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Old 11-17-2009, 10:59 PM   #26
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i thought those groups usually referred to a "higher power" are they really mentioning jesus a lot? i also wonder if it has to do with which chapter you belong to as well. maybe one of the jesusy ones could point your friend to a nearby chapter that isn't so pointedly christian?
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Old 11-18-2009, 12:10 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by superodalisque View Post
i thought those groups usually referred to a "higher power" are they really mentioning jesus a lot? i also wonder if it has to do with which chapter you belong to as well. maybe one of the jesusy ones could point your friend to a nearby chapter that isn't so pointedly christian?
I have never heard Jesus mentioned at any meeting that I have been to.

I have also not heard of a Christian OA meeting, as OA is not affiliated with any form of organized religion.
If a group has done that, then they have broken off from mainstream OA.
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Old 11-18-2009, 12:41 AM   #28
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I have never heard Jesus mentioned at any meeting that I have been to.

I have also not heard of a Christian OA meeting, as OA is not affiliated with any form of organized religion.
If a group has done that, then they have broken off from mainstream OA.
thats what i had thought. i was wondering...

but there was a heavy religious bent. maybe it depends on your chapter. i have a feeling that maybe a more urban chapter might be less religion centered. but i had a look at some stuff and it does seem there are a lot of religious testimonial type things going on in twelve step programs too. take a look at this for AA : http://www.adherents.com/people/pw/Bill_Wilson.html

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Old 11-18-2009, 03:37 AM   #29
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The OA group I went to here in the UK was pretty good as far as religion goes, but that could be because the UK is less religious. God is mentioned, but God can be anything. I know one lady there used nature, the beauty of it all as her higher power. I never heard anyone say Jesus.

The reason I stopped going is I am very uncomfortable with the sponsor side of it. I'm socially awkward and don't develop relationships easily. It takes a lot for me to trust anyone and the thought of bothering someone with my problems, did not appeal to me.

I did get some counselling for my binge eating. It was good and taught me some valuable lessons. I will never be cured, but I do have times of wellness. I have been struggling alot the past year as my psoriasis got embarrassingly bad, I stayed in and built up my own little world that revolved around food. The psoriasis has gone into remission again and I am coming out of the fog. I suddenly remembered how to get control of this beast and life is good.
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Old 11-18-2009, 03:55 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by BeautifulPoeticDisaster View Post
The OA group I went to here in the UK was pretty good as far as religion goes, but that could be because the UK is less religious. God is mentioned, but God can be anything. I know one lady there used nature, the beauty of it all as her higher power. I never heard anyone say Jesus.

The reason I stopped going is I am very uncomfortable with the sponsor side of it. I'm socially awkward and don't develop relationships easily. It takes a lot for me to trust anyone and the thought of bothering someone with my problems, did not appeal to me.

I did get some counselling for my binge eating. It was good and taught me some valuable lessons. I will never be cured, but I do have times of wellness. I have been struggling alot the past year as my psoriasis got embarrassingly bad, I stayed in and built up my own little world that revolved around food. The psoriasis has gone into remission again and I am coming out of the fog. I suddenly remembered how to get control of this beast and life is good.
I do not have a sponsor, as I feel the meetings are enough for me. I do not want to be calling somebody at all hours of the day and night. That is not me.
You can still work the program and do what works for you.
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Old 11-18-2009, 05:07 AM   #31
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Thank you mods for re-evaluating this thread. I really did not want to talk about diets in any way (not least because i have seen so many people try them and fail and end up in a spiral) but thought that eating disorders are really significant to so many people. Anyway, initially i was wondering about alternatives to religious based groups. 1. because my friend now considers herself pagan and rejects religion of any kind. Secondly because she has talked about her pretty repressive catholic upbringing, which i think has a lot to do with a lot of her compulsions, so was worried that if religion was sited it wouldn't just put her off but might actually make her worse. Thank you everyone for sharing your experiences and for the advice. I'm sure we have lots to learn from each other on this subject. Anyway, i am glad this thread is open again.
I have had experience myself of disordered eating. I remember stuffing food into my mouth and spitting it out.. i have no idea what age i was, but really young maby 6ish. I remember not eating.. spitting food out, being afraid of certain foods, compulsive excersizing.. all sorts of stuff. I actually had pretty bad o.c.d too for many years that really got in the way of my life (which can come back as ticks and intrusive thoughts if i am stressed). I never went to any groups, though i actually really wish i had as i think they would have been a great help. My o.c.d behaviour sort of stopped in my teens but was replaced by self harm which i guess wasn't all that good either to be honest. (This was very much compulsive too and i still have to struggle not to do this). I feel like i am being very 'me me me' so wont dither on too much.. but for me i belive a lot of my compulsive behaviour is a form of control which stems from a lot of abuse as a child. As i have slowly come to terms with this my compulsive behaviours and thoughts have become less. Though i don't think this is the case for everyone, out of the people i know who either compulsively eat, drink, gamble..(i know a lot of mentally unwell people being a muso!) for many of them it seems to be a way of controlling things they either cant control now or couldn't control at some point. I don't know if there is any sort of empirical evidence for this link but to me it makes sense...
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Old 11-18-2009, 05:15 AM   #32
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My mom took me to a series of OA meetings when i was 12. It was a warm atmosphere with little "christian" talk. There may have been some god referrals but i was not put out by it since it was a general god or higher power. It was a long time ago but it was a nice group of people. All of whom i could relate to. I have many issues with food and it was kind of nice. Being 12 on the other hand, it was also VERY scary since i was the youngest person there. I loved the parties they held though
Actually, this reminds me of something. Do you think that there is an age where you are too young for groups like this? This is a bit off subject but i had a friend and her mum took her to hypnosis for OE when she was really young (i think she said in her early teens) -She rembers the guy basically saying 'fat is bad' and stuff like that.. so actually, it made her self image worse as well as her disordered eating. I know there is a huge difference between some bastard hyptotist and support groups.. but i wonder if there is any point/reason they might do more harm than good, or if there should be an age limit to attendance??
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Old 11-18-2009, 06:27 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by superodalisque View Post
i thought those groups usually referred to a "higher power" are they really mentioning jesus a lot? i also wonder if it has to do with which chapter you belong to as well. maybe one of the jesusy ones could point your friend to a nearby chapter that isn't so pointedly christian?
I never heard any mention of Jesus in any meeting I attended. In fact, some people who did use G-d (meaning a traditional Judeo-Christian deity) would often qualify that as "my higher power who I chose to call G-d" meaning there was always an understanding that that did not apply to everyone in OA.

The preamble read before each meeting always states the group's only purpose is to help those suffering from compulsive eating.

As for age, I never saw anyone younger than late teens at the groups, but I think it would be an individual choice at that age, hopefully discussed with parents or a therapist or school nurse as to whether that was the appropriate venue to get help.
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Old 11-18-2009, 07:54 AM   #34
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Actually, this reminds me of something. Do you think that there is an age where you are too young for groups like this? This is a bit off subject but i had a friend and her mum took her to hypnosis for OE when she was really young (i think she said in her early teens) -She rembers the guy basically saying 'fat is bad' and stuff like that.. so actually, it made her self image worse as well as her disordered eating. I know there is a huge difference between some bastard hyptotist and support groups.. but i wonder if there is any point/reason they might do more harm than good, or if there should be an age limit to attendance??
My mom and her friend took me for my first time when I was about 9. It was traumatic in that after the meeting my mom and her friend did nothing but trash talk the people who were there. It made me feel isolated and encouraged sneak eating which I did all throughout life until I got married.

I think kids are too young to understand and wouldn't recommend it for anyone under 15ish depending on the maturity of the child.
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Old 11-18-2009, 07:57 AM   #35
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I do not have a sponsor, as I feel the meetings are enough for me. I do not want to be calling somebody at all hours of the day and night. That is not me.
You can still work the program and do what works for you.
Yeah, you're right. I have thought about going back because I did like the feeling that I wasn't alone. I found a lot of comfort in knowing the skinny woman sat next to me had the same exact issue just manifested differently and we accepted each other as we are.
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Old 11-18-2009, 08:04 AM   #36
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My mom and her friend took me for my first time when I was about 9. It was traumatic in that after the meeting my mom and her friend did nothing but trash talk the people who were there. It made me feel isolated and encouraged sneak eating which I did all throughout life until I got married.

I think kids are too young to understand and wouldn't recommend it for anyone under 15ish depending on the maturity of the child.
Yes I agree. Something of this nature is a personal and private thing. Fundamentally a child should not go to things like this unsupervised which defeats the purpose of how and why OA works. You would need to have an OA type thing specifically designed for kids that is supervised by a licensed adult with some sort of certification to work with children or some such thing. Sending a kid unsupervised into a loose group filled with G-d knows who -- no, I wouldn't. Some adults wouldn't even feel comfortable going to a meeting like that where there is a child present.
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Old 11-18-2009, 01:50 PM   #37
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i'm glad the mods re-opened this too. i'm really proud of them for rethinking everything. i don't think having control of your mental well being and your eating necessarily means you want to be thin. and maybe this is a sign that every little thing about weight loss won't seem so threatening to the community anymore. the fear of weight loss talk makes it kind of look like nobody really wants to be fat or enjoys how they are and will take any chance they can to "escape" thier predicament. i think it shows a real maturing of the mind set around here and i hope it continues. its wonderful for people to be able to take control of thier lives and be fat by choice instead of fat because they feel helpless to be otherwise. its hard for anyone to be happy with thier size with a monkey on thier back. and even though sometimes all of us look for an escape from the weight loss talk that seems to be everywhere these days its good for people to have the freedom to talk about it in a venue that isn't fat phobic but pro mental and physical health and where people understand the meaning of HAAS.

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Old 11-18-2009, 02:13 PM   #38
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Our local O.A. is very Christian. I've had those people hand me literature as I've waited for the bus. My feelings have always been..

Jesus didn't make me fat, why would he make me thin?

Last edited by Tina; 11-18-2009 at 04:12 PM. Reason: No diet or weighloss talk. This thread is for EDs and food issues, not weightloss or diets.
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Old 11-18-2009, 02:14 PM   #39
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Actually, this reminds me of something. Do you think that there is an age where you are too young for groups like this? This is a bit off subject but i had a friend and her mum took her to hypnosis for OE when she was really young (i think she said in her early teens) -She rembers the guy basically saying 'fat is bad' and stuff like that.. so actually, it made her self image worse as well as her disordered eating. I know there is a huge difference between some bastard hyptotist and support groups.. but i wonder if there is any point/reason they might do more harm than good, or if there should be an age limit to attendance??
I do think i was a little young to hear some of the "scary" grown up issues. It also was a comfort in a way knowing that i wasn't the only one with a horrible relationship with food. It also made me realize, for the first time, that i wasn't a total horrible person for being fat. My mom stopped taking me after a few meetings, maybe because of my tender age. She was really involved with it for a couple of years. She was also in one of those meetings that are for people with family members in addiction.
I think that an older kid might benefit from a meeting if they're seeking help. I was a very young 12 and it might have been a little too mature for me.
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Old 11-18-2009, 02:38 PM   #40
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Our local O.A. is very Christian. I've had those people hand me literature as I've waited for the bus. My feelings have always been..

Jesus didn't make me fat, why would he make me thin?

I did it myself, I need to do it on my own, well, with the help of friends. I won't pray for Him to take it away.
That's an interesting point, and one that I struggled with when I joined Al-Anon. I felt that the "problem" wasn't with me ... it was with the family member who couldn't stop drinking and was making our lives, including his own, a hell on earth. I also believed that any responsibility that I had was squarely on MY shoulders, and ... success or failure ... it's all me.

But that's not really what acknowledging a higher power is all about. It's more about realizing that, when you come to the point of needing some kind of intervention (including 12-step programs) you haven't always made the best decisions. They are, in fact, part and parcel of what led the course of our lives off track. That's a very humbling thing to have to acknowledge -- i.e., I can't trust myself to always make the best decisions for myself or others. It's also rather freeing, in its own way. It doesn't negate responsibility, at all. I'm just affirming that I need something MORE than my own judgment in order to turn my life around.

For me, it looked something like this: I cannot change/control or alter the course of anyone's life but my own. Those who have been through similar situations (reference to my higher power) have found that they cannot allow themselves to be co-dependent any longer. I may not be able to keep my loved one from drinking, but I can make sure that he faces the consequences of those actions, and fully. I acknowledge that my own baggage and my own fear has stood in the way of making any kind of real progress with this family member. I've blamed him for decisions that I've made -- when in fact, I chose to allow him to bring harm to me and my family because the alternative seemed worse to me. The alternative meant letting go. I've been arrogant enough to believe that I could save him, and I basked in the praise that I received from other family members for being "saintly" enough to do so.

A footnote: He died last year. He'd been sober for 6+ months, but he chose to drink, and had an accident that may not have taken his life, had he been sober at the time. Had it not been for the life-changing, life-SAVING strategies and coping mechanisms that I learned in Al-Anon, I would have torn myself apart with grief and regret and the "would have, could have, should have's".

I know that this is off-tangent to OA itself, but I felt that it was important to discuss the "higher power" concept of the 12-step program. OA's will look very similar to Al-Anon in terms of hower these steps are implemented.
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Old 11-18-2009, 04:16 PM   #41
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i'm glad the mods re-opened this too. i'm really proud of them for rethinking everything. i don't think having control of your mental well being and your eating necessarily means you want to be thin. and maybe this is a sign that every little thing about weight loss won't seem so threatening to the community anymore. the fear of weight loss talk makes it kind of look like nobody really wants to be fat or enjoys how they are and will take any chance they can to "escape" thier predicament. i think it shows a real maturing of the mind set around here and i hope it continues. its wonderful for people to be able to take control of thier lives and be fat by choice instead of fat because they feel helpless to be otherwise. its hard for anyone to be happy with thier size with a monkey on thier back. and even though sometimes all of us look for an escape from the weight loss talk that seems to be everywhere these days its good for people to have the freedom to talk about it in a venue that isn't fat phobic but pro mental and physical health and where people understand the meaning of HAAS.
Hi there Ms. Odalisque. I have to correct something here though. This thread is not for weight loss talk nor diet talk. It's really about eating issues such as Eating Disorders (EDs) and OA and/or other 12-step types of groups which deal with disordered eating and not weight loss. Sorry to disappoint, but I don't think Dimensions will ever allow diet talk. Now, on the health board, you can find healthy eating recipes and threads about healthy eating, I believe, but not about diets. I don't see that ever changing.
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Old 11-18-2009, 04:31 PM   #42
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Hi there Ms. Odalisque. I have to correct something here though. This thread is not for weight loss talk nor diet talk. It's really about eating issues such as Eating Disorders (EDs) and OA and/or other 12-step types of groups which deal with disordered eating and not weight loss. Sorry to disappoint, but I don't think Dimensions will ever allow diet talk. Now, on the health board, you can find healthy eating recipes and threads about healthy eating, I believe, but not about diets. I don't see that ever changing.
Is this honest though?
I don't belive in diets but i'm not sure why discussing weightloss as part of something else should be problematic.
I think if people can stop Compulsive eating, then 'weight loss' will be a possible ..erm side effect?
In many cases the women here think this is a welcome part of overcoming this particular addiction, especially if they have weight related problems or if losing weight (even some weight) makes their lives somehow better.
Surely this is better discussed in a fat friendly place ..where people dont feel pressured to be a specific bmi.. but to lose weight on their terms, if they want.. i know a lot of women here have lost weight.. why the taboo?
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Old 11-18-2009, 05:25 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Tina View Post
Hi there Ms. Odalisque. I have to correct something here though. This thread is not for weight loss talk nor diet talk. It's really about eating issues such as Eating Disorders (EDs) and OA and/or other 12-step types of groups which deal with disordered eating and not weight loss. Sorry to disappoint, but I don't think Dimensions will ever allow diet talk. Now, on the health board, you can find healthy eating recipes and threads about healthy eating, I believe, but not about diets. I don't see that ever changing.
thanks for correcting me. what a shame though that we don't feel strong enough yet that its still seen as some kind of threat. oh well, maybe someday the community will actually have the confidence*sigh*. but to be truthful i wasn't talking about cosmetic weight loss that predisposes that something is wrong with what fat looks like, just control over disorders and health issues. i think those are two entirely different things and should be approached as such. it would go a long way to breech the gap between people here who feel fetish etc... has to result in death and the fetish is more important to many who indulge in such fetishes than a woman's quest for a good and fulfilling life that may or may not require some weight loss depending on the person.

if people knew that others valued their health, both physical and emotional, above fantasy then maybe there wouldn't be so much demonizing of feederism and gaining here. i think the tensions between the two groups is a direct result of people feeling that thier fight for life is less important than someone's good time. the way things are managed seem to underscore that. it would be nice to prove that the two can exist together and for the best when everyone's needs are considered and no one feels victimized. the people i really feel sorry for are the many feeders and gainers i know who would never want to endanger someone's life or happiness whether it be through thier mental or physical health but get lumped in that group because of what i consider to be some misleading rules that don't even represent how many of them think and often leave the impression that they are callus in that respect. i worry that the way things are now seems makes people into monsters who aren't. i'm pretty sure that most people i know don't enjoy the idea of seeing people they love and care about suffer. most of them are truly happy if we can manage the things that make our lives complete and they understand it doesn't mean we have to be thin to do so. i just wonder when the the official parts of dims will catch up to that idea. i mean its pretty old school to think what with the exposure a lot of people have had to the realities of fat that they would feel otherwise. and for the ones who are really disconnected and don't care about another person's happiness--well its sad to think dims would worry more about protecting people like that.

aside: my respectful advice is that sometimes a problem can be created when there really isn't one. and, as for your not ever seeing that changing--well people don't always foresee progress. 5 yrs ago no one would have ever predicted the possibility of an african american president. tg some things change for the better. hopefully open minds will always prevail.

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Old 11-18-2009, 06:05 PM   #44
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I attend only one meeting a week. I also do not have a sponsor.

You work the twelve steps and the program, the way that works for you.
I read the literature, and I also do the work in my workbook that I have.

Some people feel they need a sponsor, some do not.

You can also attend online meetings from the privacy and comfort of your own home.

I live in a rural area so I have the meeting in my own home.

Do not be distracted by other people C.

One of the hallmarks of OA is to take the message of OA to people who are still suffering from compulsive eating. So that woman in all her annoyance, was not doing that.

I think you are beautiful and a champ meanwhile.

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Old 11-18-2009, 10:44 PM   #45
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I do understand. The thing is, though, we cannot have broader rules here than on the rest of the boards. The difference is that here we are discussing the issue of OA and EDs in a protected forum. I do know what some of you are saying, and have my own take on weight-loss for health reasons, but we need to stay within the guidelines of the rest of the boards, so weight-loss and diets are not up for discussion. You can see the policy that Conrad set down for the Health Forum here, and that is what we will be following. It's the best we can do within the confines of the rules.

Any posts that have been edited or deleted have been done so in order to stay within the rules of no diet or weight-loss talk. Please respect them so we can keep this thread going.
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Old 11-18-2009, 11:18 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by butch View Post
I will say that weekly individual therapy was a huge help in my ability to deal with a lot of these issues (well, all my issues , not just the food ones). If others reading this would be willing to speak about other places/people that they've interacted with in order to address their relationship with food, that would be helpful, I think.

It was gratifying to learn to put food in perspective, as over the years I had a love/hate relationship with it. At the height of my anxiety, I was quite food obsessed in both directions either too much food or not enough. To have given myself permission to enjoy food felt like serious rebellion. Once I said I could eat anything at anytime and as much as I wanted, the food obession lifted. I eat what I want, I love food and my weight has stabilized. I do not feel powerless around food, and I thought that OA premise was difficult to accept. I have no intention of ever dieting since dieting made me crazy. So much time and creativity was wasted on thinking about food. I eat when I am hungry and as much as I want. There is no good food or bad food, if I want ice cream for dinner that is what I eat.
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Old 11-19-2009, 06:24 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by mergirl View Post
Is this honest though?
I don't belive in diets but i'm not sure why discussing weightloss as part of something else should be problematic.
I think if people can stop Compulsive eating, then 'weight loss' will be a possible ..erm side effect?
In many cases the women here think this is a welcome part of overcoming this particular addiction, especially if they have weight related problems or if losing weight (even some weight) makes their lives somehow better.
Surely this is better discussed in a fat friendly place ..where people dont feel pressured to be a specific bmi.. but to lose weight on their terms, if they want.. i know a lot of women here have lost weight.. why the taboo?
I get what you're saying, mer, but this is how I see it:

Focusing on weight loss, and not the healthy behaviors that may cause weight loss, is the concern. That is what HAES is all about. It isn't about "you must stay fat at all costs, just eat more veggies and walk around the block," its "let's focus on improving health and total well being in the individual not by shaming them into thinking part of their body is bad and must be removed, but by keying in on eating, moving, thinking, and treating in a way that makes the individual feel worthwhile and valued as they are, regardless of the size of their waist." That can, and does, result in weight loss in some people, but the focus, the goal, the praised part, isn't the weight loss, but the improved health.

For me personally, my aversion to diet talk isn't about it being triggering for me. I feel nothing when folks talk about dieting, as I don't have a history of failed diets in my past (I have maybe a history of a handful of failed diets in my lifetime), and irl if people I know are losing weight, I don't give them grief for it. Your body, your choice, right? However, those of us invested in a more politicized version of SA see diet and weight loss talk as being a talk about eradication of fat people, and not a language of care, compassion, and help for fat people.

I know that can be debated, and in non public gatherings, I'm fine with folks talking about weight loss and whatnot. But this is a public place with a comitment to SA, and if for no other reason, I think Dims should continue to honor the creed of many fat rights groups past and present and object to diet talk and weight loss talk so we can shift the focus in the health care system to one that cares about the fat person's health without thinking they'll be 'fine' if they just dropped a few.

Yesterday someone told me about a relative who died of a tumor because every time they went to the doctor to complain about symptoms, the doctor passed it off as being because they were fat, and told them to lose weight. That is horrific to me, and as long as weight loss talk out in the rest of the world allows doctors to feel they are doing their job if they behave this way, then I'm for no diet talk in SA circles, even if it seems like we're being fearful and reactionary.
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Old 11-19-2009, 06:30 AM   #48
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I really should not have gone to OA. What I needed were some sessions with a nutritionist to straighten me out. Being the seventh child in a family of eight and the only one who was fat my diet was strictly monitored and restricted. I binged a lot because I was littereally STARVING. This resulted in a lifestyle of disordered eating based upon bad habits and misconceptions about proper nutrition instilled in me as a child. There were also complications associated with my time at OA. While in meetings I would be particularly struck by some of the stories told at OA for reasons I couldn't understand untill later on they bloomed radically in my sexual fantasies. This really confused and horrified me at the same time but it never materialized in to anything behavioral so it was easy to ignore it once it was over. But I was scared shitless that I was going to turn in to one of those people at the meetings. It really messed me up. OA was not the place I should have been told to go and I think my presence there was unfair to the people who really needed it. Just my opinion. There seems to be this widespread ignorance as to what OA is and what it isn't.

I hate to speak on behalf of anything based solely on my own experiences. I'm aware that every OA meeting is going to be somewhat different by location but I would say in general that OA is not the place to go if you are dieting and trying to lose weight and in need of support. OA is for disordered eating that goes beyond just the tired cycle of feast and famine induced by botched attempts at weight loss. I was young when I went and I thought the people in OA were crazy I was so blown away. I couldn't relate to any of them and I was the second fattest person in the room. Most of them weren't fat at all. I should NOT have been there. (I thought maybe my mother should go to be honest) As I've read this thread I've wondered if the hardline approach by some of the leaders of the OA meetings towards some of the people who've inquired was done deliberately in order to deter tourists and curious seekers away who didn't belong there.

OA has nothing at all to do with fat or the need for some pie every now and then. This is serious shit here but thank goodness it exists. It's EXCELLENT for anyone who really needs it regardless of belief and I feel that anyone who wants and need to go to OA should be supported in the highest order. I would highly recommend it but it's not for dieters who keep falling off the wagon. I'm also glad this thread has stayed open. I think it is important for the community to support people in need of the kind of help that OA offers. If you really feel you need to go to OA then you should go despite the scary tone you get from the organizer. You can still call the shots, but please don't go to OA just because you want to lose weight. There are other really great places to choose from but OA isn't one of them.
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Old 11-19-2009, 09:44 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by butch View Post
I get what you're saying, mer, but this is how I see it:

Focusing on weight loss, and not the healthy behaviors that may cause weight loss, is the concern. That is what HAES is all about. It isn't about "you must stay fat at all costs, just eat more veggies and walk around the block," its "let's focus on improving health and total well being in the individual not by shaming them into thinking part of their body is bad and must be removed, but by keying in on eating, moving, thinking, and treating in a way that makes the individual feel worthwhile and valued as they are, regardless of the size of their waist." That can, and does, result in weight loss in some people, but the focus, the goal, the praised part, isn't the weight loss, but the improved health.

For me personally, my aversion to diet talk isn't about it being triggering for me. I feel nothing when folks talk about dieting, as I don't have a history of failed diets in my past (I have maybe a history of a handful of failed diets in my lifetime), and irl if people I know are losing weight, I don't give them grief for it. Your body, your choice, right? However, those of us invested in a more politicized version of SA see diet and weight loss talk as being a talk about eradication of fat people, and not a language of care, compassion, and help for fat people.

I know that can be debated, and in non public gatherings, I'm fine with folks talking about weight loss and whatnot. But this is a public place with a comitment to SA, and if for no other reason, I think Dims should continue to honor the creed of many fat rights groups past and present and object to diet talk and weight loss talk so we can shift the focus in the health care system to one that cares about the fat person's health without thinking they'll be 'fine' if they just dropped a few.

Yesterday someone told me about a relative who died of a tumor because every time they went to the doctor to complain about symptoms, the doctor passed it off as being because they were fat, and told them to lose weight. That is horrific to me, and as long as weight loss talk out in the rest of the world allows doctors to feel they are doing their job if they behave this way, then I'm for no diet talk in SA circles, even if it seems like we're being fearful and reactionary.
I'm sorry to hear about the person who died because their doctor was incompetent. Not all Doctors are like that but for the ones who are there must be legislation put in place to stop them. Do you know of any fat rights groups who are looking into trying to change legislation for the medical examination of fat people? ie. that Gps are not allowed to assume that the problem has anything to do with weight. I don't really know much about law or as much as i feel i should about fat studies, including rights and legislation. You hear about fat people on here a lot who have had horrible experiences with their doctors, it really seems now it is a human rights issue.
I do believe in a lot of cases of health at every size. Recently my partner went for tests including blood pressure, cholestorol levels etc.. and everything came back normal.. when i was telling this to my mum.. when it got to the "Yeah all her tests were totally normal" she said "REALLY?" in a kinna shocked voice. It was almost incomprehensible to her that someone at over 20st could ever be 'healthy'. So, i would say that the Doctor in question may just be following suit as far as the perception of much of society are concerned.. I think this comes down to a lack of education, not anything to with the fact that "Weight loss talk is out in the world".
Many people do suffer different medical problems which 'are' weight related. I don't think hiding our heads in the sand over that issues is helping anyone. I think people talking about losing some weight to improve the quality of their lives is a far cry from trying to eradicate all fat people!!! You are talking politically, when many people just want to be able to share their subjective truths and not have to hide aspects of their 'fat' experience, just because it happens that they have has wls or have had to lose some weight.
I sometimes wonder if this place does have a commitment to size acceptance or whether it is actually fat acceptance. If it was the former, would the individual not have the right to decide what size they would like to be? (If they had that option) If they have this right why censor their experiences?
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Old 11-19-2009, 10:51 AM   #50
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Dimensions was originally created as part of the fat acceptance movement, so there you go. Others have termed it size acceptance, but originally? Fat acceptance, because particularly at that time, there was absolutely still no such thing. In many ways, there still is not. All one has to do is look around on the web at various other message boards to see that.

You might call it "hiding our heads in the sand," but it's really more of, "let's have a place where there is no diet talk -- at least one place on the net and in life."

Personally, if I want to talk about healthy eating here I can go to the Health board (though I haven't done much of that). And if I want to talk in depth about losing weight I go elsewhere, because I respect that this is not so much people being in denial as just wanting just one space where one won't wander into a discussion about losing weight, and I can respect that.
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