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Flutterby68

My Cups Runneth Over
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I know I haven't been here long, but I've lurked for a while, read a lot, posted some. And I'm even more confused now than when I first came here.

On a friend’s recommendation, I visited and joined here, because it is specifically for the promotion of fat acceptance. After all, all people regardless of size should be accepted exactly as they are. But we all know that in reality that doesn’t happen. So… I went to this site, hoping it would help me to feel better about myself.

There is a HUGE difference between fat acceptance and fat GLORIFICATION. By no means do I think that an 800 lb person is any less deserving of being accepted exactly as he/she is, but I also don't think that being an 800 lb person is a laudable goal, either. Personal choice is important, but where are the lines drawn?

ANY discussion of weight loss is discouraged to the point of almost being forbidden. You can talk about your weight fluctuations, and about trying to be as healthy as possible at whatever weight you are, but talking about losing weight is largely prohibited. But if you want to talk about GAINING weight, that's a whole 'nother story. There are instructions on how to gain weight, and posts that talk about people's weight gain progress, etc. but if someone wants to talk about their weight LOSS journey, that's frowned upon, KWIM?

I am all for fat acceptance. I would love to be accepted by others exactly as I am, whether I lose a pound or not. But I find it very difficult to deal with this fat glorification, particularly as it can and often does come at the expense of health, life expectancy, AND the denigration of the average-sized.

I’m a minority, it seems. A small sized BBW who not only doesn’t want to gain more weight, but doesn’t want to be a BBW in the first place. It almost feels like there is no place in the universe for me. In the average-sized world, I’m a cow. In the message board world, I’m a too-little skinny thing that needs a plate of sandwiches and vat of ice cream. I have to say it’s very unnerving.

Does anybody else know what I mean, or understand why I feel this way? This is something that has been going through my head for quite a while, and I'm having difficulty getting a mental handle on it.

Help :(
 

Melian

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Anna,

I think the idea is that there are thousands of other forums where you can complain about being fat, document weightloss, etc and have tons of support from other people.

This is meant to be a more positive alternative. Look in the BBW forum - not everyone LOVES being fat all of the time (or even most of the time, in many cases), but they all wish to enjoy their lives and minimize negative feelings.

Another goal is to promote acceptance of all fat people, including those who may wish to lose weight. However, it sort of defeats this purpose to have threads full of negative comments about being fat.

I'm not trying to say that you are wrong for feeling this way - just trying to explain why (I think, at least) you're not seeing what you feel you should see on this site.
 

Gingembre

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Anna,

I think the idea is that there are thousands of other forums where you can complain about being fat, document weightloss, etc and have tons of support from other people.

This is meant to be a more positive alternative. Look in the BBW forum - not everyone LOVES being fat all of the time (or even most of the time, in many cases), but they all wish to enjoy their lives and minimize negative feelings.

Another goal is to promote acceptance of all fat people, including those who may wish to lose weight. However, it sort of defeats this purpose to have threads full of negative comments about being fat.

I'm not trying to say that you are wrong for feeling this way - just trying to explain why (I think, at least) you're not seeing what you feel you should see on this site.
I would say you have summed it up pretty much perfectly :bow:
 

Santaclear

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....Does anybody else know what I mean, or understand why I feel this way? This is something that has been going through my head for quite a while, and I'm having difficulty getting a mental handle on it.

Help :(
That's a healthy response to this site, Flutterby, those are all valid points and I think more than a few people probably feel the same way. I'd say you should take whatever it is you find good or need here and discard the rest.
 

Tad

Dimensions' loiterer
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I third what Melian said, but I'll also add that you are far from alone in your feelings....certain threads go into this at length (and with considerable heat). Your reaction is certainly an entirely valid response to Dimensions.

I would expect that you'll get some PMs with private support as well as more public support. If by some wild chance you don't, PM me and I'll point you in the direction of some people who share your feelings.
 

Flutterby68

My Cups Runneth Over
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Anna,

I think the idea is that there are thousands of other forums where you can complain about being fat, document weightloss, etc and have tons of support from other people.

This is meant to be a more positive alternative. Look in the BBW forum - not everyone LOVES being fat all of the time (or even most of the time, in many cases), but they all wish to enjoy their lives and minimize negative feelings.

Another goal is to promote acceptance of all fat people, including those who may wish to lose weight. However, it sort of defeats this purpose to have threads full of negative comments about being fat.

I'm not trying to say that you are wrong for feeling this way - just trying to explain why (I think, at least) you're not seeing what you feel you should see on this site.
Honestly, it's not even that I'm not seeing what I feel I should see. I am seeing a lot of what I feel I SHOULDN'T see. There's such a big difference between fat acceptance and fat glorification. But also... why can't there be something in the middle? Or something that shows BOTH sides rather than just one.

If you're going to have a huge group of people egging someone on to not only be very large but to get even larger, where that is accepted, glorified and encouraged, then why can't there be acceptance, glorification and encouragement for the other side of the coin??? You say that finding that is all over the internet but that's not necessarily the case. There are sites for weight loss but they concentrate on the goal of the LOSS, not the process or the acceptance of current self.

You have plus-sized models posting pics of their bodies and glorifying their 50 lb weight gain. Fine... where are the pictures of the women posting pics of their 50 lb weight LOSS?

I guess I figured that a "fat acceptance" site would accept both side of the issue, not promote one while either ignoring or belittling the other.
 

Zoom

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You have plus-sized models posting pics of their bodies and glorifying their 50 lb weight gain. Fine... where are the pictures of the women posting pics of their 50 lb weight LOSS?
On every other board on the face of the planet.
 

thatgirl08

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No snark here, but can you explain to me why you think fat acceptance would include glorification of weight loss?
 

Flutterby68

My Cups Runneth Over
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No snark here, but can you explain to me why you think fat acceptance would include glorification of weight loss?
Because ACCEPTANCE of being fat isn't the same as wanting to remain that way. Just like I'm sure there are skinny women out there who accept that they are skinny and don't want to remain that way. I thought this was a SIZE acceptance site.. which to me means acceptance of ALL sizes, not just those with a certain dress size or higher.

I guess I'm equating a lot of what I see here with the extreme negativity towards obesity that I see out in the world. Out in the world, people are VERY anti fat, anti weight gain, anti size. Here I've noticed the opposite extreme, which is very anti weight-loss, anti thin and/or anti average size.

Why does it have to be so one sided?? If fat people are asking to be accepted and treated well... then go out and perpetuate the same stigma and derision toward the average-sized (or those who would like to attain that size), doesn't that seem counter productive?
 

thatgirl08

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If acceptance of being fat isn't the same as wanting to remain fat, if they are two separate things.. then why would fat acceptance include the glorification of weight loss?

I get what you're saying as far as the anti-weight loss attitude at Dims but I honestly think that has a lot more to do with how this site represents itself than an accurate depicition of the members that participate here.
 

TraciJo67

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Anna, I would like to see more tolerance for people who come to a point where they feel that they need to lose weight, because that is a part of the fat experience too, for some of us. A lot of people who participate here feel emotionally vested in Dims, in the friends they've made, and they want to share their lives ... all aspects of it, not just the wonderful parts of being fat and/or being admired for being fat. FWIW, I have shared my weight loss experience, and I have never personally felt censored or alienated because of it, although I know that others have different perspectives.

One aspect of Dims that I do appreciate, and enjoy, is that anti-fat sentiment is not tolerated. Some people feel that they get enough of that when they step away from their computers, why embrace it here? I get that, I really do. There are many places to go for people who want to discuss their diets and weight loss efforts, and that in particular ... IMO, doesn't really belong here. A discussion of health issues, decisions that need to be made, experiences along the way -- in the WLS forum, not here on the main board -- is, I think, generally well accepted here. I know that some people, like you, feel even that is dubious; but I can only speak for my own experiences. I don't recall ever being told that I couldn't discuss mine, but then, I'm usually pretty careful to contain them to the WLS forum.

(And I know that you aren't talking about WLS and, if memory serves, you in fact don't approve of the procedure -- but that forum has become the catch-all for discussions of weight loss in general).
 

Zoom

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We only became a size-acceptance forum quite recently. Until then, we were "merely" fat-positive. A lot of the habits from the olden forums have been dying hardly.

Personally, I don't see why you couldn't post pictures about a weight loss you were happy for, or proud of, so long as you don't try to exercise moral control and tell the BBWs that they're only BW and should lose weight.

But this can be a problem. I don't see the pro-weight-loss sites' forums being this liberal with allowing FAs to post pictures of their fat girlfriends. They'll call us "a negative influence" on the diet/exercise/medical industrial complex and delete our posts and threads and ban our accounts.

Until matters change, we must deal with the ugly reality of this double standard and work a solution out, if one can be.

Oh, and I forgot one thing. I am dealing every day at work and elsewhere with anti-fat bigotry and propaganda. I have reached the point where I would rather create my own anti-anti-fat counterpropaganda than just play defense the rest of my stress-shortened life. This tends to spill over into my attitudes online. Perhaps others here are feeling the same way?
 

bbwsrule

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Honestly, it's not even that I'm not seeing what I feel I should see. I am seeing a lot of what I feel I SHOULDN'T see. There's such a big difference between fat acceptance and fat glorification. But also... why can't there be something in the middle? Or something that shows BOTH sides rather than just one.

If you're going to have a huge group of people egging someone on to not only be very large but to get even larger, where that is accepted, glorified and encouraged, then why can't there be acceptance, glorification and encouragement for the other side of the coin??? You say that finding that is all over the internet but that's not necessarily the case. There are sites for weight loss but they concentrate on the goal of the LOSS, not the process or the acceptance of current self.

You have plus-sized models posting pics of their bodies and glorifying their 50 lb weight gain. Fine... where are the pictures of the women posting pics of their 50 lb weight LOSS?

I guess I figured that a "fat acceptance" site would accept both side of the issue, not promote one while either ignoring or belittling the other.
I do think you have some valid points, and the other answers cover the bases pretty well. I would say these things:

1. I personally think it is none of my business what any woman
(except to some extent my wife) weighs or wants to weigh. That
should be entirely up to the woman in question. I do favor
acceptance of all body types and weights.

2. I do enjoy a lot, as a FA, the larger female form. I know I will see
a lot of that on this site. Above all else I think that this a forum
where FA's (& BBW's/BHM's) are accepted makes this site so great.

3. There is a difference between fat acceptance and fat "glorification"
as you call it. There are plenty of areas of the site that talk about
fat acceptance. There is a spectrum of fat "glorification" depending
on how large an FA wants a lover to be and how much they are willing
to let practical matters (i.e. health and mobility) change their
perspective. And, it should be apparent that a reasonable number
of fat people who post on this site are happy with their bodies but
would probably not call it "glorification".

4. Women in general, and fat women in particular, seem to get so
beaten down about their bodies by society in general that it is
really refreshing for a BBW to see they have a number of admirers.
I certainly understand a BBW wanting to lose weight for any reason
but I wouldn't want it to be because they couldn't conceive or accept
that some men would find them attractive that way.

5. This is a site where fat is celebrated. So it attracts people with that
perspective or those trying to get to this perspective (to whatever
degree). If someone was interested in losing all excess weight I
would wonder what they would find so attractive about this site.

6. Finally, I personally have not encouraged anyone to gain but have
given compliments to the many BBW's who post pix here, whether they
are gaining or not. I don't want a woman to have the impression that
they would be attractive IF ONLY....(whatever fits).
 

rainyday

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I'd say you should take whatever it is you find good or need here and discard the rest.
This. It would be a big mistake to think everyone here is a proponent of the full range of things discussed here. Many, including myself, participate in the parts we can get on board with and side-step around the rest.
 

Jon Blaze

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Because ACCEPTANCE of being fat isn't the same as wanting to remain that way. Just like I'm sure there are skinny women out there who accept that they are skinny and don't want to remain that way. I thought this was a SIZE acceptance site.. which to me means acceptance of ALL sizes, not just those with a certain dress size or higher.

I guess I'm equating a lot of what I see here with the extreme negativity towards obesity that I see out in the world. Out in the world, people are VERY anti fat, anti weight gain, anti size. Here I've noticed the opposite extreme, which is very anti weight-loss, anti thin and/or anti average size.

Why does it have to be so one sided?? If fat people are asking to be accepted and treated well... then go out and perpetuate the same stigma and derision toward the average-sized (or those who would like to attain that size), doesn't that seem counter productive?

This forum covers a lot of things up to and including Fat Acceptance. The thing is: Not all users agree with the added things (Or Fat Acceptance for that matter), just like the users on any other forum really. Everyone has views that may go for or against what the goal of a forum is.

There's a lot of separate issues. Fat Acceptance is not the same as size acceptance, which is not the same as Fat Admiration, which is not the same as feederism, and the terms are so open that they almost mean different things for different people.

I wouldn't even say in general, but some people tend to think that wanting to change flies right in the face of acceptance of oneself, and that goes for forums like this, as well as the strictly activist side of things. That being why you might feel out of place regardless.

A lot of the views of the forum goers do not drastically differ from that of Fat or Size activists (Whether there is personal effect or just coincidence). They might not have a negative attitude about it for example, but they may not want to hear about it as well. Not wanting to hear it and outright hating it are two very different things.

The webmasters belief is that because of the societal pressures/stigma used in an attempt to elicit weight loss are so strong, and because there are so many forums dedicated to weight loss already (I personally have seen a few that do have that acceptance angle, albeit less common), he doesn't believe this is a place for that kind of talk to be allowed.

I'm not anti-thin though,and am surely not the only one. I'm pro body acceptance. I've never encouraged a person to gain weight (Lose in the past yes, but now? No), and while I often think the schools of thought should be separated (Because they really are different), I'm not glorifying anything. I accept people thin or fat the way they are, and I admire women ranging from those levels as well. I respect people that want to change in either direction.


- The users again have different balances to their views, but the forum is separated fairly well, and can surely be changed more if need be. I don't think you can say that because dimensions caters to people that are into gaining for erotic purposes that it changes the whole framework of the forum to that specific goal. It's kinda like saying because the lounge has more posts than any other forum, dimensions is about off topic discussion. I'm sure you don't mean anything like that, however, I have to express concurrence with Santaclears point. There's some good and bad in everyone's view. I personally don't go to the x section, but it's separated well enough that I don't have to worry about running into posts from that forum that I don't like.
 

swamptoad

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This forum covers a lot of things up to and including Fat Acceptance. The thing is: Not all users agree with the added things (Or Fat Acceptance for that matter), just like the users on any other forum really. Everyone has views that may go for or against what the goal of a forum is.

There's a lot of separate issues. Fat Acceptance is not the same as size acceptance, which is not the same as Fat Admiration, which is not the same as feederism, and the terms are so open that they almost mean different things for different people.

I wouldn't even say in general, but some people tend to think that wanting to change flies right in the face of acceptance of oneself, and that goes for forums like this, as well as the strictly activist side of things. That being why you might feel out of place regardless.

A lot of the views of the forum goers do not drastically differ from that of Fat or Size activists (Whether there is personal effect or just coincidence). They might not have a negative attitude about it for example, but they may not want to hear about it as well. Not wanting to hear it and outright hating it are two very different things.

The webmasters belief is that because of the societal pressures/stigma used in an attempt to elicit weight loss are so strong, and because there are so many forums dedicated to weight loss already (I personally have seen a few that do have that acceptance angle, albeit less common), he doesn't believe this is a place for that kind of talk to be allowed.

I'm not anti-thin though,and am surely not the only one. I'm pro body acceptance. I've never encouraged a person to gain weight (Lose in the past yes, but now? No), and while I often think the schools of thought should be separated (Because they really are different), I'm not glorifying anything. I accept people thin or fat the way they are, and I admire women ranging from those levels as well. I respect people that want to change in either direction.


- The users again have different balances to their views, but the forum is separated fairly well, and can surely be changed more if need be. I don't think you can say that because dimensions caters to people that are into gaining for erotic purposes that it changes the whole framework of the forum to that specific goal. It's kinda like saying because the lounge has more posts than any other forum, dimensions is about off topic discussion. I'm sure you don't mean anything like that, however, I have to express concurrence with Santaclears point. There's some good and bad in everyone's view. I personally don't go to the x section, but it's separated well enough that I don't have to worry about running into posts from that forum that I don't like.
Excellent points!
 

Jes

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Flutter--I, too, had some things to work through after I became a member of Dims. It wasn't what I thought it would be and the sooner I realized that, and moved on, the better. And I mean I moved on to the parts I liked or at least tolerated. In my opinion, Dims is not just a fat positive site, but a fat promotion one, too (in some posts, in some threads). The mix of porn here changes things up, too.

I would think it would be hard to have a fat positive site that includes the things you're talking about, just like it would be hard to have a ...I don't know if it'd be a weightloss board that would be the opposite of Dims, but let's just say that to make it easier--weightloss board that includes the positive Dims things you're talking about. Seriously--what would that animal look like, to you? I can't picture it.

One of the problems in both of the types of sites I mentioned above is that they are fat related. Fat. It's an inanimate thing. If either site was devoted to PEOPLE (who are fat or not, gaining or losing, happy or not), you might get the more balanced mix you're talking about in your post. The primacy of fat, here, means whole, fully realized, human beings (fat or not, gaining or losing, happy or not) take a back seat, I think.
 

jenboo

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I know I haven't been here long, but I've lurked for a while, read a lot, posted some. And I'm even more confused now than when I first came here.

On a friend’s recommendation, I visited and joined here, because it is specifically for the promotion of fat acceptance. After all, all people regardless of size should be accepted exactly as they are. But we all know that in reality that doesn’t happen. So… I went to this site, hoping it would help me to feel better about myself.

There is a HUGE difference between fat acceptance and fat GLORIFICATION. By no means do I think that an 800 lb person is any less deserving of being accepted exactly as he/she is, but I also don't think that being an 800 lb person is a laudable goal, either. Personal choice is important, but where are the lines drawn?

ANY discussion of weight loss is discouraged to the point of almost being forbidden. You can talk about your weight fluctuations, and about trying to be as healthy as possible at whatever weight you are, but talking about losing weight is largely prohibited. But if you want to talk about GAINING weight, that's a whole 'nother story. There are instructions on how to gain weight, and posts that talk about people's weight gain progress, etc. but if someone wants to talk about their weight LOSS journey, that's frowned upon, KWIM?

I am all for fat acceptance. I would love to be accepted by others exactly as I am, whether I lose a pound or not. But I find it very difficult to deal with this fat glorification, particularly as it can and often does come at the expense of health, life expectancy, AND the denigration of the average-sized.

I’m a minority, it seems. A small sized BBW who not only doesn’t want to gain more weight, but doesn’t want to be a BBW in the first place. It almost feels like there is no place in the universe for me. In the average-sized world, I’m a cow. In the message board world, I’m a too-little skinny thing that needs a plate of sandwiches and vat of ice cream. I have to say it’s very unnerving.

Does anybody else know what I mean, or understand why I feel this way? This is something that has been going through my head for quite a while, and I'm having difficulty getting a mental handle on it.

Help :(
Try being a ssbbw and then get back to your rambling. At least you have a bbw forum to talk in. I don't have a place here for people my size. I see women like you commenting about being one of the few that are too small here, well try being a minority in not only the world but the fat acceptance community. How often have you had to ask for a chair that has no arms, or try to get an MRI but cannot because your legs are too fat. Are you able to get on a stool to change you light bulbs, well I am not able to an so am living in a darker apartment than it should be. How often have you read on a size acceptance web board that fat is fine but bad when it gets to be too fat or has health consequences. I am ssbbw, there are health consequences so does that mean I should try not to be so fat? I have been dieting since I was 7 and it sure as hell has not made me any healthier and I would love to not be so fat, but at this time it is not feasible for whatever reason cause let me tell you had I a choice I would never have gotten to the size I am. Cry me a river for being too small a bbw for dimensions, try being too big a bbw for a place like this. Have you ever been tormented for just being you at a stop light? When you have tasted a bit of my life then try to get a mental handle on that.
 

katorade

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Try being a ssbbw and then get back to your rambling. At least you have a bbw forum to talk in. I don't have a place here for people my size. I see women like you commenting about being one of the few that are too small here, well try being a minority in not only the world but the fat acceptance community. How often have you had to ask for a chair that has no arms, or try to get an MRI but cannot because your legs are too fat. Are you able to get on a stool to change you light bulbs, well I am not able to an so am living in a darker apartment than it should be. How often have you read on a size acceptance web board that fat is fine but bad when it gets to be too fat or has health consequences. I am ssbbw, there are health consequences so does that mean I should try not to be so fat? I have been dieting since I was 7 and it sure as hell has not made me any healthier and I would love to not be so fat, but at this time it is not feasible for whatever reason cause let me tell you had I a choice I would never have gotten to the size I am. Cry me a river for being too small a bbw for dimensions, try being too big a bbw for a place like this. Have you ever been tormented for just being you at a stop light? When you have tasted a bit of my life then try to get a mental handle on that.
I'm pretty sure a mod will be contacting you shortly about options you do have here that are far more SSBBW-friendly than you currently think.

In the meantime, Flutterby's experience as a fat woman is no greater or lesser than your own, as everyone experiences life differently. I'm sorry for your hardships, but your post was uncalled for.
 

Surlysomething

In Remembrance
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I'm pretty sure a mod will be contacting you shortly about options you do have here that are far more SSBBW-friendly than you currently think.

In the meantime, Flutterby's experience as a fat woman is no greater or lesser than your own, as everyone experiences life differently. I'm sorry for your hardships, but your post was uncalled for.
You took the words right out of my mouth. ;)
 

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