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Discussion in 'Weighty Fine Arts' started by RVGleason, May 20, 2008.
Thought I'd post and share a few older Tiny & Edie cartoons here.
Here's a pre-Edie Tiny cartoon.
I'll post this again, in a slightly less "Fire and brimstone" manner.
Your stuff is not really all that good, I highly suggest that you study actual anatomy, or at the very least, stop using piss-poor conception of the human figure in your pictures.
Also, MSpaint is a good program, but only if used properly.
All in all, I give your stuff a 2/10.
Which means you need quite a bit of work.
From your number of post so far, you haven't been on this board long, have you? I've been posting my cartoons for years and folks here know my work. What I may lack in drawing finesse, I compensate with humor aimed at the FFA/BHM community who on the whole appreciate my silly little cartoons.
I have a Yahoo group dedicated to my cartoons and I have a sizable membership there. I also post the cartoons on the FFA/BHM Discussion board here and have had favorable comments on them for the humor. I never claimed to be a good artist, but my humor makes up for what the cartoons lack on a more aesthetic level.
I'm a veteran of the board since it's original configuration years ago, and you're fairly new. Go to the BHM Board to check out my more recent cartoons or the 'Big Guts' cartoon I just did which is posted in the Fine Arts thread. Also check out my Yahoo group, which you can find the link off on my profile. I've done several stories and a few full length cartoon stories that were well received. You can find them on my Yahoo group too.
I don't mind constructive criticism, but I don't take kindly to rude remarks from a young pup.
Here's a link to an early Tiny cartoon I posted on the BHM Board with some positive comments from folks who 'got it'.
When you say "Comedy", I really hope that your using the term lightly...
PLEASE tell me that you do not honestly think that this drivel is humorous just because it's simple word play...
Even Dave Chappel, one of the worst comedians I've ever had the misfortune to hear was better than this material.
Hell, even the most recent Garfield comics are funnier, and they're created by a soulless corporation that just wants to sell more shoddy merchandise to the weak-minded populace.
As for the number of posts, that has nothing to do with my creditability, it's just that I haven't had anything I needed to state upon this forum before.
Then there's the fact that you call me a young pup, which might be true, I'm only twenty, but that does not change the fact that I have a right to an opinion, and the fact that your discrediting it base upon my age and status within these sites does not sit well, and only expose you for the insignificant buffoon that you are.
Edit: After looking at that post, I've noticed that they "Positive" comments were the cheap words of those who have nothing to say, but feel the need to speak up anyway.
Those kinds of people sicken me, for they are what cause many mediocre artists(and quite a few below that level as well) to halt their artistic training, causing more and more of the same piss-poor material to be spread through out the internet.
My cartoons were always meant to be on the 'cute' side, and are not to be taken seriously. I don't subscribe to crude humor because I've always felt that's a cheap way to get laughs.
I've been posting on this board for years and on the whole comments on my cartoons have been very positive. The moderators of this board have been very supportive of my work over the years because they know that I aim them at a specific audience of the board which appreciates them. As previously mentioned, I've been with this board almost since it's beginnings in it's original configuration.
I like using puns as I find that's a fun way to get the humor over. The cartoons were meant to be fun and silly and nothing more. Putting down the audience the cartoons were meant for is not going to endear you on this board.
By the way, my 2005 join date is a reference to this board being reconfigured about that time. I've been posting on this board since the 1990's. When the board was reconfigured everyone who had been members previously had to re-register.
First off that has absolutely NOTHING to do with the current conversation, also it's quite rude to double-post, if you must add more text to a thread that you've just posted on, why don't you just use the edit button?
But I digress.
I'm not saying that crude humor is good, I personally abhor that sort of thing because it's too common place now a days, but in a way the material that you use is a different version of crude humor.
The jokes that I've seen so far have been base and unpolished, combine this with the artistic quality of this sort of thing, if these pictures were not circulated long before my intergeretion with this sort of crowd(way back when people actually used Yahoo groups for stuff other then poorly doctored photographs, pictures of old trailer-trash "BBW" who use the second B without much of a reason, and text file porn-ads), I'd have wagered that you were my junior by at least fifteen years.
As for those comments that you've received, have they ever given you ideas on how to improve upon your craft? Write new jokes? Think twice before submitting a half-finished picture?
Let me answer that for you, No, they have not, since they are what are known as "Empty Praise" comments, or as some call it "Hug comments".
This alone invalidates your opinion about comedy.
You complain about people that have nothing to say but feel the need to speak up anyway, ok pot meet Mr. kettle. With only two posts this is the one HUGE issue on your mind that just needed to be addressed? I wish my life was so unencumbered that my biggest problem that I needed to talk about was the "Comedy" that I didn't think was funny.
Cartoons are not supposed to be exact replications of the human form. How many cartoons show characters with only four fingers? Where is your outrage?
Personally the cartoons that RV has made are not my cup of tea. When I look in the paper, I only really enjoy maybe a tenth of the strips that I've seen. But I would never slam someone for anything they create because:
1. I'm not artistic and couldn't do a better job. (Can you? Let's see.)
2. Anyone that creates something is putting themselves out there to be judged, and by trashing their art you are trashing them personally.
I shall answer these in the sequence that I've received them.
First off, I was not stating that Dave Chappel was funny, just that he puts a little more effort into his work.
Personally, I hate the bastard for making it almost acceptable to call a woman a "Bitch" in general public, without such a feeling of shame and remorse for doing so.
Once again, my post count has NOTHING to do with my creditability, I just have not had anything to say since I joined this forum, DUE TO THE FACT THAT I DO NOT SPEAK UNLESS I HAVE SOMETHING THAT I FEEL NEEDS TO BE SAID!
Honestly, I don't see why this comes as a shock to most people, I always thought it was the best policy.
Well, I admit that's true, but it's not what I'm getting at, since they do it as a certain ART STYLE, where as this is laziness that looks like someone abused the circle and curve tool, and not in the good way(trust me, some people can do it well, this is not one of those cases)
My talent is in something a tad to complicated for you to grasp, it's known as WRITING, as for the stuff that I do not post here, it's because they're not the sort of thing that belongs on such a forum.
Observer has tried to talk me into writing a story for this forum, which normally I would give it the old college try, but I've been dealt a crushing blow known as writer's block that was brought on upon me by a ungrateful little wench who took the thing that I worked hard upon and didn't fulfill her part of the trade which was publicity for a new story series that I'm trying to get off the ground.
Ergo, you do not have any right to talk down to me just because you've decided not to ASK me POLITELY for what credentials I had to be a CRITIC.
Now kindly, GTFO.
Oh for heaven's sake, earthly....this isn't an art board. The cartoons ar just a bit of fun, something to make people chuckle/smile to thenselves. If they're not to your taste, or you just don't like then, don't look at them. Simple as.
P.S. My mummy always told me "if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all". You appear to have missed that lesson.
OK, since my name is being dragged into this discussion I think the referenced PM exchange should be given proper context.
Earthlykaiser has a deviantarts website under another name which he referenced in a PM; he stated to me that the stories there are not, by his own analysis, suitable for the WR collection.
After reviewing them I agreed.
At the same time I extended to him the courtesy of acknowledging his abilities and telling him that he should feel free to submit any future stories that do meet our criteria. This same offer, of course, applies to all who pass this way.
Now, as to the present controversy . . .
The Dimensions library has a diverse number of contributors in a variety of sub-genres. It is natural that people will have different tastes and that different contributors will find different audiences. RV Gleason is one of these and is a member in good standing of the Dimensions Writers Guild; he has a following and both his efforts and the tastes of those who like them are to be respected - just as are those of others.
The posted rules for these forums, found here, are very clear on story comments (and by derivation, fine arts contributions) very plain and specific:
Some words of advice: Before coming into a new community, real or virtual, and criticizing the established order of things there is always a good protocol to follow. That is to spend a little time first researching what is considered proper behavior and custom. Once you understand the expectations of the culture and why things are as they are you will have a better chance of avoiding conflict.
RVGleason, whose very screen name is a comedic satire reference most of us understand, is a respected long term member of this community. He doesn't need me a moderator to stand up in his defense. But insults and name-calling, as stated in the citation above, will not be tolerated in these precincts for the sake of others who may be newer and more vulnerable.
For the record, it is also bad form to divulge in public forums things that are said in private messages. I have done so here as an exception to the general rule for one reason: my name was being used in a manner that could be incorrectly construed as showing partiality to one party in a dispute.
"to" is different from "too", look it up.
There IS a difference between "your" and "you're", look that up too. (There's that dreaded too again, hopefully you paid attention to the first line.)
I guess you meant "the Positive" instead of "they Positive"? Sad.
WTF are you talking about? You've been dealt a "crushing blow" because some "wench" didn't get you publicity? That "crushing blow" gave you writers block? Is this "wench" your agent? A girlfriend that took your golden egg for her own use? Do tell! What I really want to know is, what the hell does that have to do with you being a prick in the forums?
Dude, for a writer you certainly don't have even a basic grasp of the English language. I know, it's only an online forum, but don't bash other people for their artistic efforts while making 101 writing errors and calling yourself a writer. Especially when you tell everyone that writing is something that is too complicated for them to grasp. Besides, if you actually are a writer, why are you playing an art critic? Sounds like you can't make up your mind what you want to be when you grow up.
As for your credibility, you have shown more than enough about your (lack of) credibility by the way you write and criticize people. Just telling someone that they suck isn't criticism, it's one person being an ass towards another.
If you are such a good artist or cartoonist, put some of your work up here for us to see. Obviously, you don't have basic writing skills down yet (see above if you have forgotten already), but even that doesn't mean you can't tell a story.
All in all it seems to me that you are a simple minded, shallow and insecure individual that only feels good about yourself when you are putting other people down. Somehow that makes you feel better because you can slam someone else. Maybe you should grow up, not just in age but as a person.
For future reference, I wish to state that when I get pissed off, I start to have some really simple grammar problems.
I am working on fixing that, and being anal retentive about it will only make the problem worse.
I'd like to thank Observer and everyone else on the Dimensions Board for supporting me and my Tiny & Edie cartoons. I'm glad that there are those among the members who understand my silly, little cartoons and the context in which they're written and put together. I appreciate knowing some get a chuckle out of them and that they still bring out a smile.
With Grateful Appreciation,
You rock my man, keep up the good work!
Thanks again, Everyone.
Now, let's get back on topic.
For the record I've always loved your cartoons, RV! They're adorable, cute, and fun, which doesn't require it to be art worthy of hanging in a museum. Geez, the guy who posted such criticism really got his panties in a wad. It's meant to be FUN, so lighten UP, people. Besides just being fun, these cartoons were important to me in discovering and defining my FFAness because I identified on some small level with the female character. THAT is the point, not anatomy, not artwork, no one is getting hot and heavy off this, it's certainly not anything in need of such criticism or analysis. Take it for what it is, nothing more, nothing less. You don't like it, who cares? Lots of people at least enjoy it and obviously RV gets something from it too. Our praise is not empty praise. The people who enjoy it occasionally let him know, don't criticize us for liking something, please. Is it possible that this earthlykaiser person is just mad that they're looking for cartoons to get hot off of and he/she is mad that all they found here is good clean fun? Do yourself a favor and don't have a stroke over a freaking cartoon on the internet. Good grief.
My love of the arts extends to drawing, painting, and animation whether using computers, brushes, pencils, or a wireless mouse or stylus. I also consider writing novels, short stories, plays, poems, and essays an essential part of the arts as well. (Not to exclude music and sculpture, but I'll leave them out for brevity.)
Cartooning is an art form just as much as writing critical essays (Civil Disobedience) and humor is an art form (Richard Pryor) just as much as speeches are (the Gettysburg Address). What differs is how the audience receives the message and how the art stands the test of time. But, as an artist myself, I often indulge in drawing and writing just for my own amusement - nothing else. I am my own audience.
EarthlyKaiser, should consider RVGleason a fellow artist and give him the credit and professional courtesy that this warrants. Just as EK would want extended on his/her behalf. If RVGleason's work is not "your cup of tea", just calmly and professionally walk in a different direction. For example, I find most abstract modern art hard to understand and enjoy - Jackson Pollack for example. But, his work is famous worldwide and his pieces sell for more money than I'll ever see. Many people love his work, just not me. I would never have the "naivity" to criticize Pollack's work.
We should just be happy to see fat people portrayed in a positive, or even silly manner, poking fun at ourselves. I thank RVGleason for his work and encourage you to keep on drawing and cartooning. Lord knows we need all the laughs (or fun) we can get. And, others who want to try their hand at creating cartoons or other art forms - please do so. We'd love to see your work.
Separate names with a comma.