Global gun ban. Yay? Nay?

Mini · 05-14-2006, 09:27 PM

As some of you may know, there is an effort within the UN to pass a treaty that would, effectively (well, in theory), end civilian small arms ownership worldwide. It is to be finalized on the 4th of July this year during a summit in New York.

Just wonderin' where y'all stand on this one. Personally, I think Greedo shooting first has been trumped on the Bad Ideas Badly Implemented scale.

Thrifty McGriff · 05-14-2006, 10:46 PM

Ban human beings. Ah whos am I kidding. Im drnk rtugh tnow

Ericthonius · 05-14-2006, 10:55 PM

I believe it was the Terrible Saint Ted of the Shattered Motor-City Eardrum, who said,

If guns cause crime, then mine are defective.

...And there was much rejoicing...

JudgeDredd425 · 05-14-2006, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini

As some of you may know, there is an effort within the UN to pass a treaty that would, effectively (well, in theory), end civilian small arms ownership worldwide. It is to be finalized on the 4th of July this year during a summit in New York.

Just wonderin' where y'all stand on this one. Personally, I think Greedo shooting first has been trumped on the Bad Ideas Badly Implemented scale.

It will come as no surprise to anyone here that I would be against any gun grab for any reason. There are many very good sayings used in the gun owning community, and the most applicable one here I believe would be this:

"A man with a gun is a citizen, and a man without a gun is a subject."

All through out history the worst atrocities ever committed were done by governments and before they could do them, they had to disarm the people first.

1300 Class · 05-15-2006, 01:09 AM

This is the sort of pointless sentimental drivil that makes the UN a laughing stock.

BBW Betty · 05-15-2006, 04:32 AM

Guns themselves don't cause violence. They are a tool, which SOME people use for intimidation and violence.

Santaclear · 05-15-2006, 04:37 AM

*Fires warning shot into forum. Looks around.*

If all of you have guns then I'll need one too. But if you don't have one then I won't need one either.

Why should I trust you (or anyone) to use a gun "wisely"?

Jane · 05-15-2006, 04:59 AM

I'm upset that Mini left 2x4's off his poll. Pointy sticks are one thing, but a 2x4 is forever.

However, Oklahoma just passed something called the "Stand Your Ground" bill which says that anytime you feel threatened, you are allowed to fire at will. This does not just let you defend your home, but shoot in parking lots, etc.

TheSadeianLinguist · 05-15-2006, 06:26 AM

I don't have a problem with gun ownership, so long as the person doesn't have a history of shooting and killing more than a dozen people.

HappyFatChick · 05-15-2006, 06:38 AM

I used to hate guns. Now I think they're necessary.

People are getting creative with weapons. An illegal alien used his Mexican flagpole to stab a Santa Ana county employee in the chest during an illegal alien mob scene there. (Didn't see it on the news? Gee, what a surprise. NOT!)

LarryTheShiveringChipmunk · 05-15-2006, 08:56 AM

I think its stupid. The UN is a worthless organization in many realms, and we can add this to the tally. It would go against the US Constitution so of course the US would not suppor this, but on a practical matter, think: those who want guns (i.e. criminals) will still get them on a black market, and us law abiding citizens (I'm assuming all of us here are law abiding and citizens) cannot protect ourselves.

Besides what would we do if aliens or Stewiepusses attacked?

BLUEeyedBanshee · 05-15-2006, 08:59 AM

That is the stupidest thing I've seen come out of a UN agenda in a long time.

I am all for gun ownership, responsible, legal gun ownership.

RedHead · 05-15-2006, 09:08 AM

I cannot believe that anyone would think that banning guns is a good thing!

Guns are readily available to all people whether they are good or bad....unfortunately you can make a gun out of scraps and you can buy one on the blackmarket even easier. So then the only people who would have them are the criminals (???)

I have never seen my gun attack anyone....perhaps I've just not trained them correctly.

EtobicokeFA · 05-15-2006, 04:18 PM

Remember that the question is not to ban all guns, but to ban small guns like a handguns.

The question is if we should allow everyone to have access to anything that counts as a firearm?

1300 Class · 05-15-2006, 04:39 PM

The UN is about solving conflicts, international peace etc. Not this sort of thing.

Mini · 05-15-2006, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EtobicokeFA

Remember that the question is not to ban all guns, but to ban small guns like a handguns.

The question is if we should allow everyone to have access to anything that counts as a firearm?

It's to ban "small arms," meaning, basically, any firearm we could legally acquire in the first place.

Also, criminals generally don't buy their firearms through legal channels in the first place. Logically, a ban on firearms would only harm and hinder law-abiding citizens.

Don't like it? Go to England. It's got one of the worst violent crime rates in the first world for this exact reason.

EtobicokeFA · 05-15-2006, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini

It's to ban "small arms," meaning, basically, any firearm we could legally acquire in the first place.

Also, criminals generally don't buy their firearms through legal channels in the first place. Logically, a ban on firearms would only harm and hinder law-abiding citizens.

Don't like it? Go to England. It's got one of the worst violent crime rates in the first world for this exact reason.

I would like to know where you get there numbers.

Here in Canada, most of the guns we sell hunting and a few types of handguns. Mostly just at sporting good shops. Nothing automatic, nothing armour piercing and none for this finger print proof stuff, and we enjoy a lower crime rate that most US cities.

JudgeDredd425 · 05-15-2006, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EtobicokeFA

Remember that the question is not to ban all guns, but to ban small guns like a handguns.

The question is if we should allow everyone to have access to anything that counts as a firearm?

No, the goal is to eliminate all private gun ownership. A ban on handguns is merely a stepping stone. This tactic has been used before successfully which is why the UN is trying to do this now. The people of Britain can easily speak to this point.

And yes, everyone honest citizen should have a weapon if they decide that they want/need one.

Seth Warren · 05-16-2006, 02:04 PM

Guns don't kill people... bullets ripping through the flesh and causing massive internal bleeding kills people...

haha

The way I see the whole second Amendment is like this: the whole well-regulated militia thing kind of became obsolete once nuclear weapons were invented. What is one to do now? Make dirty bombs to rise up against a corrupt government?

However, I support a person's right to own a gun, even though I myself have no desire to. "But why," you may ask, "I though you were some pussy pinko liberal who hated everything American!"

Yeah, well, there's that whole "pursuit of happiness" thing. If going down to the shooting range and firing off a few rounds puts a grin on your face, who the hell am I to tell you that you can't do it? Go forth, set your sites and have a blast. If killing your own meat is your deal, then make sure the game is in season, you're positive that you're actually shooting a deer and fire away!

What I do think is that some sanity should be applied when it comes to gun ownership. Gun owners should be licensed, like cars, since this is something that is very powerful and has the potential to kill. There should be required training and an emphasis on safety. Furthermore, I'd place a ban on concealed weapons (I'm sure Ohioan JudgeDredd will have a reply to this, but doesn't he always?), as tempers tend to cause a loss of logic. I don't buy the argument that having everyone own a gun reduces crime, but I also don't believe that merely owning a gun will turn someone into a psychopath either.

LarryTheShiveringChipmunk · 05-16-2006, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seth Warren

Guns don't kill people... bullets ripping through the flesh and causing massive internal bleeding kills people...

haha

The way I see the whole second Amendment is like this: the whole well-regulated militia thing kind of became obsolete once nuclear weapons were invented. What is one to do now? Make dirty bombs to rise up against a corrupt government?

However, I support a person's right to own a gun, even though I myself have no desire to. "But why," you may ask, "I though you were some pussy pinko liberal who hated everything American!"

Yeah, well, there's that whole "pursuit of happiness" thing. If going down to the shooting range and firing off a few rounds puts a grin on your face, who the hell am I to tell you that you can't do it? Go forth, set your sites and have a blast. If killing your own meat is your deal, then make sure the game is in season, you're positive that you're actually shooting a deer and fire away!

What I do think is that some sanity should be applied when it comes to gun ownership. Gun owners should be licensed, like cars, since this is something that is very powerful and has the potential to kill. There should be required training and an emphasis on safety. Furthermore, I'd place a ban on concealed weapons (I'm sure Ohioan JudgeDredd will have a reply to this, but doesn't he always?), as tempers tend to cause a loss of logic. I don't buy the argument that having everyone own a gun reduces crime, but I also don't believe that merely owning a gun will turn someone into a psychopath either.

excellent response pinko. (:

*chippy has found his VP candidate*

BBW Betty · 05-16-2006, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LarryTheShiveringChipmunk

excellent response pinko. (:

I'll go along with that. Seth, it was a very well-thought out, common sense response.

JudgeDredd425 · 05-16-2006, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seth Warren

Guns don't kill people... bullets ripping through the flesh and causing massive internal bleeding kills people...

haha

The way I see the whole second Amendment is like this: the whole well-regulated militia thing kind of became obsolete once nuclear weapons were invented. What is one to do now? Make dirty bombs to rise up against a corrupt government?

However, I support a person's right to own a gun, even though I myself have no desire to. "But why," you may ask, "I though you were some pussy pinko liberal who hated everything American!"

Yeah, well, there's that whole "pursuit of happiness" thing. If going down to the shooting range and firing off a few rounds puts a grin on your face, who the hell am I to tell you that you can't do it? Go forth, set your sites and have a blast. If killing your own meat is your deal, then make sure the game is in season, you're positive that you're actually shooting a deer and fire away!

What I do think is that some sanity should be applied when it comes to gun ownership. Gun owners should be licensed, like cars, since this is something that is very powerful and has the potential to kill. There should be required training and an emphasis on safety. Furthermore, I'd place a ban on concealed weapons (I'm sure Ohioan JudgeDredd will have a reply to this, but doesn't he always?), as tempers tend to cause a loss of logic. I don't buy the argument that having everyone own a gun reduces crime, but I also don't believe that merely owning a gun will turn someone into a psychopath either.

I don't agree with some of your points here, but I am surprised by what is at least a partial pro-gun response. If you want, I'll be happy to elaborate, or I can just let this sleeping dog lie.

JudgeDredd425 · 05-16-2006, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jane

I'm upset that Mini left 2x4's off his poll. Pointy sticks are one thing, but a 2x4 is forever.

However, Oklahoma just passed something called the "Stand Your Ground" bill which says that anytime you feel threatened, you are allowed to fire at will. This does not just let you defend your home, but shoot in parking lots, etc.

I'm not quite sure from your post whether or not you dislike the new Oklahoma law, but I will for one say that it is good law and a step back in the right direction.

For a long time and in many places there was bad law on the books created by anti-gun and anti-self defense nuts that required an honest citizen to retreat in the face of criminal attack no matter where you were, even in your own home facing a deadly threat, legally allowing the citizen to only respond in kind if they had tried to get away and/or had no place to go.

"Stand Your Ground" fixes that problem. If a criminal attempts to rob you outside your home or car jack you, why should you be put at further disadvantage by the law? This in no way legalizes poor choices or criminal level negligence if you don't respond to a given situation properly, but it does mean that if you face a real deadly criminal threat and properly neutralize it with deadly force you as an honest citizen will not be prosecuted for defending yourself, or others as the case may be.

Santaclear · 05-16-2006, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyFatChick

I used to hate guns. Now I think they're necessary.

People are getting creative with weapons. An illegal alien used his Mexican flagpole to stab a Santa Ana county employee in the chest during an illegal alien mob scene there. (Didn't see it on the news? Gee, what a surprise. NOT!)

Better bring your guns to Heaven, HFC, you'll need them. Plenty of illegal aliens there trying to poach.

missaf · 05-16-2006, 05:51 PM

The UN is trying to become Socialist Big Brother and establish itself as a World Government, not a treaty organization. *yawn*

View Poll Results: Do you support a worldwide ban on civilian ownership of small arms?
Yes - Guns cause violence.	4	11.11%
No - From my cold, dead hands, hippy.	25	69.44%
Maybe - Are we still allowed to own pointy sticks?	7	19.44%
Voters: 36. You may not vote on this poll

05-14-2006, 09:27 PM	#1
Mini Right, not nice Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Ontario Posts: 5,004	Global gun ban. Yay? Nay? As some of you may know, there is an effort within the UN to pass a treaty that would, effectively (well, in theory), end civilian small arms ownership worldwide. It is to be finalized on the 4th of July this year during a summit in New York. Just wonderin' where y'all stand on this one. Personally, I think Greedo shooting first has been trumped on the Bad Ideas Badly Implemented scale. __________________ I'd follow you to the end of the earth, if only to push you off.

05-14-2006, 10:55 PM	#3
Ericthonius Unrepentant Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Aldebaran Posts: 766	I believe it was the Terrible Saint Ted of the Shattered Motor-City Eardrum, who said, If guns cause crime, then mine are defective. ...And there was much rejoicing... __________________ "He who is unable to live in society, or who has no need because he is sufficient for himself, must be either a Beast or a God." - Aristotle.

05-15-2006, 04:37 AM	#7
Santaclear User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: North America Posts: 9,636	Fires warning shot into forum. Looks around. If all of you have guns then I'll need one too. But if you don't have one then I won't need one either. Why should I trust you (or anyone) to use a gun "wisely"? __________________ Last edited by Santaclear : 05-15-2006 at 04:43 AM.

05-15-2006, 04:59 AM	#8
Jane Photo (c) Fatlane Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Tangled up in Blue Posts: 9,186	I'm upset that Mini left 2x4's off his poll. Pointy sticks are one thing, but a 2x4 is forever. However, Oklahoma just passed something called the "Stand Your Ground" bill which says that anytime you feel threatened, you are allowed to fire at will. This does not just let you defend your home, but shoot in parking lots, etc. __________________ "A nation of sheep will beget a government of wolves." ~ Edward R. Murrow Last edited by Jane : 05-15-2006 at 05:01 AM.

05-14-2006, 10:46 PM	#2
Thrifty McGriff Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 582	Ban human beings. Ah whos am I kidding. Im drnk rtugh tnow

05-15-2006, 01:09 AM	#5
1300 Class Smug Annoying Centrist Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 5,946	This is the sort of pointless sentimental drivil that makes the UN a laughing stock.

05-15-2006, 04:32 AM	#6
BBW Betty Made My Saving Throw Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 3,700	Guns themselves don't cause violence. They are a tool, which SOME people use for intimidation and violence.

05-15-2006, 06:26 AM	#9
TheSadeianLinguist Coin-Operated Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Planet of the Mad Robots Posts: 7,643	I don't have a problem with gun ownership, so long as the person doesn't have a history of shooting and killing more than a dozen people. __________________ The Queen Bee on the Outsider: She didn't have the right brand of lip gloss. SHE HAD TO BE DESTROYED.

05-15-2006, 06:38 AM	#10
HappyFatChick On Timeout Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 2,589	I used to hate guns. Now I think they're necessary. People are getting creative with weapons. An illegal alien used his Mexican flagpole to stab a Santa Ana county employee in the chest during an illegal alien mob scene there. (Didn't see it on the news? Gee, what a surprise. NOT!)

05-15-2006, 08:56 AM	#11
LarryTheShiveringChipmunk has left dims Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,139	I think its stupid. The UN is a worthless organization in many realms, and we can add this to the tally. It would go against the US Constitution so of course the US would not suppor this, but on a practical matter, think: those who want guns (i.e. criminals) will still get them on a black market, and us law abiding citizens (I'm assuming all of us here are law abiding and citizens) cannot protect ourselves. Besides what would we do if aliens or Stewiepusses attacked?

05-15-2006, 08:59 AM	#12
BLUEeyedBanshee Ministry of Truth Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: US Posts: 3,307	Usually don't do this but.. That is the stupidest thing I've seen come out of a UN agenda in a long time. I am all for gun ownership, responsible, legal gun ownership. __________________ Don't bail; the best pieces of gold are at the bottom of the barrel of crap. - Randy Pausch

05-15-2006, 09:08 AM	#13
RedHead Tom Selleck's Bride Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Land of the Midnight Sun Posts: 1,868	I cannot believe that anyone would think that banning guns is a good thing! Guns are readily available to all people whether they are good or bad....unfortunately you can make a gun out of scraps and you can buy one on the blackmarket even easier. So then the only people who would have them are the criminals (???) I have never seen my gun attack anyone....perhaps I've just not trained them correctly. __________________ RedHeaded Snowmachine Chick "Yawn and the world yawns with you. Snore and you sleep alone." Anonymous

05-15-2006, 04:18 PM	#14
EtobicokeFA Proud FA Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: New England Posts: 3,508	Remember that the question is not to ban all guns, but to ban small guns like a handguns. The question is if we should allow everyone to have access to anything that counts as a firearm? __________________ "When it comes to health. It's not the size of your ass that count as much as how much you move it!" "Health is not a body weight, it's a measure of fitness."

05-15-2006, 04:39 PM	#15
1300 Class Smug Annoying Centrist Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 5,946	The UN is about solving conflicts, international peace etc. Not this sort of thing.

05-16-2006, 02:04 PM	#19
Seth Warren May she always be True Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 2,563	Guns don't kill people... bullets ripping through the flesh and causing massive internal bleeding kills people... haha The way I see the whole second Amendment is like this: the whole well-regulated militia thing kind of became obsolete once nuclear weapons were invented. What is one to do now? Make dirty bombs to rise up against a corrupt government? However, I support a person's right to own a gun, even though I myself have no desire to. "But why," you may ask, "I though you were some pussy pinko liberal who hated everything American!" Yeah, well, there's that whole "pursuit of happiness" thing. If going down to the shooting range and firing off a few rounds puts a grin on your face, who the hell am I to tell you that you can't do it? Go forth, set your sites and have a blast. If killing your own meat is your deal, then make sure the game is in season, you're positive that you're actually shooting a deer and fire away! What I do think is that some sanity should be applied when it comes to gun ownership. Gun owners should be licensed, like cars, since this is something that is very powerful and has the potential to kill. There should be required training and an emphasis on safety. Furthermore, I'd place a ban on concealed weapons (I'm sure Ohioan JudgeDredd will have a reply to this, but doesn't he always?), as tempers tend to cause a loss of logic. I don't buy the argument that having everyone own a gun reduces crime, but I also don't believe that merely owning a gun will turn someone into a psychopath either.

05-16-2006, 05:51 PM	#25
missaf Master Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 4,734	The UN is trying to become Socialist Big Brother and establish itself as a World Government, not a treaty organization. yawn

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