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Dating non FA's. Yay or Nay? (BBW input only please)

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TraciJo67

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Felecia...I am calling your bluff. it's time for you to just say whatever it is you aren't saying. What happened? What are you talking about? There is something you talk around and around but never say. You can't condemn things in nonspecific ways and then expect people to know what you're talking about, much less care about it.

Name names, speak up. It'll all be modded away if it's rule-breaking anyhow. What are you talking about?
I don't have any idea what Felecia is talking about, but I do understand the reluctance to embrace the "FA" term because often it seems that it's about far more than a preference and, judging by the comments we so frequently see here, delves more into fetish land. I could (and happily do) accept that my husband likes curvy, plump, meaty, round, fat .... whatever the descriptive. It would be a deal-breaker if this were a requirement on his part, as in, he couldn't be attracted to me if I no longer fit that category. I wouldn't be able to accept such a narrow definition of what he finds beautiful about me, nor would HE be able to accept the fact that I've lost/gained/lost/gained hundreds of pounds in the last few decades. I think that some of the reluctance discussed here has nothing to do with confidence/lack thereof, and everything to do with what we, as people, are/are not willing to compromise about.
 

butch

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Except I don't think that's what the label actually connotes. If it did imply that, there wouldn't be so many threads about FAs in the closet treating fat women like dirty secrets, which I've read about too many times to count on these boards.

I have found that a guy who is open to pair bonding with a fat woman doesn't necessarily have to prefer fat women at all either - and that seems to be the experience of others around here too. Bi-sizuals, or even people who don't really have any kind of specific preference at all, have also built happy, public relationships with fat women. It's not the exclusive domain of self-declared FAs.

As has been said in a dozen ways in this thread, and about a million times over these boards, there are guys who are FAs who are wonderful and open to forming caring relationships with fat women, and there are guys who do not have a specific preference for fat women who are wonderful and open to forming caring relationships with fat women.
I'm not saying that only FAs find fat women attractive and want to have LTRs with them-far from it. I'm just teasing out the difference between attraction and dating, and that they aren't always the same thing.

I was struck by the stories in this thread about fat women interacting with men, and once someone else calls it more than friendship, it gets all weird. My guess is, many guys in those scenarios are attracted, FAs or not, but they don't want to go against the grain and be with someone that is not considered 'sexually desirable' to mainstream culture. Something to explore a bit more, i think.

This may or may not also be useful to the discussion, but it may surprise some that there are gays and lesbians who don't identify with the sexuality labels, either. They associate gay and lesbian with girly campy sassy boys, and bulldagger rough gruff women, and want nothing to do with it. As gays and lesbians become more mainstream, they are less likely to vocalize this reluctance to embrace the labels gay and lesbian, especially now that this visibility is providing them with rights they didn't have before.

However, if you talk to them, they'll say they're no different from straight people, that the gender of the person they choose to date is no big deal, and nothing radically different from dating someone of a different gender; and yet, I doubt anyone would say they're not gay or lesbian. This to me sounds a lot like a certain type of non-FA FA, but then again, I've only ever dated one FA, and he is the apple of my eye (and self-identifies as a FA), so do with that what you will.
 

superodalisque

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i'm talking about the reluctance of or the ability to say openly whats going on, on an individual level
 

GlassDaemon

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I find this debate questionable mostly because, from my own personal experience, I can date someone whose "okay" in the appearance department, but if/when I fall in love with them, or just really really like them, it's almost like they look different. Features that could have been considered flaws or just unattractive become endearing and cute to me.

The most obvious one I can think of is my boyfriend's eyebrows, they're HUGE! I mean, massive, bushy, monster brows, and I remember the first time I saw them and I wanted to laugh, they look so ridiculous. Now, I couldn't imagine him without them, I touch them, and trace them with my fingers, I nuzzle my nose into them. It's a feature of him that I absolutely LOVE! and he's more attractive to me for it.

My point is, I become more physically attracted to a person the more I romantically care about them. My boyfriend probably didn't think I was a goddess among women when he met me, he probably thought I was a little too thick and a little too hairy. Now, he laughs about it, he rubs my leg hair and kisses my belly and then proclaims to me that I'm gorgeous and beautiful like no one else.

I don't really care if my partner is an FA or not, because if they like me, and they want to pursue a relationship with me, they'll either get over it or learn to love it, which if the relationship lasts more than 6 months, they'll probably learn to love it like they love the rest of me. I think it's kind of a must considering what we'll all look like in old age. You learn to love the person not the physique cause while we all look pretty good in our prime, it all gets wrinkly, gray/bald and saggy.
 

LovelyLiz

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^^^ I agree with this a ton, and want to burst into applause after reading it. Love changes everything.

All I know is that at periods when I have sought to only date self-identified FAs, in me that was coming from a place of fear. Fear that the guy would reject me when he saw me in all my fat unclothed glory. Fear that he would reject me if I didn't walk as fast or some other fat-related thing. Fear he would reject me if he had to put up with flak from family or friends. Fear that really if he experienced any kind of burden, large or small, stemming from my fat body, that he would do away with me.

But that risk is just part of all relationships - with an FA or not - he may decide he doesn't want to put up with some habit of mine (or I may decide that about him). I guess maybe the bodily rejection is just more wounding, so that's why that fear can be so powerful in influencing our dating choices?
 

cinnamitch

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I find this debate questionable mostly because, from my own personal experience, I can date someone whose "okay" in the appearance department, but if/when I fall in love with them, or just really really like them, it's almost like they look different. Features that could have been considered flaws or just unattractive become endearing and cute to me.

The most obvious one I can think of is my boyfriend's eyebrows, they're HUGE! I mean, massive, bushy, monster brows, and I remember the first time I saw them and I wanted to laugh, they look so ridiculous. Now, I couldn't imagine him without them, I touch them, and trace them with my fingers, I nuzzle my nose into them. It's a feature of him that I absolutely LOVE! and he's more attractive to me for it.

My point is, I become more physically attracted to a person the more I romantically care about them. My boyfriend probably didn't think I was a goddess among women when he met me, he probably thought I was a little too thick and a little too hairy. Now, he laughs about it, he rubs my leg hair and kisses my belly and then proclaims to me that I'm gorgeous and beautiful like no one else.

I don't really care if my partner is an FA or not, because if they like me, and they want to pursue a relationship with me, they'll either get over it or learn to love it, which if the relationship lasts more than 6 months, they'll probably learn to love it like they love the rest of me. I think it's kind of a must considering what we'll all look like in old age. You learn to love the person not the physique cause while we all look pretty good in our prime, it all gets wrinkly, gray/bald and saggy.
AMEN, well said
 

AnnMarie

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Couple of other thoughts, without much expansion on them.

Nancy made a really interesting point, and I think it has some merit for me at least - that maybe there's two different women who don't have and do have interest in men who want a large partner - based on how they view their own fat body. (to be clear, I'm not talking about confidence and all that - just nodding at Nancy's theory, I find it interesting.)

Also, I seem to see a trend in that more women who consider themselves very open to many different body types wouldn't want someone who was specifically into a "range" or larger bodies as a preference. I just wonder how much that has to do with preferring or not preferring a guy who prefers large partners exclusively.

I know that I have a size range preference and all, and while it's certainly taken twists and turns based on partners and interests, it's still in general in tact. I've never deviated out of it by 100-200lbs, which is what some are saying they do/want/accept, etc.

I just think it's possible that knowing YOU are a person with a preference makes you more able to understand someone else's and realize that having a preference doesn't mean you're unyielding or closed off - it's just that, a preference. In a perfect world - something in this realm would be fantastic.

Hell, we all do that with the insides of a person, I don't think attraction is different. Yes, it changes over time and love certainly alters how you view a person - I've been there, I'm not blind to that. But when discussing attraction, searching, discussing, learning, and moving toward people - we have our wants and needs.


I don't care that everyone wants different things - in fact they should. I'm never going to force someone to want an FA (or someone who prefers a large partner who doesn't know a damn thing about this little world). And I don't see most here doing that either. I'm not putting down the men others want or meet - and I resent the hell out of the fact that the men I know and have loved get constantly belittled, cast aside and cast as the villain.

As Liz mentioned - what is the point of it? Where are the words that are missing? If it all boils down to playing a villain for liking a body type, then maybe that's why I'm sympathetic - I'm just as guilty and so are most of my friends. I'm willing and able to admit and embrace my desires and my right to them - something I never thought I'd be able to do as a fat woman. I will never apologize for what I find attractive inside and outside a man, and I would never ask for it from another.
 

liz (di-va)

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are you trying to get me banned;)
Nope! Trying to get you to do what you are saying other people aren't doing:
i'm talking about the reluctance of or the ability to say openly whats going on, on an individual level
Anyhow, that's enough-a that.
- - - - -
I do understand the reluctance to embrace the "FA" term because often it seems that it's about far more than a preference and, judging by the comments we so frequently see here, delves more into fetish land.
This would be back to the definition-of-FA argument. I myself do not include fetishism in the general definition of FA. Sometimes it seems like a subset of being an FA, sometimes it seems like a wholly different thing, but I don't think they're the same thing. I fault Dims for not making this clearer, but I also think people here need to take responsibility for seeing this for themselves, for seeing that the average fat girl-liking dude probably doesn't wanna make her fatter or whatever.

It's cool if that's his thing, though--and her thing--and it's handled in a consensual way. Why not? Who cares if they do? People have their Things. I see fat kinks of whatever intensity as like any other kinks out there: yours to really like if you really like it and those who don't won't care at all. Kink is kink. Assuming everyone in fatty-land likes fat kink is like seeing some older--Asian--skinny--whatever--couple into watersports or BDSM or latex and extrapolating to assume all people who look like that couple are into that. There are way too many fat people and FAs for that to be true.
 

superodalisque

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Nope! Trying to get you to do what you are saying other people aren't doing:

Anyhow, that's enough-a that.
- - - - -

This would be back to the definition-of-FA argument. I myself do not include fetishism in the general definition of FA. Sometimes it seems like a subset of being an FA, sometimes it seems like a wholly different thing, but I don't think they're the same thing. I fault Dims for not making this clearer, but I also think people here need to take responsibility for seeing this for themselves, for seeing that the average fat girl-liking dude probably doesn't wanna make her fatter or whatever.

It's cool if that's his thing, though--and her thing--and it's handled in a consensual way. Why not? Who cares if they do? People have their Things. I see fat kinks of whatever intensity as like any other kinks out there: yours to really like if you really like it and those who don't won't care at all. Kink is kink. Assuming everyone in fatty-land likes fat kink is like seeing some older--Asian--skinny--whatever--couple into watersports or BDSM or latex and extrapolating to assume all people who look like that couple are into that. There are way too many fat people and FAs for that to be true.
its not about kink or liking fat women. its not about being mad because some man likes someone fat. its about bad behavior that would be bad behavior that any man does that people are happy to ignore or pretend it doesn't exist as long as an FA does it. or worst yet he suddenly is not an FA because FAs are all perfect. the lack of realism makes the whole thing very suspect and attracts odd illogical ways of dealing with relationships and expectations that can be unhealthy for anyone, whether they are a BBW or an FA.

kinky is nice as long as the person with the kink is bringing it to you nicely and with care and with respect. the problem is there are some people who feel that the label FA gives them a bona fide reason not to that puts the reputation of other guys who might ordinarily use the designation at risk for bad association.
 

AnnMarie

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Maybe it's about the various definitions of bad behavior.

Whatever. Most points have been made clearly and concisely, and those that haven't won't be (based on historical data).

Let's move on and maybe all the adult women here can make their own choices about who they will date and who they won't. We can all also decide what we will and won't tolerate in our lives. In all manner of speaking.
 

superodalisque

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Maybe about the various definitions of bad behavior.

Whatever. Most points have been made clearly and concisely, and those that haven't won't be (based on historical data).

Let's move on and maybe all the adult women here can make their own choices about who they will date and who they won't. We can all also decide what we will and won't tolerate in our lives. In all manner of speaking.

good deal! i appreciate that.
 

PeanutButterfly

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Couple of other thoughts, without much expansion on them.

Nancy made a really interesting point, and I think it has some merit for me at least - that maybe there's two different women who don't have and do have interest in men who want a large partner - based on how they view their own fat body. (to be clear, I'm not talking about confidence and all that - just nodding at Nancy's theory, I find it interesting.)

Also, I seem to see a trend in that more women who consider themselves very open to many different body types wouldn't want someone who was specifically into a "range" or larger bodies as a preference. I just wonder how much that has to do with preferring or not preferring a guy who prefers large partners exclusively.

I know that I have a size range preference and all, and while it's certainly taken twists and turns based on partners and interests, it's still in general in tact. I've never deviated out of it by 100-200lbs, which is what some are saying they do/want/accept, etc.

I just think it's possible that knowing YOU are a person with a preference makes you more able to understand someone else's and realize that having a preference doesn't mean you're unyielding or closed off - it's just that, a preference. In a perfect world - something in this realm would be fantastic.


Hell, we all do that with the insides of a person, I don't think attraction is different. Yes, it changes over time and love certainly alters how you view a person - I've been there, I'm not blind to that. But when discussing attraction, searching, discussing, learning, and moving toward people - we have our wants and needs.


I don't care that everyone wants different things - in fact they should. I'm never going to force someone to want an FA (or someone who prefers a large partner who doesn't know a damn thing about this little world). And I don't see most here doing that either. I'm not putting down the men others want or meet - and I resent the hell out of the fact that the men I know and have loved get constantly belittled, cast aside and cast as the villain.

As Liz mentioned - what is the point of it? Where are the words that are missing? If it all boils down to playing a villain for liking a body type, then maybe that's why I'm sympathetic - I'm just as guilty and so are most of my friends. I'm willing and able to admit and embrace my desires and my right to them - something I never thought I'd be able to do as a fat woman. I will never apologize for what I find attractive inside and outside a man, and I would never ask for it from another.
I think this is such an excellent, excellent point! I wish it would let me rep you. I never thought of it this way but it's probably a big underlying factor in why there is so much debate on this topic.

If anyone has read any of my other posts, I make it pretty clear that I'm an FFA. I always have been. I like a fat guy and I like a guy who will have "fat sex" with me (to be blunt :p). If you were to ask me my ideal soulmate I could tell you from a pretty early age and it always included someone who understood this part of me. That definition has slightly changed over the years but for the most part I tend to gravitate towards very similar men. And most recently that FA requirement has become more important but even before that most of the guys I've been into have had similar personality traits and even features (tall, dark and handsome, yum!)

My point is basically an elaboration off Ann Marie's. Because I've always been pretty sure what I've wanted and gravitated towards men of that variety its kinda hard for me to comprehend that someone really doesn't have a "type" (whether that be weight related or not). And I think the vice versa is true. If you don't have a type it's probably hard to comprehend that someone else does. If you find most people attractive and acceptable to date than it doesn't make much sense that someone else would have a more narrow range of attraction. It's just the way people are wired. And it's definitely an interesting caveat to this little debate. I shall continue to ponder... :)
 

BHMforBBW

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I thank everyone for their opinions here, no matter how you feel on the issue. It is interesting to hear everyone's take on things.

I must say with due respect to everyone, I don't really understand where all the dislike for FA's comes from (Not just from posts in this thread, in the community, around DIMS etc). It confuses me especially being that this is a size acceptance community. I am not berating anyone's opinions, we are all entitled to our own, we will not always see eye to eye and hopefully we will be able to discuss and debate our opinions in a mature and non judgmental way.

I have to say this, There are a lot of misconceptions about FA's that I see made, many of which in this thread. The bottom line is, they are just people. They aren't some mythical creatures, and shouldn't be made out to be such. They are people, people with a preference. It's the same as someone who is fond of read heads, or someone who prefers facial hair on a man. It's a preference. I see too many people treating FA's either like they are some sort of a rare species, or that they are perverts who only see fat. That isn't the case. They have jobs, hobbies, interests- things that define them outside of their sexual preference. Fat isn't the only thing that defines them.

At the end of the day if I make the choice to date an FA it isn't solely because he finds my fat attractive. Look if it were that simple I wouldn't be single now! I have had plenty of opportunities to be with guys, FA and non FA. Just as any person who dates, looks for a partner it comes down to SO much more then that. But is their something so wrong about wanting my mate to be sexually attracted to me? I don't really feel so. To know he likes the wobbly parts that most fat woman feel ashamed of and desperately try to hide? I have embraced these parts of my own body and rather LIKE them, so why shouldn't I find a man who does also? When I look for someone I look for compatibility, first and foremost. You could line up 1,000 FA men and if I do not feel a connection with them then I don't care about anything else. In that respect- for me anyway it's really not that different from anyone else.

I have learned to love MYSELF first and foremost, I don't NEED any man to tell me I am beautiful, define my self worth or tell me how amazing I am. I have come to terms with this on my own and already know. HOWEVER, it doesn't hurt to be told this, to be complimented and made to feel beautiful. Many fat woman (Not all, but a hell of a lot) have struggled with self esteem issues, finding their nitch and feeling attractive, especially in younger years. You can say no, but to a degree my findings have shown everyone needs that reassurance of an ego boost every now and then.

We are all going to have different opinions on this, which is why I brought it up, it's interesting to see how others feel and I respect and enjoy reading everyone's opinions here. This is just mine.
I feel precisely the same way about FFAs! Well said!
 

Green Eyed Fairy

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I'm not clear how a thread that asks the simple question "would you date a non-fa" could be construed as an "attack" on FAs. That title seems to indicate, to me, that dating a "non-FA" is something to be questioned, pondered and worried over.
 

Green Eyed Fairy

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I don't have any idea what Felecia is talking about, but I do understand the reluctance to embrace the "FA" term because often it seems that it's about far more than a preference and, judging by the comments we so frequently see here, delves more into fetish land. I could (and happily do) accept that my husband likes curvy, plump, meaty, round, fat .... whatever the descriptive. It would be a deal-breaker if this were a requirement on his part, as in, he couldn't be attracted to me if I no longer fit that category. I wouldn't be able to accept such a narrow definition of what he finds beautiful about me, nor would HE be able to accept the fact that I've lost/gained/lost/gained hundreds of pounds in the last few decades. I think that some of the reluctance discussed here has nothing to do with confidence/lack thereof, and everything to do with what we, as people, are/are not willing to compromise about.
Excellent- I think you've hit the nail on the head. What I sometimes see/pick up on is a "narrowness" or "stinted" thought process that bugs the hell out of me when I think I might be put under that kind of limited microscope. It scares me, annoys me and just TURNS ME OFF completely about people in general- no matter what the "preference" is.

Not saying that I am right or wrong in my own thought processes- just saying that this is what happens to me in my mind/feelings. I can't easily change that feeling any more than someone can change their body preference.
For myself, I don't really care what a guy likes in general but I do feel more of an alarm/turn off at the idea of having to make myself "conform" to some other person's ideal of who/what I should be/am.

I do even realize the irony of my statement though- FAs can be considered "non-conformists" and I can dig that seven ways to Sunday. However, someone with the same ideals/feelings/preferences as myself is as important an issue as the difficulties of trying to be with someone of different religious and political leanings - Isn't it?
 

tonynyc

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I'm not clear how a thread that asks the simple question "would you date a non-fa" could be construed as an "attack" on FAs. That title seems to indicate, to me, that dating a "non-FA" is something to be questioned, pondered and worried over.
Greenie - I guess if the topic is bought up again in another Forum - then you could get the different perspectives of other voices. Too bad such discussions can only be via the internet- would make a great topic at a Size Acceptance event ( if it has not already been discussed)...
 

Green Eyed Fairy

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I find this debate questionable mostly because, from my own personal experience, I can date someone whose "okay" in the appearance department, but if/when I fall in love with them, or just really really like them, it's almost like they look different. Features that could have been considered flaws or just unattractive become endearing and cute to me.

The most obvious one I can think of is my boyfriend's eyebrows, they're HUGE! I mean, massive, bushy, monster brows, and I remember the first time I saw them and I wanted to laugh, they look so ridiculous. Now, I couldn't imagine him without them, I touch them, and trace them with my fingers, I nuzzle my nose into them. It's a feature of him that I absolutely LOVE! and he's more attractive to me for it.

My point is, I become more physically attracted to a person the more I romantically care about them. My boyfriend probably didn't think I was a goddess among women when he met me, he probably thought I was a little too thick and a little too hairy. Now, he laughs about it, he rubs my leg hair and kisses my belly and then proclaims to me that I'm gorgeous and beautiful like no one else.

I don't really care if my partner is an FA or not, because if they like me, and they want to pursue a relationship with me, they'll either get over it or learn to love it, which if the relationship lasts more than 6 months, they'll probably learn to love it like they love the rest of me. I think it's kind of a must considering what we'll all look like in old age. You learn to love the person not the physique cause while we all look pretty good in our prime, it all gets wrinkly, gray/bald and saggy.
I not only found your post fantastic- but very touching ;)
 
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I don't get hit on any guy worth even schtupping, probably because I'm one of those"take no shit" so-called "masculine headbanger chicks" and nothing in my wardrobe is twee or cute or even sexy. I mean, I have been hit on by creepy bus guys on my way to school (I especially loved the homeless, toothless old guy who wouldn't shut up about my feet...:eek:) but my last few dates were with a a FA who only ever wanted to go out to eat, ,so I'd really rather not date an FA. Too much "hungry, sweet, nice, chubby" stuff going on. I want a CA (Chandi Admirer) instead.
 

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