Love advice? Havin some trouble lol

[Barnes]

Okay lol here's the story. I need outside opinions really bad because sometimes I believe my friends don't tell me the truth. THIS IS REALLY LONG lol. But I need help.

I am friends with this kid, James. We met last year around this time in school, and ever since them him, me, and these two girls(Let's call them Marie and Lily lol they're sisters) have been inseperable. We've all been best friends since the very beginning. Well, when I first met him I thought he was cute. But as I got to know him, I just appreciated him as a friend. Well things changed and I realized I was having really strong feelings for him, and it seemed he felt the same way. Problem was, he had a girlfriend. So while he'd flirt with me, he was dating this other girl. Eventually over the summer he broke up with her and spent like every single day with us. For a while I kind of forgot about liking him and we got closer and closer as friends and I didnt suspect anything weird and kind of didn't feel anything for a while because I pushed it away as stupid. In about November I had a fight with Marie and Lily and didnt speak to them for a while, and he was there for me and helped me through the whole thing. It was when I realized I think I really did like him. I got butterflies whenever I was around him, and got kind of nervous. So things got better with the other girls. Then he asked me to Prom and we slow danced together and he kissed my head. That kind of did it for me lol. I was in love. And I can say love because I love him as my best friend, but I am in love with him. I love him so much it hurts. So, after a while I decided I needed him to know. So I wrote him a note. The reply was that he wanted us to only be friends. So, I kind of tried to get over him.

Well, he never was as close to me as he was to the other girls. Like, he'd call THEM if we were doing something. He just never seemed that interested in me. But suddenly (I gave him the note in May) he is, I don't want to say obsessed, but slightly lol. He calls me every day, and he started picking me up after work at like 11 at night and we go to this park (we call it "our park") and talk for hours sometimes until 3 AM. He tells me secrets he's never told anyone before. And we can't tell our friends about it, because they have jealousy issues and dont like the idea of us alone together. But when I'm with him, it's like nothing I've ever felt. We're like connected. We talk so fluently, so easily to each other. He told me about how he was so afraid that he'd going to end up alone. We share fears and stuff. Physically, he is so nervous around me nowadays. He is jumpy, and does touch me more often than he used to but more than that I see him looking lol. I catch him and always laugh and we kind of laugh it off. But sometimes if we touch, like if he takes my hand when its dark and scary, its really nice. And I cant say he likes me because he told me he didn't, he said we should be friends. I dont want to set myself up for disappointment. But sometimes I sit here and I anticipate his calls. I am in love with him in every sense of the term, but now I feel like he's somehow reciprocating. All of a sudden he takes SUCH interest in me. We've gone to this dark park 7 nights in a row, and we just sit and talk for hours and sometimes we go to his house and just lay on his bed and talk.

From what I've told you, does he like me? Or now that he knows I like him is he messing with my head? I'm so confused and I just need help with it. Sorry for rambling lol. But it's been bugging me and ya'll were so nice I figured you could help. Thanks lol I'm a nutjob.

[MsGreenLantern]

well...first off I would say to use the term "in love with" with a bit more seriousness. Its just not quite realistic to be in love with someone when you've never even been on a date with them.

Quite possibly he is interested, but I would be careful. Are you willing to lose those other friends to be with him? Are you willing to quite possibly ruin your friendship with him down the line? I mean, lets face it, few breakups end up being friendly ones.

My advice would be think it out. Don't tell yourself you're madly in love with him. Its close, its cute, but it sounds like just another young puppy dog kinda relationship built on an exsisting friendship. Enjoy the closeness, but weigh it all out realistically. Sometimes, when a young guy is obsessed with a girl, its more a sign of immaturity, sexual attraction, and being unsure than it is a throbbing heart and marriage plans.

Good luck with you issue. I hope you guys find a comfortable and happy situation.

[AnnMarie]

I think it's entirely possible to love someone you've never been on a date with. Getting to know a person as a loving, caring, fun, humorous human being, and loving them for that, or falling in love with them over the course of discovering all of that about them is entirely possible.

Sounds like you're having a very nice time with him, and I think that's a great thing. I don't think he's messing with your head... I think he sees something in you that others don't give him, and he needs it, and is seeking it out. Does that mean he feels love for you? Probably in a friend sense at the very least, but it may not be beyond that, so try to keep your racing young mind in check. We've all been there.

My alarm bells go off at the "friends can't know" about the friendship thing. I know things are tough when you're young, and there are so many politics involved in every little relationship, but don't allow yourself to be anyone's secret. Doesn't mean he has to make some big declaration about you guys hanging out, but if it comes up in conversation - don't hide it. You deserve more - both of you! (For instance "oh yeah, the other night James told me about this song/band/tv show/candy bar he really likes.... ") Don't hide your time together, no one has a right to be jealous of friendship.

Enjoy this, it's a fun time, despite the pangs and wonderings. I know I sound like an old lady, but I'm not that far removed from it. Sometimes the build up and newness and night long conversations are the best part!

[Chimpi]

Originally Posted by MsGreenLantern

Are you willing to lose those other friends to be with him? Are you willing to quite possibly ruin your friendship with him down the line? I mean, lets face it, few breakups end up being friendly ones.

Personally, my advice is based on this. And, it's a short advice speech.
If you like him that much, or love him that much, whichever one it is, you need to think if it is worth it to possibly ruin whatever it is that you have with him to pursue him. Anything worth having is worth fighting for.

... The only other thing I can think of is... he might be gay.
*shrugs* Who knows. You'll have to figure it out for yourself, though.
But, if he is straight, and you honestly love him to pieces, and want to truly be romantic with him - more than just a friendship - "stay the course". Not your current course, but get on with it. You won't want to regret not doing it later, trust me.

EDIT: None of the following is of any offense Whatsoever. I just checked out your MySpace, and James' MySpace. As an outsider, and the situation you have described, and viewing his MySpace, I would lean towards the fact that he's probably gay. I do know a few gay guys, and every single one did not "come out" during High School. Pretty much the same thing for "Fat Admirers", if you get my idea. One guy, who is very close to three girls, who seems to have a huge interest in Harry Potter, and does not have a Sexual Orientation on his MySpace... I'm thinking he's probably gay. No big deal, really. But, that's my viewpoint. I apologize to anyone if that seems harsh, but that's my opinion. I've been asked plenty of times if I were gay... I'm quite like gay guys in the emotions and "sensualness" of it all. *shrugs*
Enough of that... I don't want to cause a ruckus.
You might ask him, just for the hell of it. Be wary of a rebuttle and an argument, but if he's a true friend, he won't stay mad too long. Or, if he is gay, then he'll appreciate the kind gesture.. *sigh*

*shrugs*
Quite the story though. Young love..

[eightyseven]

This sounds all too familiar. I have my own experiences with a girl messing with my heart and not being straightforward with me when I gave her all the indication in the world that I was mad about her, but I'm not going to go into detail.

My best advice would just to not have any expectations, despite what you feel. Don't expect him to one day tell you he's wild about you, kiss you romantically, and take you away to his castle. If you're enjoying the relationship you have with him right now, what's the point in feeling strange about it? If it simply makes you happy to spend time with him like you do now, then I think you should just accept how it is. I know that sounds pessimistic, but he's already explicated to you that he just wants to be friends, and it seems to me he's sticking to that. The additional touching and friendliness may just be a reverse reaction because he knows you like him, and though he won't have you- he's simply curious about how strongly you feel. It's a mindf*ck. But best of luck to you. You're adorable and seem to be a generally caring and feeling person

[Barnes]

He's not gay. TRUST ME lol. I spent all last summer with him and....well lol nothing happened between us but certain things happened and I know for a fact that he's not gay. He is...let's just say a boob man haha. I have definitely ruled out gay. And no offense intended but how can you judge someone's sexual preference from their myspace? You can't. It's slightly judgmental if you ask me. I think I'd know him better than that.

I know what you guys mean about the whole being careful not to ruin the friendship thing, him and I discussed it. I was amazed that he remained my friend after I told him how I felt. He stayed my friend and nothing changed for a long time. But now, all of a sudden, it's so different. Like, words cant explain the way he looks at me sometimes. Sometimes I swear he is like hiding something from me and that's the reason he takes me out, to get up the nerve to tell me something. But he never does and the night ends in a tight hug.

As for the "friends cant know" thing, we both agreed on it. We discussed it thoroughly and as stupid as it sounds, it's the best thing. Our 2 friends have very bad jealousy issues, and we told them once of our little late night get togethers and the outcome was horrible. They were so insanely jealous, and were mad at us for like a week. We love our friends, and they're part of our "gang" but sometimes being alone is fun too. We dont want to lose them, but we don't want to stop. So what they don't know can't hurt them. But I've told him before and he's told me, if they ever "forbade" us to do it, we wouldn't stop. We enjoy it too much.

I don't have expectations, I can't. I love him too much to do that to myself. I don't "throw around" the term "love". I've never loved someone the way I love him. My point being, the way I know him and all the time we've spent together just makes it that much harder. I dont sit here thinking "He definitely likes me". I dont fret over it either. I just enjoy the outtings. I enjoy spending quiet time with him where he'll just hold my hand and we'll walk around at night. It's a nice feeling knowing it's just the two of us, and he's said before he wants to make this a ritual during the summer. But the thought pops up a lot and I ask advice because I get such mixed signals from my own brain.

Anyway. I still don't know what to think lol. Thank you for all your help. My friends are convinced he likes me, but I can't believe it until i hear it from him which I'm not asking anytime soon. I suppose I'll just enjoy what's happening now. But it's anything but puppy love. The understanding we have between each other is deeper than that.

Thanks for your help. If you have any more advice let me know <3.

[Jes]

To be totally honest, throughout your heartfelt post, I had the deep feeling he's either gay or bi and perhaps he doesn't even know it, yet. I think, regardless of his orientation, that he does feel a close friendship with you and values you in his life a lot. I hope the best for you.

[Barnes]

I dont know why but I get deeply offended when people call him gay.

[MsGreenLantern]

Don't be, its not an insult.

Anyway, you don't want him to be gay because you have a thing for him, duh (woah I just said duh!) But...hm, yeah....you keep saying you guys haven't done anything sexual, you chat about your lives and share a lot of deep feelings, you said he seems like he wants to tell you something but is afraid to...tis a puzzlement, but I'm sure we're not getting anywhere near enough information to make an informed observation like that about his sexuality.

Good luck again!

[Barnes]

Just updating.

We've done the same thing every night, and now he holds my hand without any kind of excuse. Tonight in the car on the way home we were talking about how shitty my family treats me and out of nowhere, he's never said this beore, he said "I love you and that's all that matters." Both of us got kind of quiet and i looked at him and he was like what, i do. And I was blushing like a tomato and said "I love you too." WHen i got home my friend had texted me to tell me that James had been saying weird things today about how he needs to get up the nerve to do something and when they asked if it was about me he wouldn't answer.

This is going to be one interesting summer.

[JerseyGirl07093]

Just thought I'd add this.....
When I was reading your post it reminded me so much of a guy I 'dated' in high school. He liked me, he didn't like me, we should keep this between the two of us, I don't know how I feel about you, blah blah blah. It sounds very similar to your situation. Years later I found out two things that helped make sense of it all...he is bipolar and he is gay. Yep, the gay thing again. Let me just say there is nothing wrong with being gay and I don't mean it as an insult or anything. It's just that back then I didn't know he was gay and I'm not sure he did either. Kissing girls or fooling around with them doesn't mean he isn't gay or bi (and I'm not saying he is), because I did all that and more with this guy (Yes, I lost my virginity to a gay guy! I should have posted that in the thread where you tell a random thing about yourself. lol)
I know it's all very confusing and I hate that about relationships. Why can't people just either like you or not, no drama? I guess I've been absolutely no help, have I? Just wanted to let you know you're not the only one who has been through it.
You deserve someone who likes you and wants to be with you without all the drama. My advice (and I know it's easier said than done), stay friends and if something happens, it happens. He already knows how you feel now it is up to him to make the move.
Good Luck!

[Jes]

Originally Posted by MoMo

I dont know why but I get deeply offended when people call him gay.

And I'm sure it doesn't help that we don't know him, and you do.
I know that. It must sound odd that I'm guessing that way. But all I can say: you asked for opinions and I"m giving mine. I'm double your age (*gulp*) and when I've seen this sort of thing before, and I have, LOTS, it's generally b/c the person in question is somehow at odds with his or her sexuality. That may be b/c of being gay, or some other aspect of one's sexuality, but generally...yeah....
The boob thing...well, I happen to know a fair number of very gay men who have a boob interest. It's pretty funny and the interest differs from man to man (some find them silly and fun, others comforting, others sexy/sexual), but I think gay men are drawn to boobs for the same reason we all are, and also, perhaps, b/c they're the least 'threatening' of a woman's sexual 'parts.'
In any case, were you to ask him about being gay, if he doesn't know he is and/or he doesnt' want to tell you (assuming he is, of course), then you won't get an answer.
But it strikes me that even if ALL of this isn't true, if he's MADLY in love with you and thinks about you 24/7, but he isn't going to act on it ever, then really, that's not different than not being into you at all. See what I mean? Step back and really look at it rationally. If he isn't going to act on feelings you think he has, then no amount of anything on your part is going to change that.
So try to move on. Be a friend, sure, but maybe don't spend so much time alone if it makes you long to be more than friends. Get a bit of distance so that you're open to other possibilities and it doesn't hurt to see but not touch.

Take it from me!!

[swordchick]

Originally Posted by Jes

And I'm sure it doesn't help that we don't know him, and you do.
I know that. It must sound odd that I'm guessing that way. But all I can say: you asked for opinions and I"m giving mine. I'm double your age (*gulp*) and when I've seen this sort of thing before, and I have, LOTS, it's generally b/c the person in question is somehow at odds with his or her sexuality. That may be b/c of being gay, or some other aspect of one's sexuality, but generally...yeah....
The boob thing...well, I happen to know a fair number of very gay men who have a boob interest. It's pretty funny and the interest differs from man to man (some find them silly and fun, others comforting, others sexy/sexual), but I think gay men are drawn to boobs for the same reason we all are, and also, perhaps, b/c they're the least 'threatening' of a woman's sexual 'parts.'
In any case, were you to ask him about being gay, if he doesn't know he is and/or he doesnt' want to tell you (assuming he is, of course), then you won't get an answer.
But it strikes me that even if ALL of this isn't true, if he's MADLY in love with you and thinks about you 24/7, but he isn't going to act on it ever, then really, that's not different than not being into you at all. See what I mean? Step back and really look at it rationally. If he isn't going to act on feelings you think he has, then no amount of anything on your part is going to change that.
So try to move on. Be a friend, sure, but maybe don't spend so much time alone if it makes you long to be more than friends. Get a bit of distance so that you're open to other possibilities and it doesn't hurt to see but not touch.

Take it from me!!

Jes, I'm with you on that. I have been there when I was a high school senior. I went through the same things and my friends tried to warn me. But I had a great time with him. He gave led me to have great self confidence and how to buy some fierce clothes and shoes. Now, we are still good friends and he has a wonderful boyfriend.

Most of really close male friends from high school are out of closet now. They could not have handled it then.

[Moonchild]

Hmm... My gay friend went through a similar ordeal over a guy

Well, I'm pretty sure I know what you're going through. Moreso than I'd like to, in fact.

Here's a question? What's happening at the end of the summer? In my case, I'm going to college and the object of my affection will still be starting her junior year of high school, complicating it tenfold (the fact that I'm going about an hour and a half away, close enough to force it to work with difficulty makes it even worse). How much time have you got? If you've got time, take it. The best intimate relationships are borne out of friendships. You two sound like you've got a good thing going. Keep it up as long as it takes.

I don't think you will, but since it's bit me in the ass hardcore in the past, don't assume that just because you made the first move he'll make the next. Also I get the impression there's no reason to worry about the state of your friendship. You guys sound pretty solid. I don't think making said move will risk that. It'll just be sorta awkward for the following thirtyish seconds, then you'll go to bed wondering "should I have said that?" and in the morning it'll be as it was the day before (assuming it's still a no-go). Which raises another point - what's the worst that could happen? I'm not gonna pretend to be able to answer that, you know him better than I do.

Jes - Given the situation you gave where he chooses not to act on his feelings, perhaps there is a reason that, while it could be dealt with if discussed, would reign unchallenged otherwise.

This post might come accross as overly positive in your favor, maybe because I'm pulling for you in hopes that if your story works out it means mine has a chance, but I think the bottom line is I think the worst that could happen is pretty much exactly what's going on right now, which doesn't seem so bad.

[Barnes]

Thanks for your advice. I do appreciate everyones opinions, and I do see how you could think he is gay. I still am pretty adamant about him being straight especially because my friend and I "stumbled" upon his porn collection haha. He had gone downstairs and we were in his room and I was peeking in his closet and saw a closed box so NATURALLY my nosy self opened it. Yeah, not gay but definitely a boob man haha

We've done the same night time ritual of going to our park and talking. We talk more about the future, and what being married will be like and how weird it must be to like know that you're spending your life with someone and have to see them every day. He said something along the lines of "when we're married you can cheat so you dont get bored" joking around lol. I understand what you guys say about not getting my hopes up, and I definitely dont. I dont think he's in love with me, but I do think there is something between us. I guess it's intuition. I sound stupid when I explain it on here. I'm sure if I could explain it in person it'd sound different. Thanks for your thoughts though. <3