodels, walking right past many beautiful (and sexy) women who simply CHOOSE not to make BBW porn. Again, I believe that it screams to women that as a FA, I will not choose you unless you have a website. It demeans the women who have made a conscious choice, and as a FA I may at some point have to overcome a perception that I may be like all the rest of "you guys". I don't want to be part of that generalization, just as the non-website women don't want to necessarily be considered gainers, feedees, etc......

Lastly, with the plethora of BBW webmodels on the net these days, there is so much NEW free porn at a guy's disposal. I think it's easy for a guy to sit back and survey the porn field on a daily basis looking for new fap material. I think having an overabundance of this in your life certainly affects any relationship one might be in, both in a sexual and psychological way. My guess is that in many cases, if your guy isn't paying as much attention to you as he was before, it's because he's having an online obsession with the newest fat webmodel.

Now, I'm not saying this is true of all FA's by any means, but I know a lot of guys who have fallen into this trap, and have lost many good women as a result.

I could probably write pages about this, and may do so at a later date, but at least wanted to get my basic feelings about the subject into this thread. As someone who has struggled with a SO participating in BBW porn, I also have a lot to say on how BBW porn modeling affects relationships as well, but that's not what this thread is about.
you make an excellent point here. its more than just the porn that can be a problem. its also the culture surrounding it. its how an FA can act at an event. that can also warp a guy. his fantastical beliefs are held out as being perfectly acceptable to anyone who is confident--which is not always true. i think a lot of men keep it all in the appropriate place but there are a lot of men who make this thier life at the sacrifice of the real. some know the difference. some don't. i think a lot make a conscious effort to choose somehing they already know is unreal. the problem with that is that they can become warped. once this is thier entire world they have a serious problem connecting IRL. the same problem can happen with BBWs. you go home get in your jammies and get online and wonder why you never meet any BBWs or FAs in IRL. FAs wonder why they don't get the same reactions IRL.

all of this stuff tends to have an intimacy blocking effect. sometimes i think FAs forget that when they go to a website or go to an event the webmodels there are being paid to say what they say and act the way that they act. it is a fantasy that they are selling. the ones who don't ever break the fantasy or the ones who do the best. sure a few believe some of that stuff or want to but most just do what they do to make a buck. your right, when they get to the real world they expect BBWs IRL to behave that way or believe those things deep down they get seriously disappointed. after all if you are into BDSM you don't go to the office in your get-up and using the language and mindset. thats private stuff. unfortuntely some FAs don't have those kinds fo boundaries . they often get disappointed when they finally encounter web models as thier real selves as well because the are really just like all of the other BBWs on the inside. they have the same doubts fears and requirements as any other women. they also need real love, intimacy and caring. they are not special cases. thats why i really like so many of them-- because they are me and all of the other BBWs here underneath everything. they are just as varied as he rest of us. they aren't just empty vessels for someone to put whatever they like into them that they might appear to be.

unfortunately there are some FAs who seem to experience the entire world as a porn site. its a shame because they miss out on a lot. not only do they ignore some regular BBWs some GET ignored by regular BBWs. they are just too shaming in their activities. its hard for a proud BBWs to submit to being with a guy she finds embarrassing. she just won't do it. a web model does not care. its her job. she has nothing emotionally invested and doesn't care if a guy is fickle or not. it doesn't bother her if a guy is always talking about how hot other webmodels are and ogling her and her friends interchangeably in an obvious way. but a truly proud BBW IRL won't like it just the same as an FA wouldn't like it done to him. i think a lot of BBWs are right that FAs have no idea what a proud BBW really looks like. they think pride means willing to expose yourself. pride also means your too self aware to take disrespect.

so after many years of chasing after "the perfect BBW" as someone's thread said an FA can find himself alone. and because he has chosen to espose himself to a culture that isn't real he does not respect or get a benefit from the real world he isn;t involved in. he becomes imappropriately socialized by his own fantasies that porn mirrors back to him for a small fee on his credit card. i think its a big concern to BBWs exactly how a mn is intepellating porn. i should be. bu even moreso it should be of concern to FAs. they need to figure out what over indulgin is doing to thier lives. a woman can easily chose not to live with an FA. she can go out and find another man. but, it much harder for an FA to continue living with himself inunsatifying conditions.


this is why i'm so concerned that there is nothing between porn and the real world for FAs like there are for other men to bridge the gap. having porn as the only outlet for your dreams wishes and desires seriously limits a man. as much as they often pretend that they don't pay attention, the culture of romance that other men tend to get readily is all around him to influence him and socialize him in ways where he can understand that there are ways to desire women other than just sexually. that can help him to actually seek want and to develop meaningful relationships with BBWs outside of just titilation. its a shame but when i explain that to a lot of FAs either they don't seem to get it or don't want to get it. maybe this is a way for some FAS to avoid the kind of attachment that would require them to actually be with a BBW in public and not just at an event. i don't know. but when i explain it to other guys they understand right away so i don't think i'm way off base. something is missing here.

PS: the wouldn't let me rep you again

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Old 09-12-2009, 10:27 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Fascinita View Post
I hope this thread will not be seen as an opportunity for controversy or for denying the valid feelings of some of us, or as an opportunity to try to cast people as "prudes" or "biddies."

This thread is for talking about the negative impact that porn can have on a relationship and about setting boundaries. While many women are perfectly fine with their SO's occasional use of porn--some even encouraging it--there's no denying that the ubiquity of porn in our lives can sometimes mean that "it gets to us."

Whether we're dealing with SOs who won't or can't cut back on or stop looking at porn--maybe some who have even stopped paying attention to us in favor of looking at porn, or who lie or try to conceal the extent or frequency of their porn use--or we're talking about the over-abundance of images of women as objects that can make us feel like we have to "keep up" to keep our SO's attentions, what negative effects do you think porn has had on your relationship and your life?

As well, how do you negotiate boundaries--again, in a culture where there is a seeming ever-increasing availability of pornographic images of women--with your SO about porn?

Any and all constructive replies are welcome.
I've had very few relationships overall. Most of the guys I met quite frankly weren't in to porn very much if at all. Looking at some other person having sex with a woman or some such thing didn't appeal BUT... I've had a significant number of men who were interested in filming and viewing our own sexual encounters. The answer was and shall always be a resounding no on that from me. It has lead me to consider it as a legitimate leaning however, that people may take enjoyment in watching and remembering sex featuring themselves and the one they desire. Either that or they were hoping to sell it and make money if I ever got famous. I can't really comment on what I would be able to endure in a relationship with a porn lover but I reckon I would not be bothered so much as long as it doesn't impede or precursor their ability to function.
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Old 09-12-2009, 10:40 AM   #31
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I don't want to say porn broke up my marriage but I was replaced with images of something I could never be. Now I'm overly sensitive to it...

I don't care what my bf looks at per se. I'd prefer he keep it to himself so in the event its something I feel that I can never compare my feelings are spared.

It's probably not the healthiest of choices, but it's my compromise.
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Old 09-12-2009, 12:59 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Admiral_Snackbar View Post
The only response I could make to a woman who suddenly finds her man's computer hard drive or video box full of hardcore anal or facial porn is not to prejudge. There's a good chance he had that interest before meeting you, and that it has little to do with how he desires you or sees you; it's an outlet for his fantasies, and there is likely a good chance he may never expect or ask you to replicate it. In a slightly similar analogy, just because your husband spends a lot of money and time on fantasy football doesn't mean he'd leave you in a heartbeat for a chance to play the gridiron. If however he starts buying Vaseline by the case or thinks squirting you with a water gun full of hand lotion is hot, you may want to have a heart-to-heart.
I have to say that I believe the data bears your statement (which I bolded) out; it would also say that his porn use has nothing to do with her, nor is it her fault, nor is it because there is something lacking within her or to do with her physical makeup. It's something that was likely in place before he and she ever met. However, I would like to say that she has full rights to dislike and feel uncomfortable with it, and also to pre-judge if she feels it's warranted or sets off her own buttons. Such a situation calls for a discussion between the two and mutual understanding and respect, but I don't think her feelings should ever be discounted nor treated lightly, and I don't think women should be told how to feel about it.
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Old 09-12-2009, 02:02 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Fascinita View Post
I hope this thread will not be seen as an opportunity for controversy or for denying the valid feelings of some of us, or as an opportunity to try to cast people as "prudes" or "biddies."

This thread is for talking about the negative impact that porn can have on a relationship and about setting boundaries. While many women are perfectly fine with their SO's occasional use of porn--some even encouraging it--there's no denying that the ubiquity of porn in our lives can sometimes mean that "it gets to us."

Whether we're dealing with SOs who won't or can't cut back on or stop looking at porn--maybe some who have even stopped paying attention to us in favor of looking at porn, or who lie or try to conceal the extent or frequency of their porn use--or we're talking about the over-abundance of images of women as objects that can make us feel like we have to "keep up" to keep our SO's attentions, what negative effects do you think porn has had on your relationship and your life?

As well, how do you negotiate boundaries--again, in a culture where there is a seeming ever-increasing availability of pornographic images of women--with your SO about porn?

Any and all constructive replies are welcome.

For me personally, since my own kinks are a bit on the extreme side, I find most porn to be rather boring. Even some of the SM porn I've seen is boring, so it really wouldn't matter to me what a guy is watching assuming all participants are old enough. I'd think that because porn gets old fast, one would need a constant stream of new images. The same theme can be played out over and over, but new scenarios and such are the only things to make it fresh. Least it's been that way for my own porn use. But since it is so hard to find what I like, I don't bother much. I just rely on my imagination.

Not watching porn doesn't guarantee that a guy isn't thinking of someone else or something else while with you in bed. I know I've been guilty of a wandering mind while in the middle of sex. If a woman is of the mind that her SO is only supposed to be turned on by her and her alone, then she's got some issues. It would be unrealistic to expect a guy to not look while you're out and about. Hell I look myself. It's just how that is expressed seems to be the bigger problem. If he's discreet and respectful about it, then it's fine, but if he's openly drooling then there's a problem. I'd say the same goes for porn use. He should respect your boundaries, assuming they are realistic. To me a realistic boundary is asking your SO to not watch porn when you are around if it is that bothersome.

I do wonder what a guy would say about an SO who had a rather large romance novel collection. I'm assuming tho that women who read romance novels read them for the fantasy aspects and they know it is fantasy. Would they really expect their SOs to behave and look like the men in those books? Do men feel threatened by them? Are they on a different level of fantasy because they are books and not images?

Like Lilly, I've been in the position where guys would prefer to take video or pictures, to which I've always said no thanks. I'd have more of a problem with a fuck buddy who wanted to film us than one who wanted to just watch it together.

I would think too that if a guy had an addiction to porn it would come out at some point while dating, which might give a woman time to decide if she wanted to deal with that. I suppose a chat about porn use in general would be in order from the beginning.

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Old 09-12-2009, 04:20 PM   #34
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I used to feel insecure about the concept of a boyfriend of mine viewing porn, but that gradually changed due to (a) the fact that none of the guys I've dated have used it to an unhealthy amount, and (b) the fact that I read enough erotica to make me a big ol' hypocrite if I'm opposed to porn on principle. It hasn't been a relationship issue yet.

I've tried watching porn of all sorts, but 99.999% of it looks completely ridiculous, in my opinion.
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Old 09-12-2009, 07:53 PM   #35
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Heh. I'm sure you were relieved... Or, were you secretly eying that copy of "Bend Over, Boyfriend"?
Not at all, dirty birdie. I did give it the college try and watched one with her--just not my cup of tea. Regardless of the fact it was two guys, one of them definitely took the sub/femme position during the whole deal. Everything was also a lot more violent, subjugative. Why some of these things always have to involve belittling someone else is beyond me.

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Originally Posted by mossystate View Post
Your post seems to be you saying what is harmless and what is not. That is fine for your life...but it does not fit for everyone. It does not always matter if the man is going to ask something of me...or not. If it something that I find really offensive, I will do all the judging I want. Yes, I wouldn't have known ( maybe...as those kinds of secretive behaviors can come out in ways as far removed from the issue as possible ) if I hadn't found it...but, if I do find out...it is my life...not anybody elses.
Firstly, I made a point to say "mileage may vary." I can't speak directly to how anyone may react to finding their S.O.'s 'stash,' only not to react with both guns blazing (again, assuming standard fare and not something you would resort to contacting the authorities over). Secondly, you are well within your right to object to what he's presenting to you, just keep in mind that offensive to you may not be for him. Sadly there are guys out there who grew up with little common knowledge about sexual behavior other than what they gleaned from Debbie Does Dallas.

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Originally Posted by Tina View Post
I have to say that I believe the data bears your statement (which I bolded) out; it would also say that his porn use has nothing to do with her, nor is it her fault, nor is it because there is something lacking within her or to do with her physical makeup. It's something that was likely in place before he and she ever met. However, I would like to say that she has full rights to dislike and feel uncomfortable with it, and also to pre-judge if she feels it's warranted or sets off her own buttons. Such a situation calls for a discussion between the two and mutual understanding and respect, but I don't think her feelings should ever be discounted nor treated lightly, and I don't think women should be told how to feel about it.
I agree a woman is entitled to react however she wishes. I would also say that for some guys I would imagine opening up his porn cache for his lady's consideration is about as open as he may get with her initially--he's letting her into his fantasy chambers so to speak, and that's a very vulnerable spot for a guy to put himself. Then again some guys may be as blase about what they prefer up front (as may some women). With some of those alt.com and similar websites, you can pretty much stipulate you sexual preference about ANYTHING.

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Originally Posted by StarWitness View Post
I used to feel insecure about the concept of a boyfriend of mine viewing porn, but that gradually changed due to (a) the fact that none of the guys I've dated have used it to an unhealthy amount, and (b) the fact that I read enough erotica to make me a big ol' hypocrite if I'm opposed to porn on principle. It hasn't been a relationship issue yet.

I've tried watching porn of all sorts, but 99.999% of it looks completely ridiculous, in my opinion.
I would assume if I was having sex with a woman, with my leg thrown over her thigh at an uncomfortable angle with a hot light and camera just under my testicles in order to get the proper video angle, all the while acting as if I am enjoying having this muscle-straining sex with someone I likely just met 30 minutes ago, I'd probably feel pretty ridiculous, too.
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Old 09-13-2009, 01:01 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Admiral_Snackbar View Post
Firstly, I made a point to say "mileage may vary." I can't speak directly to how anyone may react to finding their S.O.'s 'stash,' only not to react with both guns blazing (again, assuming standard fare and not something you would resort to contacting the authorities over). Secondly, you are well within your right to object to what he's presenting to you, just keep in mind that offensive to you may not be for him. Sadly there are guys out there who grew up with little common knowledge about sexual behavior other than what they gleaned from Debbie Does Dallas.

You came into the bbw forum to tell women how they should look at things. You told women that A and B should be of no concern...however, C should tell them they need to have a chat with their SO.

I think I realize that what is not OK for me, might be OK for ' him '. You are going against,in a very schooling manner, the very spirit of this thread...His porn use...YOUR feelings ( your meaning bbw ).

" Not to react "....is telling women how ' we ' should feel/operate. I don't get why you continue to not understand the proposed conversation. This is not so much about the particulars of porn.

"Iwould also say that for some guys I would imagine opening up his porn cache for his lady's consideration is about as open as he may get with her initially--he's letting her into his fantasy chambers so to speak, and that's a very vulnerable spot for a guy to put himself"

Again...this is about BBW FEELINGS on the matter...in THEIR lives. Why not start a thread on the fa forum, addressing the difficulties that men face, when the fat woman in their lives are suspect of their porn use. Can't you let bbw have this to talk about our feelings...that might not be yours? It is denying feelings when there is a, " have at your feelings....BUT "......
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Old 09-13-2009, 06:51 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Lucky View Post
I don't want to say porn broke up my marriage but I was replaced with images of something I could never be. Now I'm overly sensitive to it...

I don't care what my bf looks at per se. I'd prefer he keep it to himself so in the event its something I feel that I can never compare my feelings are spared.

It's probably not the healthiest of choices, but it's my compromise.
There are moments on this board when I'm really just struck so hard by the fact that I'm not alone in the struggles in my life, and that other people do get it. This is one of them. I could have written this myself, Sarah, so close it is to one of my own experiences. The pain is still quite profound. When someone would rather sit at a computer looking at images of bodies they will never know, rather than touch the very real, very different body right in the next room, that's a hurt that cuts right to one's core.

Anyway. I just wanted to say that yep, I get it. Thank you for sharing that.
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Old 09-13-2009, 09:20 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by Carrie View Post
There are moments on this board when I'm really just struck so hard by the fact that I'm not alone in the struggles in my life, and that other people do get it. This is one of them. I could have written this myself, Sarah, so close it is to one of my own experiences. The pain is still quite profound. When someone would rather sit at a computer looking at images of bodies they will never know, rather than touch the very real, very different body right in the next room, that's a hurt that cuts right to one's core.

Anyway. I just wanted to say that yep, I get it. Thank you for sharing that.
Awwwww, thanks for saying something. It's a very sore spot for me, but I'm so glad we have a place like this we can say as much or as little as we like.
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Old 09-13-2009, 02:48 PM   #39
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This is definitely an issue that I've struggled with, particularly when I was younger and more insecure about myself and my body. I always felt betrayed when the man in my life looked at porn, because I felt like if I was "enough", he wouldn't need/want it. However, over the years, as I've become more secure in myself and my sexuality, and as I've talked to the men I've known over the years, it bothers me less. I'm not saying that porn doesn't bother me at all (I still have issues with how women are objectified, even when they choose it for themselves), because it does bother me, at least a little bit. But I've perhaps swallowed that whole "men like variety" thing hook, line and sinker and have come to terms with it. Mostly. On good days.

I just wonder how men would feel if their sweetie pie had a hard drive full of pictures of naked men. I wonder if they'd feel just a little bit insecure. How lucky for them that, by and large, women aren't as visually motivated, sexually speaking.
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Old 09-13-2009, 03:48 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Carrie View Post
There are moments on this board when I'm really just struck so hard by the fact that I'm not alone in the struggles in my life, and that other people do get it. This is one of them. I could have written this myself, Sarah, so close it is to one of my own experiences. The pain is still quite profound. When someone would rather sit at a computer looking at images of bodies they will never know, rather than touch the very real, very different body right in the next room, that's a hurt that cuts right to one's core.

Anyway. I just wanted to say that yep, I get it. Thank you for sharing that.
Me too, although it was online gaming, not porn. But fantasy is fantasy, and he wanted fantasy over me. It was a blow to my already precarious self esteem at the time. So while I like nerdy boys, excessive gaming or excessive anything that takes someone away or keeps them away from emotional or physical intimacy, I run the other direction.

Being lonely alone is far, far less painful than being alone, especially sexually rejected, while in a relationship.

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Old 09-13-2009, 10:13 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Miss Vickie View Post
How lucky for them that, by and large, women aren't as visually motivated, sexually speaking.
This adds another complication, Vickie. Maybe women aren't as visually motivated as men, but we do have plenty of other fantasies.

It's interesting how our conception of intimacy plays into this whole debate: To what point do we want to or should we know what each other's fantasies are? To some extent, it's true that we can never know everything about other people, so this inherently puts a damper on those who would want to keep track of every single last instance of fantasy that one's SO indulges in. It simply can't be. But then I wonder, isn't it when fantasy begins to seep into one's everyday life, in terms of time we spend checking out of our relationships or jobs or other commitments and responsibilities, or in terms of bonds we break for the sake of time with fantasies--which in turn may feel like "outs" or "escape" from those very bonds--that things begin to get corrupt?

In a sense, the indulging in fantasy is perfectly harmless. It's the consequences of unchecked fantasy and of blurred boundaries between fantasy and reality that are problematic, I think. Maybe?
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Old 09-14-2009, 12:50 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by mossystate View Post
You came into the bbw forum to tell women how they should look at things. You told women that A and B should be of no concern...however, C should tell them they need to have a chat with their SO.

I think I realize that what is not OK for me, might be OK for ' him '. You are going against,in a very schooling manner, the very spirit of this thread...His porn use...YOUR feelings ( your meaning bbw ).

" Not to react "....is telling women how ' we ' should feel/operate. I don't get why you continue to not understand the proposed conversation. This is not so much about the particulars of porn.

"Iwould also say that for some guys I would imagine opening up his porn cache for his lady's consideration is about as open as he may get with her initially--he's letting her into his fantasy chambers so to speak, and that's a very vulnerable spot for a guy to put himself"

Again...this is about BBW FEELINGS on the matter...in THEIR lives. Why not start a thread on the fa forum, addressing the difficulties that men face, when the fat woman in their lives are suspect of their porn use. Can't you let bbw have this to talk about our feelings...that might not be yours? It is denying feelings when there is a, " have at your feelings....BUT "......
i agree with this 100%. only a woman can say what she is comfortable with and what she isn't. i don't think she have to tolerate something that makes her miserable especially when there are plenty of guys out there who will respect her thoughts and wishes and fit comfortable within her vision of the kind of relationship she'd like to have. squashing down your feelings as a woman is never the answer and i don't think its fair for men to ask a woman to. if a woman's feelings don't fit into a guys needs instead of trying to force her to be another way he should just leave her alone and let her get on with finding someone compatable.
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Old 09-14-2009, 03:29 AM   #43
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Watching porn or viewing pornographic images as fantasy is just fine in my opinion. The problem I've found with a lot of the guys I've met in the plus community is that most don't just do that. They become obsessed with the models, try to have entire conversations about what so and so did in her last set, buy them gifts, chat, horde any and all images, stalk them on facebook... See, that's not ok in my book. If a man is with me then he's with me. I demand his full attention and I will not accept constant drooling or conversation about other women, whether they are part of his fantasy life or not, it's just pathetic. I understand young men and women who are intrigued by pornography, its illicit and dirty and exciting. But then I think its fairly important to wake up to the fact that most of it is really dull and ridiculous, and that real life women don't generally speak or act like that, nor do most women find being spat on or regularly shagged in the ass the pinnacle of sexual pleasure
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Old 09-14-2009, 10:51 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by Fascinita View Post
This adds another complication, Vickie. Maybe women aren't as visually motivated as men, but we do have plenty of other fantasies.
True. I've been lucky that I have had an indulgent husband who has not only humored my fantasies, but has encouraged me to pursue them as I've felt comfortable. Not being as confident in myself, I haven't been able to offer him the same thing, but he's had the benefit of my sexual exploration in that I'm much happier, and he loves hearing the details.

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It's interesting how our conception of intimacy plays into this whole debate: To what point do we want to or should we know what each other's fantasies are?
That's an interesting question. I guess the way I see it is that I want to be accepting enough, open enough, and sufficiently worthy of great trust that he feels he can tell me his fantasies, but not that he must. Of course I want to know every fantasy (or at least I think I do) but I don't think it's fair to make your partner share something they don't want to share. Discussing fantasies can be a lot of fun, but it can also be scary at first. Not only is it fun but I think it's good for a relationship because it builds intimacy and trust, and can open the relationship up to all kinds of new possibilities.

OTOH, I don't think of fantasies as having anything to do with me necessarily because they're usually about scenarios that I may or may not be involved in. But looking at other women makes me feel that I'm not good enough because if I were, he'd be looking at pictures of ME. (This was how I used to feel in my less secure days; I feel less like this now).

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But then I wonder, isn't it when fantasy begins to seep into one's everyday life, in terms of time we spend checking out of our relationships or jobs or other commitments and responsibilities, or in terms of bonds we break for the sake of time with fantasies--which in turn may feel like "outs" or "escape" from those very bonds--that things begin to get corrupt?
Yes. And this can be anything, sexual or not. It could be gambling, drinking, gaming, internet time, shopping, eating, etc etc etc. Anything that is used as an escape from the relationship can cause problems because it takes energy away from it and short circuits communication, which is necessary to repair most, if not all, problems.

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In a sense, the indulging in fantasy is perfectly harmless. It's the consequences of unchecked fantasy and of blurred boundaries between fantasy and reality that are problematic, I think. Maybe?
I think so too. Maybe.

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Originally Posted by superodalisque View Post
i agree with this 100%. only a woman can say what she is comfortable with and what she isn't. i don't think she have to tolerate something that makes her miserable especially when there are plenty of guys out there who will respect her thoughts and wishes and fit comfortable within her vision of the kind of relationship she'd like to have. squashing down your feelings as a woman is never the answer and i don't think its fair for men to ask a woman to. if a woman's feelings don't fit into a guys needs instead of trying to force her to be another way he should just leave her alone and let her get on with finding someone compatable.
Quoted for truthiness.
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Old 09-14-2009, 03:10 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Carrie View Post
There are moments on this board when I'm really just struck so hard by the fact that I'm not alone in the struggles in my life, and that other people do get it. This is one of them. I could have written this myself, Sarah, so close it is to one of my own experiences. The pain is still quite profound. When someone would rather sit at a computer looking at images of bodies they will never know, rather than touch the very real, very different body right in the next room, that's a hurt that cuts right to one's core.

Anyway. I just wanted to say that yep, I get it. Thank you for sharing that.
Add me to the list of people who feels this way. Honestly, I haven't had too much of an issue with this in my life, but porn worries me. If it's something we could possibly enjoy together, okay, but otherwise I'm just not on board with th' porns. :\
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Old 09-14-2009, 04:05 PM   #46
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Watching porn or viewing pornographic images as fantasy is just fine in my opinion. The problem I've found with a lot of the guys I've met in the plus community is that most don't just do that. They become obsessed with the models, try to have entire conversations about what so and so did in her last set, buy them gifts, chat, horde any and all images, stalk them on facebook... See, that's not ok in my book. If a man is with me then he's with me. I demand his full attention and I will not accept constant drooling or conversation about other women, whether they are part of his fantasy life or not, it's just pathetic. I understand young men and women who are intrigued by pornography, its illicit and dirty and exciting. But then I think its fairly important to wake up to the fact that most of it is really dull and ridiculous, and that real life women don't generally speak or act like that, nor do most women find being spat on or regularly shagged in the ass the pinnacle of sexual pleasure

they wouldn't let me rep you . i think there is a special issue about the bbw community and porn. it seems as though it is overly dependent on porn to an abnormal degree. it makes me wonder if it fosters addiction. i know a whole lot of guys who are always viewing, can't stop thinking or talking about it and have real trouble when it comes to dealing with a real women with real thoughts and needs because of that. i see this with FAs much more than i do in the rest of the world. other men seem to get how inappropriate this really is. they don't seem to expect women they are interested in to listen to long drawn out stories about why they like judith jameson and long exhortations centering on the things that she does and what they like about it. they don't expect thier gf or a woman they are interested in to go to an event with them where they follow her and other porn actresses around and try to touch them. but for some reason the community seems to cushion guys from knowing that what they are doing is just not emotionally healthy to a large degree --for themselves or a bbw. its almost as though in this community its not quite understood that this is abnormal maybe because so many people seem to have the problem. or more than likely its hard to say to someone that he is behaving abnormally when you know he already feels abnormal and even beating himself up for for being attracted to fat women in the first place. so maybe they just don't get the wake up calls from the community that they should be getting because particularly in the past the people in it have been very protective of FAs because it was thought that was needed. what you ended up with was a bunch of older guys who were seriously beyond the pale in thier behavior who felt perfectly justified and supported in that. unfortunately for them that was not the road to happiness that people thought it might be. its better to just tell the truth so that people can be aware of what they really look like to the people they admire and even to the outside world. i'm not so sure that a lot of guys really realize there are millions of guys out there with a fat partner. they aren't threatening divorce if the women don't lose weight. people aren't all shocked and horrified that they have a fat partner except the most cruel and superficial. so maybe the reason FAs sometimes get judged and treated badly is not necessarily because they love a fat girl but because they are obssessed with fat bodies. if any man is obsessed with any kind of body and is always showing it thats going to affect how people react to you. especially if you are the one who is ashamed and inappropriate more often than not.

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Old 09-14-2009, 04:27 PM   #47
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Felicia, I said this above, and rather than reiterate, I'll just re-post it. I think it may have some truth in there somewhere...
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Further, I've wondered if the ratio of porn addict FAs isn't even a bit higher than in the rest of society. The reason I say this is that liking fat women has for so long been a kind of 'shameful attraction in many ways, so that many (if not most) go underground for a while after realizing their preference and before deciding not to give a shit. That already is encouragement to hide and lie and be furtive about it. Can kind of set up the foundation for some of the behaviors that can signal possible addiction (hoarding, because until more recently there haven't been a lot of paysites and images of naked and half-naked fat women -- and hiding, because of the aforementioned). Anyway, just one of those things I've pondered.
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Old 09-14-2009, 04:28 PM   #48
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Food for thought in your post, Felicia.

I also know that, for some people, it's the "otherness" and the transgressiveness of fat that attracts them. And I wonder if the draw of transgression in fat doesn't get mapped onto the transgressiveness of porn... Fat and porn, as ideas, both seem to suggest the possibility of erasing boundaries between people.


(c.f. literary theorist Mikhail Bakhtin for discussion of the trope of 'the grotesque body' and Walter Benjamin for discussion of art in the age of mechanical reproduction.)
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Old 09-14-2009, 04:41 PM   #49
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yes both Tina and Fascinita, your posts are especially poigniant. i think the taboo aspect of it is a big driver for a lot of people. i think that is why it can be such an important issue for bbws since removing taboo can be an SA issue for us. so what some FAs may be doing seems to work directly counter to that. there aren't too many of us out there who want to be referenced like the modern day fat woman at the circus. we just want to be appreciated as the beautiful woman that we are. i think i mentioned this about taboo somewhere before but that is the crux of why porn is popular. somehow in the west it seems we have lost the ability in some part to enjoy sex for sex sex sake. maybe its our puritan roots --i'm not sure. we seem to need the illicit furtive shameful. that is a huge component in the popularity of porn. the need to feel bad or reiterate that we are bad is a part of many addictive preoccupations--not just sex.

i think for some FAs mastrubation becomes some kind of mental self flagellation in front fo the comp screen. maybe for me this would explain the needless shame and fear associated with something that some other men do easily without thought or care. maybe there are guys who need the guilt as a component and its one of the main things that get them off. and maybe even the fact that there is a woman lying in the other room who needs them makes it even more illicit. they know they should be with her but they are not. they are spending time and effort on these other women they don't know instead of with her. there is something naughtier about that than just going next door to your bedroom and spending time with a woman who is actually touchable. add on the excitement of perhaps having the woman you are ignoring underscore that you are "bad" for not spending time with her and knowing exactly what you are spending time with. also there seems to be pleasure in shaming her as well in some aspects of it. its as though the apparent undesireabilty is constant being underscored. it might have something to do with how some men like to shame not just bbws but all women in public with other women as well. with bbws it might have an added component because if we get shamed we are supposed to become emotionally upset and eat more and gain. sometimes i think i notice that feeders or guys who want the woman they are with to gain seem to engage in behaviors that would be more likely to shame and depress a woman. what do y'all think about that issue?

Last edited by superodalisque; 09-14-2009 at 05:03 PM.
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Old 09-14-2009, 04:55 PM   #50
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If so, I think that's pretty sad, Felicia, for both of them.
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