Dimensions Forums  
Home Register Premium Membership Health Issues Market Place Big Fashion

Go Back   Dimensions Forums > Archives > Hyde Park (Archive Only)



 
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-21-2011, 08:41 AM   #1
joswitch
Exile from Main Board
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,704
joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!
Default Ever wondered where all the marriage minded men are? They're on marriage strike!

Slightly old news: men are giving Marriage 2.0 the body-swerve in their droves. Somehow, they're just not convinced that it's worth it. Shocking.

http://wikibin.org/articles/marriage-strike.html

"
In Britain, the number of weddings in 2006 was the fewest since 1895, with the proportion of people getting married falling to the lowest level since 1862, when marriage records began.

Appearance in the Media
In 2002, 'National Marriage Project', published their annual report on the state of marriage in the United States, The State of /Our Unions. The 2002 report was subtitled: Why Men Won't Commit - Exploring Young Men's Attitudes About Sex, Dating and Marriage. This study broke new ground in investigating men's role in the equation of contemporary marriage.

The report found that young men were reluctant to marry. Ten main reasons for their reluctance to marry were cited. The first 3 reasons were:
* 'They can get sex without marriage'.
* They can enjoy "a wife" through cohabitation'.
* 'They want to avoid divorce and its financial risks'.

'Marriage Strike'
After the publication of the Rutgers report, columnist and radio broadcaster Glenn Sacks, and Dianna Thompson, the executive director of the American Coalition of Fathers and Children, published a July 5, 2002 article in the Philadelphia Enquirer, titled Have Anti-Father Family Court Policies Led to a Men's Marriage Strike?.Versions of this original article were then disseminated widely.

An excerpt from the Dianna Thompson and Glenn Sacks article:

'Kathleen is attractive, successful, witty, and educated. She also can't find a husband. Why? Because most of the men this thirty-something software analyst dates do not want to get married. These men have Peter Pan Syndrome--they refuse to commit, refuse to settle down, and refuse to "grow up"'.



'However, given the family court policies and divorce trends of today, Peter Pan is no naive boy, but instead a wise man.
"Why should I get married and have kids when I could lose those kids and most of what I've worked for at a moment's notice?" asks Dan, a 31 year-old power plant technician who says he will never marry. "I've seen it happen to many of my friends. I know guys who came home one day to an empty house or apartment--wife gone, kids gone. They never saw it coming. Some of them were never able to see their kids regularly again"'.



'The US marriage rate has dipped 40% over the past four decades, to its lowest point ever.
There are many plausible explanations for this trend, but one of the least mentioned is that American men, in the face of a family court system which is hopelessly stacked against them, have subconsciously launched a "marriage strike"'.



'"It's a shame," Dan says. "I always wanted to be a father and have a family. But unless the laws change and give fathers the same right to be a part of their children's lives as mothers have, it just isn't worth the risk"'.


Rutger's 2004 Marriage Report

In a 14 July 2004 article for Intellectual Conservative, retired professor of psychology and commentator Carey Roberts wrote a follow up article, this time on the findings of Rutgers University's 2004 The State of Our Unions report.

In his 2004 article, Carey Roberts stated:

'When almost one-quarter of single men in their prime courting years -- that’s two million potential husbands -- declare a Marriage Strike, we’re facing an unprecedented social crisis'.


'News of the Marriage Strike first began to settle into our national consciousness in 2002. That year, Barbara Dafoe Whitehead and David Popenoe of Rutgers University interviewed sixty men to probe their attitudes about marriage. And to their surprise, they discovered that some of these men were flat-out opposed to tying the knot. So this year, the Rutgers researchers decided to launch a full-scale national survey of single heterosexual men, ages 25-34. These men represent almost 10 million of the nation’s most eligible bachelors. The report was just released last month'.

'Among those men, 53% said they were not interested in getting married anytime soon -- the marriage delayers.
That figure alone is cause for concern. But this is the statistic that every American who wants to strengthen and protect marriage should be worried about: 22% of the men said they had absolutely no interest in finding their Truly Beloved. The report described these guys as “hardcore marriage avoiders.”

"

What's next? If men opt-out of marriage / kids within the Marriage 2.0 / Western / Anglosphere, what do you think the future holds?

Discuss.
__________________
...
joswitch is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 09:03 AM   #2
joswitch
Exile from Main Board
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,704
joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LalaCity View Post
Oh boy...here we go...AGAIN.

I have a suggestion, Joswitch: don't get married.
You win a teeeeeny, tiny prize for not only being a quick-off-the-mark first responder, but for entirely missing the point.
It's so small you can't see it, but you won it all the same!

It's not about me. I am just one dude.

20% of 10million is 2million guys.
Extrapolate to the whole of USA = approx 30million dudes who just don't want to marry.

Add in the 50% of "delayers" - that's another 5 / 10.
2 + 5 = 7million or 70% of the sample!
i.e. the vast majority!

What we are discussing here is:
Demographic Timebomb
and
Fundamental Change to Societal Structure.

^This.

And I'm posting it on DIMs cos I have read endless posts on here bemoaning that men don't want to get married.
Seems pretty relevant to me.


Quote:
Instead, become a divorce lawyer who specializes in child custody parity. And stop with these threads!
You don't like the thread, feel free not to post.
Thanks for (not) playing.
__________________
...
joswitch is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 09:31 AM   #3
Webmaster
Chief Emeritus
 
Webmaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Knoxville, TN area
Posts: 2
Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.
Default

TIME Magazine had a cover and cover article in their November 29, 2010 issue on marriage. It was entitled, "Who Needs Marriage" and the subtitle was "Men do, more than women. And it works better for richer than for poorer." Now I wish I had kept the issue for the statistics (the feature itself was somewhat unexceptional).

I think the topic of marriage lends itself to all sorts of stereotypes and generalizations (like many of the ones listed in the OP). Tabloids are endlessly fascinated with it (which, of course, means WE're endlessly fascinated with it, else we would not buy the tabloids). Marriage is a basic societal construct that is absurdly easy to get into, but quite costly to get out of. It's something that can feel confining if wrong, and endlessly fulfilling if right. In fact, given how crucially important marriage is in our lives and society, I am surprised that the subject is not taught in school. Then again, we're taught lots of stuff that is utterly useless to most, but hardly ever the basic life skills that all of us must have. There it's strictly find out for yourself, and sink or swim.
Webmaster is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 09:37 AM   #4
joswitch
Exile from Main Board
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,704
joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Webmaster View Post
TIME Magazine had a cover and cover article in their November 29, 2010 issue on marriage. It was entitled, "Who Needs Marriage" and the subtitle was "Men do, more than women. And it works better for richer than for poorer." Now I wish I had kept the issue for the statistics (the feature itself was somewhat unexceptional).

I think the topic of marriage lends itself to all sorts of stereotypes and generalizations (like many of the ones listed in the OP). Tabloids are endlessly fascinated with it (which, of course, means WE're endlessly fascinated with it, else we would not buy the tabloids). Marriage is a basic societal construct that is absurdly easy to get into, but quite costly to get out of. It's something that can feel confining if wrong, and endlessly fulfilling if right. In fact, given how crucially important marriage is in our lives and society, I am surprised that the subject is not taught in school. Then again, we're taught lots of stuff that is utterly useless to most, but hardly ever the basic life skills that all of us must have. There it's strictly find out for yourself, and sink or swim.
F'sure, the "who is it good for"? type questions have been done to death.

The real issue now is: tens of millions of men are choosing not to get married - this has fundamentally changed / continues to change the structure of society.

So, what're the consequences of that^.
And, what's next?
__________________
...
joswitch is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 10:04 AM   #5
Webmaster
Chief Emeritus
 
Webmaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Knoxville, TN area
Posts: 2
Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joswitch View Post
The real issue now is: tens of millions of men are choosing not to get married - this has fundamentally changed / continues to change the structure of society.

So, what're the consequences of that^.
And, what's next?
Hard to say. I think from a very big picture standpoint, marriage has always been seen and used both by political and religious leadership as a means of fostering stability and order. By favoring and more or less mandating the formation of family units, leadership is making its own task easier in delegating a good degree of supervision, policing and support from themselves down to the family level. That includes having families responsible for offspring and not the state, and families policing themselves rather than authorities.

What that means is that the marriage rate in a society is really a political variable that impacts numerous other societal variables (crime rate, social spending, productivity, overall economy, etc.). Which means that, almost certainly, some folks up there are giving this a lot of thought.
Webmaster is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 10:39 AM   #6
LalaCity
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,051
LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Webmaster View Post

What that means is that the marriage rate in a society is really a political variable that impacts numerous other societal variables (crime rate, social spending, productivity, overall economy, etc.).
Yes, thank you. The article posted by the OP is from 2002. We have no idea how, say, something like the great recession has affected attitudes since then.

A timely article on the state of our unions is something worthy of discussion. An eight-year-old article dredged up to justify the OP's anti-woman bias is not.
LalaCity is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 10:42 AM   #7
Webmaster
Chief Emeritus
 
Webmaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Knoxville, TN area
Posts: 2
Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LalaCity View Post
Yes, thank you. The article posted by the OP is from 2002. We have no idea how, say, something like the great recession has affected attitudes since then.

A timely article on the state of our unions is something worthy of discussion. An eight-year-old article dredged up to justify the OP's anti-woman bias is not.
Like I said, I wish I still had that TIME magazine as it cited a number of newer stats and such. Definitely an interesting issue, and one that doubtlessly affects our society.
Webmaster is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 10:56 AM   #8
LalaCity
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,051
LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!
Default

That's odd...my first post was scrubbed (though it's clearly viewable in Joswitch's response).

I'm curious to know what it is I said that constitutes a violation of the rules. It was an opinion...and a suggestion. Nothing more.
LalaCity is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 11:14 AM   #9
joswitch
Exile from Main Board
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,704
joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LalaCity View Post
Yes, thank you. The article posted by the OP is from 2002. We have no idea how, say, something like the great recession has affected attitudes since then.

A timely article on the state of our unions is something worthy of discussion. An eight-year-old article
By all means if you can find some more up-to-date stats on the state of marriage / the "marriage strike", especially with a similar 10million sample-size, do please post and link it.


Quote:
dredged up to justify the OP's anti-woman bias is not.
And let's leave your erroneous assumptions about me out of it, eh?
__________________
...
joswitch is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 12:20 PM   #10
LalaCity
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,051
LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joswitch View Post
...let's leave your erroneous assumptions about me out of it, eh?
I don't think it's erroneous, given the epic thread of not so long ago wherein you basically portrayed women as soul-slash-wallet-sucking vampires with no regard for social justice or the rights of men.

Hyde Park is a forum to discuss political and social issues, not a therapy forum for you to disgorge your commitment angst.

And, in case you take offense to my tone, it was your opening line, which snidely implied that all men, of course, would have terrible reservations about uniting their lives with members of the seemingly unstable and untrustworthy feminine gender -- *wink, wink, nudge, nudge* -- which set the rather nasty tone.

Don't presume we're too clueless to pick up on the inherent insult to women embedded in your words.
LalaCity is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 01:22 PM   #11
joswitch
Exile from Main Board
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,704
joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LalaCity View Post
I don't think it's erroneous, given the epic thread of not so long ago wherein you basically portrayed women as soul-slash-wallet-sucking vampires with no regard for social justice or the rights of men.
Nope. That's what you and others inferred from my raising issues of biassed laws.

Anyway, let's not drag one thread into another. Thanks.

Quote:
Hyde Park is a forum to discuss political and social issues,
Yes, it is. And millions of men choosing to opt out of marriage 2.0 is a big issue. Any chance of a constructive or even relevant post from you on the subject?

Quote:
*snipped for irrelevant blah*
__________________
...
joswitch is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 01:44 PM   #12
CastingPearls
Go Big Or Go Home
 
CastingPearls's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Possum Grape, AR
Posts: 15,178
CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.
Default

I'm of the belief that when you begin to see someone you're really interested in, you should be honest and tell them how you feel about marriage so they can then make an informed decision on whether or not to proceed with whatever it is you two have together.

I don't see anything wrong with a man not wanting to get married nor do I see anything wrong with a woman who doesn't want to get married as long as no one is being dishonest or in denial about their needs.

John, too many of your threads are used to justify your own viewpoints which, while no different from anyone else here, particularly this forum, is really disingenuous when you pull the 'no, not me, I'm just one guy with one opinion' card so often. No one is putting a gun to your head to marry so what do you care what anyone thinks of it?
__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]http://castingpearls-blowingbubbles.blogspot.com/

Free me, free yourself
A life of sacrifice controlled me
But those promises I made
No longer hold me
Mercurial more wayward by the hour
The shackles fall away I'm in your power



People throw rocks at things that shine.
CastingPearls is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 01:52 PM   #13
The Orange Mage
♓ Fishy Pisces! ♓
 
The Orange Mage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,282
The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!The Orange Mage keeps pushing the rep limit!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CastingPearls View Post
No one is putting a gun to your head to marry so what do you care what anyone thinks of it?
This is the internet. We don't know this. Unless it is known, but I don't know it so I don't know if I'm right here.

Holy shit I just channeled my inner Rummy. o_o

Maybe I'm just projecting, but maybe these posts are his way of speaking his ponderings, uncertainties, and doubts about a pressing issue in his life.

Either way, whatever. *shrugs*
The Orange Mage is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 01:55 PM   #14
Webmaster
Chief Emeritus
 
Webmaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Knoxville, TN area
Posts: 2
Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.Webmaster has ascended what used to be the highest level.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LalaCity View Post
That's odd...my first post was scrubbed (though it's clearly viewable in Joswitch's response).

I'm curious to know what it is I said that constitutes a violation of the rules. It was an opinion...and a suggestion. Nothing more.
I yanked a couple of posts because it is very tiresome to see every topic instantly devolve into personal squabbling. This is actually an interesting topic, and for once I'd like to see people present their views on it, rather than lecturing each other.
Webmaster is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 01:56 PM   #15
bigmac
 
bigmac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Redwood Coast
Posts: 10,366
bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!bigmac keeps pushing the rep limit!
Default

Marriage has been trumpeted as the cure for all societies woes. Maybe people are realizing that a walk down the aisle is not all its cracked up to be.

Also, marriage has traditionally been primarily an economic arrangement. Indeed its never not been an economic arrangement -- people just deluded themselves with a veneer of romance. With so many people who are no longer economically viable is it any wonder they're not marrying.
bigmac is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 01:57 PM   #16
CastingPearls
Go Big Or Go Home
 
CastingPearls's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Possum Grape, AR
Posts: 15,178
CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.CastingPearls has ascended what used to be the highest level.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Orange Mage View Post
This is the internet. We don't know this. Unless it is known, but I don't know it so I don't know if I'm right here.

Holy shit I just channeled my inner Rummy. o_o

Maybe I'm just projecting, but maybe these posts are his way of speaking his ponderings, uncertainties, and doubts about a pressing issue in his life.

Either way, whatever. *shrugs*
But he has stated many many MANY times that he's not interested in marriage so we DO actually know.

By the way, I'm not trying to censor his thoughts--he's entitled and takes full advantage of that entitlement. I'm saying how many times and ways can one keep saying the same thing over and over again. We get it. He doesn't want to get married and thinks it's horribly unfair especially to men. Got it.

*shrugs*
__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]http://castingpearls-blowingbubbles.blogspot.com/

Free me, free yourself
A life of sacrifice controlled me
But those promises I made
No longer hold me
Mercurial more wayward by the hour
The shackles fall away I'm in your power



People throw rocks at things that shine.
CastingPearls is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 02:09 PM   #17
LalaCity
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,051
LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Webmaster View Post
I yanked a couple of posts because it is very tiresome to see every topic instantly devolve into personal squabbling.
Do you honestly think that the OP had anything other than that in mind when he started this thread?

We've been down this road with him before. He has shown himself utterly unwilling to brook any opinion other than the one he presently holds -- i.e., women are out to screw men over through "entrapping" them in marriage.

Frankly, the way he has repeatedly introduced this topic to the board is just downright offensive to women. In other words, it's bullshit. And I'm calling him on it.
LalaCity is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 02:22 PM   #18
penguin
Fnord
 
penguin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Brisbane, Australia.
Posts: 5,249
penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joswitch View Post
'Among those men, 53% said they were not interested in getting married anytime soon -- the marriage delayers. That figure alone is cause for concern. But this is the statistic that every American who wants to strengthen and protect marriage should be worried about: 22% of the men said they had absolutely no interest in finding their Truly Beloved. The report described these guys as “hardcore marriage avoiders.”
What's to be concerned about? Unless this article and research was funded by folks in the wedding industry, I'm not getting it. So some people don't want to get married. Big deal. I'm sure there are plenty of women not interested in marriage soon or at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by joswitch View Post
'"It's a shame," Dan says. "I always wanted to be a father and have a family. But unless the laws change and give fathers the same right to be a part of their children's lives as mothers have, it just isn't worth the risk"'.
I really don't see what this has to do with a marriage strike. I'm pretty sure you don't need a piece of paper to get someone knocked up. You can have the kids and family without marriage these days, and you can have the same amount of drama in the family court about it too. American family law obviously differs greatly than Australian family law, so it makes it hard for me to take reasons like this seriously, as I have to base it on my knowledge.

It also sounds like he's planning for what to do when his marriage ends, rather than for when he is married. I hope he keeps it wrapped well whenever he gets into bed.
__________________
Wishlist because I like stuff
penguin is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 02:29 PM   #19
LalaCity
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,051
LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!LalaCity keeps pushing the rep limit!
Default

Penguin, you might want to peruse this thread...

Joswitch's reservations have already been fully documented, in case you were wondering.
LalaCity is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 02:52 PM   #20
penguin
Fnord
 
penguin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Brisbane, Australia.
Posts: 5,249
penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LalaCity View Post
Penguin, you might want to peruse this thread...

Joswitch's reservations have already been fully documented, in case you were wondering.
Ah, I see. I did read the other comments in this post before I responded, but I was responding to the article rather than his opinion.

On one hand, I can kind of see his point. But on the other, it's a case of suck it up, buttercup, choose your partner wisely and work on your relationship together, and you can usually avoid that crap.

The laws here are very different, so I have little sympathy for men who pull those excuses out. It just sounds like they keep choosing the wrong women to be involved with, and can't be bothered to work on their relationship or put effort in.
__________________
Wishlist because I like stuff
penguin is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 03:29 PM   #21
AmazingAmy
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,691
AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!AmazingAmy has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!
Default

It'd be good if there was a study accompanying this one on why more and more women aren't choosing to get married either. I don't see the usefulness of such a huge study when you don't look at the other side of the coin. Is it still assumed that women want to tie the knot in their 20s, quit their career to look after the home, and pop out babies while spending her bread winner of a husband's money? Someone ask us and we'll give you the exact same 3 reasons given in the OP's post as to why we're rejecting it also.

I don't care about marriage most of the time, but I downright despise it when all I hear from men is the entrapment argument, like all women are massive battle axes and men are simply dodging a bullet by not marrying them - like we're all begging to be someone's wife.
AmazingAmy is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 04:08 PM   #22
joswitch
Exile from Main Board
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,704
joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CastingPearls View Post
I'm of the belief that when you begin to see someone you're really interested in, you should be honest and tell them how you feel about marriage so they can then make an informed decision on whether or not to proceed with whatever it is you two have together.

I don't see anything wrong with a man not wanting to get married nor do I see anything wrong with a woman who doesn't want to get married as long as no one is being dishonest or in denial about their needs.

John, too many of your threads are used to justify your own viewpoints which, while no different from anyone else here, particularly this forum, is really disingenuous when you pull the 'no, not me, I'm just one guy with one opinion' card so often. No one is putting a gun to your head to marry so what do you care what anyone thinks of it?
Elaine, you're a smart cookie, and I hope that you get it when I say: this is not about me.
And I don't need to justify my personal choices about marriage or not, to anyone, nor anyone else theirs to me.

This thread is about the social consequences of 20% of men opting out of marriage and 50% delaying for years. What are the consequences of that? Now and in the future?
__________________
...
joswitch is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 04:08 PM   #23
adolan55
 
adolan55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: VA
Posts: 143
adolan55 has super-sized repadolan55 has super-sized repadolan55 has super-sized repadolan55 has super-sized repadolan55 has super-sized rep
Default

I don't believe men or women waiting to get married, or deciding to not get married at all, is necessarily a problem. Despite the resistance of some to learn and better themselves it is still however a byproduct of living so for whatever reason people cite to delay marriage or not get married at all I think it stands to reason that at a very minimum they will be able to make better decisions around marriage as they get older and gain wisdom(although let me disclaimer this by saying this "better" decision could still be bad especially considering the aforementioned resistant to learn, and there is nothing to say that youthful men and women will not make good decisions towards marriage either). I make this statement not to indicate I feel people should wait for marriage, but I do want to indicate that people not getting married isn't necessarily hurting our society, its just different.

Also to add to a slightly different aspect of this issue I believe it fair to remind everyone that the laws in place, in reference to custody of children for divorcing parents, are not there to benefit women or "screw over" men but to allow our legal system, whether right or wrong in the decision, to determine the best possible outcome for the children. People in a giving situation will not be summarily awarded custody based upon their gender and the laws attempt to produce the best possible outcome for the kid rather than just awarding custody to who wants them more. Whether or not you believe these laws are fair or not towards any particular gender, the intention of them is decidedly different.

I'm not married and I enjoy it. I know many men and women that feel the same way and in discussions with them on the topic the reasons listed in that article are almost never the indicated reasons for delaying or avoiding marriage. Like myself they too would just like to ensure that when/if they get married that it will be the correct decision for them to make.
adolan55 is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 04:12 PM   #24
penguin
Fnord
 
penguin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Brisbane, Australia.
Posts: 5,249
penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.penguin has ascended what used to be the highest level.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joswitch View Post
This thread is about the social consequences of 20% of men opting out of marriage and 50% delaying for years. What are the consequences of that? Now and in the future?
The marriage industry might not make as much money as they currently do? Other than that...I must be missing your point. You're not talking about these men not getting into relationships, not living with their partners, and not having children. You're talking about these men not spending money on a ceremony and signing a bit of paper in front of friends and family. If you asked this question 50 or 100 years ago, the answers might be different, but as Western society is comfortable with having children born out of wedlock and couples living together without being married, you're coming across as extremely old fashioned and out of date.
__________________
Wishlist because I like stuff
penguin is offline  
Old 01-21-2011, 04:14 PM   #25
joswitch
Exile from Main Board
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,704
joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!joswitch has a ton of rep. Literally. As in over 2000!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AmazingAmy View Post
It'd be good if there was a study accompanying this one on why more and more women aren't choosing to get married either. I don't see the usefulness of such a huge study when you don't look at the other side of the coin.

Good point. If there's a similar sample size study on women's attitude to marriage 2.0 I'd love to see it. If anyone finds such please link.
Quote:
Is it still assumed that women want to tie the knot in their 20s, quit their career to look after the home, and pop out babies while spending her bread winner of a husband's money? Someone ask us and we'll give you the exact same 3 reasons given in the OP's post as to why we're rejecting it also.

I don't care about marriage most of the time, but I downright despise it when all I hear from men is the entrapment argument, like all women are massive battle axes and men are simply dodging a bullet by not marrying them - like we're all begging to be someone's wife.
__________________
...
joswitch is offline  
 

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright Dimensions Magazine. All rights reserved worldwide.