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mango

Mustachio Nut
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seems to me that the shit dont add up. he took her card or she askd him to use it?

According to the victim, he took her card (unauthorized) twice over 2 days to an ATM without her permission after seeing her enter her pincode when buying a round of drinks. The first time he said he was going to get cigarettes. The second time was while she was in the shower.


:cool:
 

Ample Pie

Fattitude Problem
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It's also important to note that he confirmed he'd done what she said before he changed his story 2/3 through this thread to her asking him to use her card, etc etc.
 

MrSensible

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It wouldn't be a loss.

Here's the thing though, what about people making stuff up just out of spite? I'm not suggesting at all that this has happened in this thread, but people seriously aren't going to be admitting to stuff all the time like what has happened here. So how are the moderators supposed to determine who is telling the truth and who isn't? How are they to know when its not just a case of a spurned lover or a paysite guy thinking his $10 entitles him to something more than occasional updates? That's my worry, that the flying accusations because people think they can get others banned will do irreparable damage.

Again not my board, not my rules, not my decision but I rarely participate here anymore because of how fragmented this community has become and because of the amount of moderator involvement (too much). Banning someone because of something they did offline is only going to cause more of both.
I understand that concern, which is why I mentioned it would need to be verifiable, such as in this case. Obviously it wouldn't be wise or logical to automatically believe every story/accusation from a user with a post count of 2 for instance, or a join date of a day beforehand, but if there's enough valid evidence to prove it (through testimonials of trustworthy members, an outright confession, etc) then I don't see it getting out of hand. It just needs to be handled rationally.

In any case, like I said earlier, it doesn't seem like this kind of behavior is all that common around Dims anyway (unless people just don't talk about it when it happens to them), so hopefully there won't be much of a need for threads like this very often.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on the last note. I personally don't feel that ousting and/or banning a proven thief is cause for the community to become more fragmented. If anything, the opposite seems true. This thread (and the one before it) is a pretty good indicator that quite a few of the active members on this board are more than willing to defend someone who's clearly been wronged. That seems like an admirable communal response to me.
 

Yakatori

Hard to say, really...
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"not that it makes a difference to how bad this all is, but on the day we were getting drinks, she gave me her card and pin and sent me to the cash point, and I took way more than I should have..."
Well, you're right that it makes no difference to many of us; but not least of which in that the context of your explanation, that you're only saying this now (much after the fact) makes it sort of...incredible? I mean, isn't that like the difference between joy-riding and grand theft auto, perhaps of some legal significance of which you are all too keenly aware, but which only serves underscore an overwhelming incentive for you to lie?

"I don't think I really follow what you're talking about when you've quoted me but I'm pretty sure I acknowledged.."
You did. But it was also important to point out, there, that, in as much as you agree that the Webmaster can do anything, then there's really no reason he can't or shouldn't do this particular thing. Right?

"...what about people making stuff up just out of spite?...people seriously aren't going to be admitting to stuff all the time like what has happened here. So how are the moderators supposed to determine who is telling the truth and who isn't? How are they to know when its not just a case of a spurned lover or a paysite guy thinking his $10 entitles him to something more than occasional updates?"
And what about it? I mean, what is even the point of designating any person a "moderator," if they lack just even basic powers of discernment? Moreover, if someone is acting purely of of spite (smoke, but no fire....), in as much as it's apparent to you, why would it be any less apparent to any of a number of other people on the board?

"That's my worry, that the flying accusations because people think they can get others banned will do irreparable damage. ...not my board, not my rules, not my decision but I rarely participate here anymore because of how fragmented this community has become and because of the amount of moderator involvement (too much). Banning someone because of something they did offline is only going to cause more of both."
Really? Is that really what you're most worried about? Because, I'm hardly worried about that at all. I don't even give that a thought. I mean, if someone's inclined to level baseless accusations, if they are that type of person, the best come uppence would be for them to have to further substantiate their claim and, ultimately, be exposed for being....incredible. Right?

Moreover, I don't feel that any particular action on the part of any of the moderators or the Web Master really and truly has the power to fragment the community as much as what those actions, in sum total, signify. If there's a consistent set of values being articulated, that will tend to bind those who choose to share in those values. In contrast, if the values that all or many of us share in are somehow undermined, as much through inaction as any particular one action, that might help to fragment the community.

"As far as fez/Tom goes I don't know the man and dont really..."
Then, you should realize that it's not really about him.

"If people are going to be banned for screwing over other people they met through dims..."
Moreover, that it is not really about this, even. Nor is it about police reports, per se. Or allocution. Or crime, per se. Folks are certainly talking about it in those contexts, because they're so readily accessible. Quantifiable. But I think to really understand this situation is to, first, just see that a line has been crossed. A line that's not, so much, defined or limited in or by those particular criteria. A line that's basically invisible, at least to some of us, at least for now; that is, outside of just imagining it. But, also, that this line is no less real for the rest of us, who see it plainly as day.

Long-winded Question: Imagine if two guys, of approximately comparable size and age, got into an argument at one of the bashes. Or two girls. And that it escalated into the type of situation that required the involvement of the police. And that there was an actual police report (hooga booga-booga!)! And that charges were filed (either against one party or both.) And that one party or both either plead guilty or was convicted. And that someone "started it." And that someone "finished it." Or that, clearly, both parties were "wrong."

In any of those cases, it's easy to see how S.O.'s or platonic friends of either party might take sides, calling for the ban of the other. Or that there would be at least some folks who wanted both "banned". From future bashes. From other bashes, halfway across the country. From this board, etc...

Or, then again, maybe not. Maybe there wouldn't be any kind of response like that. I mean, I'm just conceding that I can at least imagine-it. But, do you suppose, in any of those scenarios, could we or should we expect to see the type of response we see here, in this and the other thread, about this current and very real situation as we're discussing it? Would any of those types of (hypothetical) scenarios guarantee to resonate in quite the same way as this (real) one does for at least a significant portion of this community?

If you can honestly and with a straight face answer "yes" to those questions; then, suffice it to say that, the line I'm talking about is really, basically, invisible for you. And that's not a knock on you, it's just matter of what you can or can't see. On the other hand, if you say "No," then why is that? I mean, in these hypothetical scenarios, not only are talking about actual crime, per se; but, more significantly, personal safety. So, why don't those types of threats (and our leadership's inaction in response) have the same power to shake the foundations on which this is all built?

"hmmmm......."
Maybe you're saying it even better than I could.
 

fatgirlflyin

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Well, you're right that it makes no difference to many of us; but not least of which in that the context of your explanation, that you're only saying this now (much after the fact) makes it sort of...incredible? I mean, isn't that like the difference between joy-riding and grand theft auto, perhaps of some legal significance of which you are all too keenly aware, but which only serves underscore an overwhelming incentive for you to lie?

You did. But it was also important to point out, there, that, in as much as you agree that the Webmaster can do anything, then there's really no reason he can't or shouldn't do this particular thing. Right?

And what about it? I mean, what is even the point of designating any person a "moderator," if they lack just even basic powers of discernment? Moreover, if someone is acting purely of of spite (smoke, but no fire....), in as much as it's apparent to you, why would it be any less apparent to any of a number of other people on the board?

Really? Is that really what you're most worried about? Because, I'm hardly worried about that at all. I don't even give that a thought. I mean, if someone's inclined to level baseless accusations, if they are that type of person, the best come uppence would be for them to have to further substantiate their claim and, ultimately, be exposed for being....incredible. Right?

Moreover, I don't feel that any particular action on the part of any of the moderators or the Web Master really and truly has the power to fragment the community as much as what those actions, in sum total, signify. If there's a consistent set of values being articulated, that will tend to bind those who choose to share in those values. In contrast, if the values that all or many of us share in are somehow undermined, as much through inaction as any particular one action, that might help to fragment the community.

Then, you should realize that it's not really about him.

Moreover, that it is not really about this, even. Nor is it about police reports, per se. Or allocution. Or crime, per se. Folks are certainly talking about it in those contexts, because they're so readily accessible. Quantifiable. But I think to really understand this situation is to, first, just see that a line has been crossed. A line that's not, so much, defined or limited in or by those particular criteria. A line that's basically invisible, at least to some of us, at least for now; that is, outside of just imagining it. But, also, that this line is no less real for the rest of us, who see it plainly as day.

Long-winded Question: Imagine if two guys, of approximately comparable size and age, got into an argument at one of the bashes. Or two girls. And that it escalated into the type of situation that required the involvement of the police. And that there was an actual police report (hooga booga-booga!)! And that charges were filed (either against one party or both.) And that one party or both either plead guilty or was convicted. And that someone "started it." And that someone "finished it." Or that, clearly, both parties were "wrong."

In any of those cases, it's easy to see how S.O.'s or platonic friends of either party might take sides, calling for the ban of the other. Or that there would be at least some folks who wanted both "banned". From future bashes. From other bashes, halfway across the country. From this board, etc...

Or, then again, maybe not. Maybe there wouldn't be any kind of response like that. I mean, I'm just conceding that I can at least imagine-it. But, do you suppose, in any of those scenarios, could we or should we expect to see the type of response we see here, in this and the other thread, about this current and very real situation as we're discussing it? Would any of those types of (hypothetical) scenarios guarantee to resonate in quite the same way as this (real) one does for at least a significant portion of this community?

If you can honestly and with a straight face answer "yes" to those questions; then, suffice it to say that, the line I'm talking about is really, basically, invisible for you. And that's not a knock on you, it's just matter of what you can or can't see. On the other hand, if you say "No," then why is that? I mean, in these hypothetical scenarios, not only are talking about actual crime, per se; but, more significantly, personal safety. So, why don't those types of threats (and our leadership's inaction in response) have the same power to shake the foundations on which this is all built?

Maybe you're saying it even better than I could.
Ok, you win. Your opinion is right, and my opinion, since you don't really even seem to be reading what I'm saying, is wrong.

Quite honestly, the only thing that I feel should get people banned from this online web board is fat hate. Everything else, as far as I'm concerned, should be allowed to stay and peoples words can speak for them. That's my opinion, you don't have to like it, but there it is.
 

Deven

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Ok, you win. Your opinion is right, and my opinion, since you don't really even seem to be reading what I'm saying, is wrong.

Quite honestly, the only thing that I feel should get people banned from this online web board is fat hate. Everything else, as far as I'm concerned, should be allowed to stay and peoples words can speak for them. That's my opinion, you don't have to like it, but there it is.
I hope they do that if someone does something illegal to you from the forum... and I hope this is quoted multiple times.

Edit: This happened on Breaking Benjamin's website. They banned the chick, and they had just as many members as Dims... just sayin'.
 

fatgirlflyin

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I hope they do that if someone does something illegal to you from the forum... and I hope this is quoted multiple times.
Why do you hope it gets quoted multiple times? Because having a differing opinion makes me the bad guy? I'm secure in my beliefs and in who I am, so if people think poorly of me for having an opinion that seems to differ from so many here, I think I can live with that.

I think the guy is a dick, and I feel awful that the OP was taken advantage of, but I think everyone here knows just how effective banning someone on a web board actually is. All they have to do is create a new username with a different IP address and presto, new guy in the community who gets a fresh start.
 

mango

Mustachio Nut
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Quite honestly, the only thing that I feel should get people banned from this online web board is fat hate. Everything else, as far as I'm concerned, should be allowed to stay and peoples words can speak for them. That's my opinion, you don't have to like it, but there it is.
How is stealing money from a fat girl while taking advantage of her NOT fat hate?


BTW I'm not one calling for him to be banned. Just outed & named publicly and free discussion to follow (no locked threads as what originally happened here).


:cool:
 

fatgirlflyin

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How is stealing money from a fat girl while taking advantage of her NOT fat hate?


BTW I'm not one calling for him to be banned. Just outed & named publicly and free discussion to follow (no locked threads as what originally happened here).


:cool:
Would it be thin hate if he did it to a skinny girl? He's an ass and he made a dick move, but I dont think it had anything specific to do with her being fat.

I'm all for outing and naming him publicy, forewarned is forarmed and all that.
 

russianrobot

Idle Chatter
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How is stealing money from a fat girl while taking advantage of her NOT fat hate?


BTW I'm not one calling for him to be banned. Just outed & named publicly and free discussion to follow (no locked threads as what originally happened here).


:cool:
Would it be thin hate if he did it to a skinny girl? He's an ass and he made a dick move, but I dont think it had anything specific to do with her being fat.

I'm all for outing and naming him publicy, forewarned is forarmed and all that.
She kinda has a point here
 

moore2me

Lions don't need to spank
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This obviously controversial thread has some underlying problems that are causing strife in our community.

1. When a crime is committed that crosses state lines and country lines the laws are almost nil. The laws that do exist are extremely complicated. Also when crimes happen involving the internet, the laws are also slim and vary widly from country to country. Just trying to conduct a legitimate business around the world takes a legal mastermind.

2. What some men are missing in this crime is that women tend to look at this more of a violation of our person. When we trust a man enough to take him in as a friend and closer friend, we are putting our heart and our softer side in a position of trust. When the same guy rips our emotional trust to shreds, it hurts our soul - no just our pocketbook. It is like he is walking all over our emotions and pissing on our world. Losing money is bad enough, losing "face" or being taken for a "sucker" by someone we thought we could trust, hurts even more.


3. What to do with the culprit? Ultimately, this does not rest with me - thankfully. However, here's some suggestions I like . . . .

- Use the "Star Chamber" technique. Have a group of women judge him, sentence him, and maybe even carry out the group's ruling, or
- Use the "Scarlet Letter" approach. Brand the guy with his crime and make him wear it as punishment.
 

Ample Pie

Fattitude Problem
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For the record, stealing from me and simply hurting my pocketbook is enough...my heart doesn't need to be involved in any way and if you use Dims to do that...well, it's a board matter.
 

Forgotten_Futures

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There are threads all over this forum where people do just that; this is a silly reason to give for closing a thread down. Silly and obvious.
For the record, the system keeps track of where you quote from. And that 'quote' of Conrad redirects to a thread about the discussion of video games.

Your credibility goes down when you start putting words in peoples' mouths.

Just saying.
 

MrSensible

Welcome to Moonside.
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For the record, the system keeps track of where you quote from. And that 'quote' of Conrad redirects to a thread about the discussion of video games.

Your credibility goes down when you start putting words in peoples' mouths.

Just saying.
It's the last post in this thread. She quoted it properly, word for word.

Maybe not jump to conclusions next time. "Just saying."
 

CleverBomb

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It's the last post in this thread. She quoted it properly, word for word.

Maybe not jump to conclusions next time. "Just saying."
Specifically: correct quote, bad link.
The link in MrSensible's post is the one intended.

Testing your links from within the preview page can help with this sort of thing.

-Rusty
 

James

vibeout
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Miranda! I'm so sorry to read this... how übercrap! (great song though...)

I haven't read all the responses so apologies if I'm repeating something someone else has already but it seems to me that Fez didn't use the board to carry out the crime so I don't think that the board and mods have neither a reason nor a responsibility to act against Fez. Sure, it is a matter for discussion but bottom line is that, in terms of taking any 'official' action, I think it is only a police matter (and a serious one at that !).

The situation seems quite different from what Substantia appeared to be talking about which was the board being used as a tool for a crime. Clearly a quite different situation where there is an onus on the board and the mods to take an appropriate action.
 

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