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What kind of messages should be allowed?

  • Positive only! Smiles all around.

  • Positive AND negative! More fun, after all.

  • Negative only! I realize this isn't actually an option, but I'm a jerk.


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ODFFA

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 29, 2012
Messages
1,457
Location
Cape Town, South Africa
While I agree with the vast majority of this post, there are some things about it that I don't agree with - at least not in the same way, perhaps. And it actually bothers me.

Do you really think you are the only one here with a story? Are you the only guy here that had it rough? If sympathy is what you're looking for, then to quote from a long-ago book I read, "Sympathy can be found in the dictionary somewhere in between Shit and Syphilis."
I wonder about this kind of attitude, particularly for a group of people who are so familiar with the concept of bullying and alienation ourselves. Also, yes, there are absolutely some people who have a woe-is-me attitude and of course that kind of thing is really grating on the nerves. But I don't think all the people that have come through here and been given a hard time have been those kinds of people. I believe I have actually seen some that are more balanced than that on the whole, but perhaps were just working through something at that particular time, and have gotten a response like this. I haven't been one of them, but - I'm going to be perfectly honest here - that makes me pretty sad.

Most of the guys on this board likely grew up tormented by those around them, parents, siblings, class mates. Everyone was bullied at some point. The difference is that most of the regulars here figured out how to stand up for themselves and respect themselves and command respect from others.
If you have the wherewithal to stick it out and become a regular poster, great! If not, well then, that is your loss.
I'm not being facetious here, I'm just trying to understand -- are we saying we have no space / time for anyone who is, just as we once were, still in the process of figuring stuff out? And is there really an age cut-off on becoming perfectly assertive?

If you are over the age of majority, then there is no excuse for you to stay anywhere you are not given basic respect.
I found this sentence and ones similar to it kind of interesting, given the things that had been said just prior. Anyone care to shed some light? Again, this is not in the spirit of argumentativeness. I want to know what the thought process is for people behind something like this.

It's not like I'd like us to become the Oprah board or anything, and the observation you started the post with, the dominance of a more masculine culture, is pretty true and it actually made me smile. There's much of that I enjoy. It challenges me at times and I'm a more well-rounded person for it. I just truly cannot stop myself wondering...... aren't we swinging that pendulum too far to the un-empathetic side?
 

Tad

mostly harmless
Joined
Sep 29, 2005
Messages
13,134
Location
The great white north, eh?
While Leo Gibson stated things in pretty assertive manner, to me the summary of his final point was that people here are willing to help those who will help themselves, just not so much those who expect something given to them. I've never seen anyone here kicked for saying that their life sucked, but I have seen it happen when someone not only said that their life sucked, but continued to suggest that there is nothing that they can do about it, and push away suggestions to the contrary.

Empathy says to have sympathy for those is such straights, but at the same time it can be awfully hard to have much sympathy for an Eeyore. From a slightly different slant, both men and women seem to have a lot more patience for helpless seeming women than for helpless seeming men. Sexism, perhaps, but I'm not entirely sure which is the better approach in such cases (well, in reality I'm sure it is a case by case issue, but as a rule of thumb.....?)
 

Amaranthine

Adamant Anti-Nihilist
Joined
Aug 7, 2010
Messages
1,438
Location
,
I definitely agree with what Tad said. One thing that bugs me about this board - and I suppose Dims in general - is that we'll get newcomers who seemed to fade out almost immediately when they don't get a fair amount of attention from the get-go. Rather than persevering and making their personality stand out by contributing to the community. I think a lot of people see Dims as merely a place to "help" them get out of their own issues, and sort-of want that given to them, rather than treating it like a group of new people to interact with and have fun.

And with that being said, here's a few more messages to punctuate the discussion:

Chris & Mary: I am glad you met here and continue to continue...that's a great love story from DIMS BHM board....who else?

daddyoh70: Between your handsome good looks and your incredible personality, I never had a chance...SUCH a huge crush on you from my very first day here.

DJDude: I wish you would post much more and defenitely POST more PHOTOS of your handsome self!!!

Hozay: Does your girlfriend know how much you flirt with other women?

lucc23v2: Way to jump on in and welcome. You seem cool and fun :)

Penguin: you are my favorite Aistralian but I would never tell the other Aussies that. I also wish your daughter was mine. Not just mine, but that she was ours. I absolutely adore her.

SURLYSOMETHING: I really do despise the way you act like you and LEOG have a little something something going on...by your constant signature: Wise words, R. but i suppose it makes you feel better ...because we all know you have a secret allegiance with him..rock on in your OWN MIND girl

Vanilla Gorilla - I've crushed on you for a year now. I think you're incredibly funny, witty and sexy. I believe, to me, you're one of the sexiest men on this board.

Yakatori: Just tell them all to PISS OFF! I know you are secretly laughing when you get them all in a row, now aren't you? Why yes, yes you are. ;)
 

penguin

Fnord
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
5,238
Penguin: you are my favorite Aistralian but I would never tell the other Aussies that. I also wish your daughter was mine. Not just mine, but that she was ours. I absolutely adore her.
Aww that's sweet. I'm pretty sure I know who this is, so if it is who I think it is, we can totally go make a baby:p
 

MrSensible

Welcome to Moonside.
Joined
Apr 15, 2012
Messages
490
Location
,
I agree with most of the points Leo and Tad made, but I've also got to second ODFFA's post as well. As a relatively new guy around here (with a fairly tiny post-count and forum presence) I figured I'd add my own perspective on things.

It's hard to admit it, but I guess I kind of fit in one of Leo's categories. I've always been more of a "sensitive" type (as some of my posts probably highlight), and I'll be the first to admit that I sometimes cross the boundary of "too much info" when I talk about things in my life. At the same time, I would never, never, ever attempt to garner sympathy from anyone, and I certainly would never expect it. I understand full-well that everyone has their own problems and emotional baggage isn't fun for anyone.

I think maybe that some people come to Dims and think it's more of like a support group that fat people and their admirers can go to find acceptance and strength from one another; a place where they can talk out their issues "among friends." In some cases, that's certainly true, but some likely take it too far and expect their personal plight and struggles to be met with open, unmitigated arms. It's an unrealistic expectation and comes down to the "nobody likes an Eeyore" point.

At the same time, like ODDFA said, I think there are times where someone might start a thread or join in on a discussion with the intent to maybe talk some things through and are ultimately shot down about it and given that "get over it" or "man the fuck up" kind of attitude. I personally don't see that tough love approach (if you even want to call it that) as helpful in the slightest. Not everyone comes from the same place and what works for you, might not work for them. To meet a potential cry for help with snide remarks or hostility isn't typically the best way to go about it, in my opinion. Not that this happens a lot of course, but I have observed situations where I feel that it's happened unjustifiably -- particularly towards new male members -- which is understandably followed by either a decrease in posting activity, if not completely. (I don't like bringing the gender thing up but it definitely seems to have some weight (no pun intended) to it on this board.)

I guess what I'm saying is that it doesn't hurt to be a little more accepting and patient with new people, and that includes not being so quick to assume they simply don't belong here. The person just has to be willing to take the steps to help themselves and put forth an effort to be part of the community too. As long as they don't turn every thread or post into their own personal shoulder to cry on, then I don't see anything wrong with anyone (male or female) venting their pain or frustration once in awhile, in the hopes of finding some common ground and maybe getting a little help or advice. Sometimes it just helps to talk it through and everyone should be given the benefit of the doubt, regardless of their post count or the date underneath their username.
 

lucca23v2

Curves for miles
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
2,015
Location
,
lucc23v2: Way to jump on in and welcome. You seem cool and fun :)
Thanks!

On a side note let me just say, if people are mostly up beat and good, and goes through something that they need to chat about, people are more than willing to chat and hep you through it. I don't think that Leo's post was about that. I think his point was for those who have a chronic "Woe is me". They use the boards to get attention. That is when people, and with good reason, get a bit harsh with responses.

I experienced this with a friend. She is one of those "Woe is me." types. When she has an actual problem, I talk it out with her. The rest of the time when she reaches out and is talking nonsense, i tell her, you are cut off until you have an actual problem.

Sometimes you have to be a bit tough in order to get through..

so again Leo...
AMEN!
 

LeoGibson

Happy
Joined
May 22, 2011
Messages
3,493
Location
The Republic
I wonder about this kind of attitude, particularly for a group of people who are so familiar with the concept of bullying and alienation ourselves. Also, yes, there are absolutely some people who have a woe-is-me attitude and of course that kind of thing is really grating on the nerves. But I don't think all the people that have come through here and been given a hard time have been those kinds of people. I believe I have actually seen some that are more balanced than that on the whole, but perhaps were just working through something at that particular time, and have gotten a response like this. I haven't been one of them, but - I'm going to be perfectly honest here - that makes me pretty sad.
Well let me simply say," I'm right, you're wrong, and your just a doody-head!" :D

No, actually you make some really good points, and I probably didn't fully explain myself good enough. I tend to come off a bit aggressive, even when I really don't mean to.

Tad actually summed up the essence of what I was saying and put it out there in a much more diplomatic manner of speaking. If you look around, there are some recent threads by relative newcomers that delve into more personal and sensitive issues, and the responses were all thoughtful, and positive, and somewhat helpful. I'm going on memory here because I'm too lazy to search threads, but generally, when someone posts a thread they are usually given serious responses for the most part, along with some *mild* sarcasm or joking in some instances. I rarely have seen outright hostility. When after being given good responses and someone does the eeyore shuffle and refuses to be accountable or shifts all responsibility to others, then that's usually when the snark comes out. To me it would be akin to something like this I'll use as an illustration to get what I was trying to get across.

Say a fellow posts," Man, I'm stuck in the middle of nowhere in a fishing cabin with nothing to eat and I'm starving but have no way of getting to town and no money to get food."

We then ascertain that he has all the necessary implements to fish, clean, and cook the fish. He gets told how to do everything, along with some slight teasing about not knowing how to fish. He then counters," Well, it's wet, and fish are slimy, and it'd make a mess and my parents won't let me use a knife to clean it, and I really don't like the taste of fish, it's too fishy. But man I'm really hungry, whatever should I do?"

Those are the types that I was referring to. The other ones that get hit pretty hard right off the bat are the ones that take no time to read some older threads and get a feel for the place. They come in like this is POF or some other dating site and in essence go, "Hey, I have a belly, ffa's do exist, let's bone!" That's just poor etiquette, or "netiquette" if you will. IMO, that's only acceptable behavior if you're say, 40's and above. If you're in your 20's, "c'mon man" you grew up online. You should know better.


I'm not being facetious here, I'm just trying to understand -- are we saying we have no space / time for anyone who is, just as we once were, still in the process of figuring stuff out? And is there really an age cut-off on becoming perfectly assertive?
No, that's not what I was advocating at all. There is no age cut-off. I did a poor job I reckon of explaining exactly what it was I was referring to.


I found this sentence and ones similar to it kind of interesting, given the things that had been said just prior. Anyone care to shed some light? Again, this is not in the spirit of argumentativeness. I want to know what the thought process is for people behind something like this.
By age of majority, I am referring to what here in the U.S. is the age of 18. That is when you gain your majority here and are no longer a minor. Which is also the age you have to be to be on this site. IMO, if you are of sound body and mind and are no longer a minor, then if you stay somewhere where you are treated poorly, then you and no one else is to be held accountable for that.

Yes, I know it could be tough going it alone. Yes, you will live in a sketchy area where your likely roommates will be cockroaches and you have better than even odds of being burglarized at some point. Sorry, but you will most likely be low-income at that age and as such you will live where low-income people live. It will be sketchy. You will survive. Most likely. But to my way of thinking, if the choice is living in a shithole in a sketchy area or having creature comforts by putting up with disrespect and staying in a gilded cage of sorts, then I'm taking the sketchy place and the cockroaches. I'd rather live on my terms there than on someone else's in their nice cushy place. A gilded cage is still a cage.

That's what I meant by that. That if you choose to stay where you are mistreated then I have a hard time feeling sorry for you.

Is that a bit callous? Probably. I'm really not though. I am by nature a very empathetic person, but I have zero tolerance for those that aren't willing to put forth an ounce of effort to help themselves. There are too many good people struggling that I can help that are paddling their asses off to get to a good place to waste time on those that are gonna tread water until a magical boat appears and scoops them from the water and puts them on dry land.


.....At the same time, like ODDFA said, I think there are times where someone might start a thread or join in on a discussion with the intent to maybe talk some things through and are ultimately shot down about it and given that "get over it" or "man the fuck up" kind of attitude. I personally don't see that tough love approach (if you even want to call it that) as helpful in the slightest. Not everyone comes from the same place and what works for you, might not work for them. To meet a potential cry for help with snide remarks or hostility isn't typically the best way to go about it, in my opinion. Not that this happens a lot of course, but I have observed situations where I feel that it's happened unjustifiably -- particularly towards new male members -- which is understandably followed by either a decrease in posting activity, if not completely. (I don't like bringing the gender thing up but it definitely seems to have some weight (no pun intended) to it on this board.) ....
There is not one thing wrong with being sensitive. You should be sensitive, that's the way you were designed. There is no shame in that, and if my post came off that way, it was not meant in that spirit.

Now, you have made some great posts, in many a thread, some very salient points on sensitive topics. I can't recall one time where you were ridiculed or belittled. Have you been? I ask, because, you are a poster that joined in and became a contributing member of this forum rather seamlessly from my point of view. It's not about having issues or needing to man up! I don't advocate that either except in the case of those that put forth zero effort or make every excuse as to why they can't do anything for themselves. When someone is really trying to work through things, and are participating back and forth and sharing is going on, I seem to see a bunch of folks being quite positive. Of recent note, there was a thread about eating disorders by a new poster, and it seems like there was frank and honest discussion, with a lot of positivity. That was just one example that comes to my addled mind.

In closing, is this board perfect? Hell no. But I think it can be judged a bit unfairly when told that newcomers have no chance. They do if they actually make an effort. You did, OD did, I did too. I'd like to think I'm better for it.
 

MrSensible

Welcome to Moonside.
Joined
Apr 15, 2012
Messages
490
Location
,
There is not one thing wrong with being sensitive. You should be sensitive, that's the way you were designed. There is no shame in that, and if my post came off that way, it was not meant in that spirit.

Now, you have made some great posts, in many a thread, some very salient points on sensitive topics. I can't recall one time where you were ridiculed or belittled. Have you been? I ask, because, you are a poster that joined in and became a contributing member of this forum rather seamlessly from my point of view. It's not about having issues or needing to man up! I don't advocate that either except in the case of those that put forth zero effort or make every excuse as to why they can't do anything for themselves. When someone is really trying to work through things, and are participating back and forth and sharing is going on, I seem to see a bunch of folks being quite positive. Of recent note, there was a thread about eating disorders by a new poster, and it seems like there was frank and honest discussion, with a lot of positivity. That was just one example that comes to my addled mind.

In closing, is this board perfect? Hell no. But I think it can be judged a bit unfairly when told that newcomers have no chance. They do if they actually make an effort. You did, OD did, I did too. I'd like to think I'm better for it.
Oh no, it's not a personal issue at all. I've never been treated badly or anything. I usually try to be very careful with the stuff I post though while treading lightly on certain topics, and it's partly because I've seen how a communication misstep or misunderstanding can sometimes be handled. I think new members have the worst time of it as they usually don't know how everything works around here and/or aren't always given the same leeway as a well-respected veteran -- even when possibly stating something similar. There's a certain "cliquish" vibe that seems fairly prevalent here and I think it probably intimidates certain people (I guess you could say whoever wrote that anon message is an example.)

At the same time, how can you really complain about something like that? It's only natural that the people that have stuck around for a long time are probably going to be more tight-knit and friendly with one another; that's just how it is. You're right that it takes an effort to be part of the community (or any community, for that matter) so it's not necessarily a bad thing to weed out those who have a harder time accepting that. I really do think that everyone should be given the benefit of the doubt though, and even if they're slow on the up-take on figuring out how things work here, or they're in a position in their life where they've hit rock-bottom and are desperately seeking help and acceptance, they shouldn't be afraid to seek some of that here on this board. I think it just takes longer for some people, even those putting forth the effort to better themselves. Everyone comes from a different place, to varying degrees. That's why I feel patience is so important in those situations and that a welcoming/understanding attitude can go a long way.

You're right though; people aren't normally ever directly mistreated here about that kind of stuff and I could have worded my post better to reflect that. If someone is attacked, they're usually asking for it.

Thanks for the kind words, by the way -- you've made more kick ass posts than I can even count, so the feeling is definitely mutual :).
 

Amaranthine

Adamant Anti-Nihilist
Joined
Aug 7, 2010
Messages
1,438
Location
,
The BHM/FFA Board: Same poster here that said you aren't as tolerant as you would like to think. For the record, I am not a newcomer, I am a regular poster for over a year. I very rarely receive snark myself but I observed that others do.

All the awesomely smart women on this board: Love your big, beautiful, brains!

Amaranthine. If you ever want a job as my smart, beautiful sidekick, who keeps me out of trouble, let me know. I pay a steady wage of hugs. (I'm more likely to get you into MORE trouble. Can there be spandex involved? Because I'd be in.)

Amaranthine: The junior Mother Teresa of the BHM/FFA board. (I barely know how to respond to this one! Thank you for allowing me to relish in the single, solitary time anyone will compare me to Mother Teresa.)

Casting Pearls: It's difficult to decide whether you're fabulous or a pompous know-it-all.

Cobra Verde: What exactly goes on in your head?

Cobra Verde: Maybe if you were a little nicer, your messages would actually get posted! :kiss2:

Gingembre: I love your hair!

Hozay we want to meet your girlfriend!

Hozay: First I thought you were annoying, then that you were funny crazy - by now I respect you. Even pink striped socks can't hide forever that you have brains & soul.

loopy: Please grow up real fast before your next post! Teen reality often has little to do with the real world.

Paquito: Miss your short, to the point posts!

Tad: Your patience and educational zeal are unbelievable.
 

Hozay J Garseeya

Rooder. Crooder. Neuter.
Joined
Apr 15, 2009
Messages
4,160
Location
hozaygarseeya,
Hozay we want to meet your girlfriend.

Hozay: First I thought you were annoying, then that you were funny crazy - by now I respect you. Even pink striped socks can't hide forever that you have brains & soul.
Okay? I'm not against it...


This second post has a very, very sweet sentiment. Thank you stranger. It put a giant smile on my face.
 

loopytheone

Staff member
Administrator
Global Moderator
Joined
Dec 14, 2012
Messages
4,351
Location
England
loopy: Please grow up real fast before your next post! Teen reality often has little to do with the real world.
Eh? You do realise that I am 24, a full grown adult with more qualifications than you can shake a stick at who is in the process of getting married and emigrating? I have no idea what on earth you are talking about. :confused:
 

Goreki

Fairy tales and Woe
Joined
Oct 4, 2005
Messages
987
Location
,
Eh? You do realise that I am 24, a full grown adult with more qualifications than you can shake a stick at who is in the process of getting married and emigrating? I have no idea what on earth you are talking about. :confused:
Ooh! Where are you emigrating? Exciting!
 
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